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As a former mechanic/business owner (now retired) have seen many of the OP types that want their repairs done at below the comparable Trade rates of the industry.
We had the overhead expenses thrown our way by the City/State/EPA along with the usual small costs of operation.
Do not know the OP education/work experience and what he deems a fair wage for his expertise in his trade ability.
Would almost guarantee he does not work for MINIMUM WAGE.
When I can diagnose and repair a problem that a Dealer failed to repair then I deserve my reasonable shop hourly rate even if it just took me 1/2 hr to do the repair.
A surgeon does a Surgery in 1-1/2 hrs time and another can do the procedure in 1 hr flat. Does that mean he should get paid LESS because the time during Surgery was less?........don't think so.
I had refused to do some jobs for less money when working as I knew my knowledge/experience demanded top dollar even when I never charged the top dollar shop rates in the city.
I was a slow learner from the Old School (learned from my mechanic dad) and like him gave a free diagnosis to many hopeful future customers that had their work done at some other shop for less money since some of the diagnosis was already done.
This experience was obvious later down the road when the car came in and I saw that work had been done (not by me).
We can tell when something was done by another mechanic as the results/evidence is obvious.
As for installing a customers own parts.....................that would bed a THREAD in itself.
I actually have 2 questions here.
Regarding: 1999 Mazda 626 4 cylinder. Auto trans. Approx 150,000 miles.
1.
One of my cars had an issue where I couldn't keep it running last week. I had it towed to what I would consider a high end non dealership auto repair shop. They charge $90 an hour for work/repairs. I believe some places charge $60 an hour, and dealerships charge $120 an hour ?
It took them 1.5 hours to diagnose the issue. they ended up doing a smoke test to find the vacuum leak.
The issue was actually quite minor (a vacuum leak). They replaced an air line, and I am at $205.00
I googled this issue, and I knew ahead of time the issue may be a vacuum leak, but, due to health reasons, I wasnt about to turn wrenches on spark plugs, etc until I figured out the problem.
Now the car runs well, and the issue is fixed.
Is it standard to pay an auto shop at $90 an hour just to diagnose the issue ? Should it take 1.5 hours to find a vacuum leak ? I do understand that I am at their mercy, but I am questioning their integrity a bit here.
2. same car, same auto shop;
Also, this brings me to my second issue. They recommended that I replace the axles (3) because the axle boots are cracked, damaged, and in one case, completely missing. I googled axle boots, and one website recommends that the boots themselves can be replaced, and I shouldn't have to replace the entire axles just because the boot is worn, damaged, etc.
I am normally quite a do-it-youselfer, but health issues is preventing me from serious car repairs for another 6 months or so. But, I think replacing axle boots is something I COULD do. Does anyone with mechanical knowledge know whether or not replacing only the boots vs the axle is an issue here ? I don't HAVE to replace the axle, just because the axle boot is damaged, do I ?
Yes.
I was passin' thru tennessee one day and the headlamps and dash lamps went dim, and the voltmeter dropped to just under 12.
I luckily found a GM dealer not far from the interstate.
I pulled up to their front gate at 3 a.m., and left the van running, afraid to shut it down.
The dealer opened up, I drove it to the welcome area, signed a paper and told the service manager to replace the alternator.
An hour later, my van was finished on the ready line.
I went to the service managers desk to see how much I owed.
$250.00 !!!!???
It was a wth moment for me.
100 for diagnosis, 150 P&L.
I squawked, and said to the SM, I told you to replace the alternator, and he said they needed to diagnose the problem first. I told him I diagnosed it for them. He claimed my diagnosis wasn't valid or acceptable by the dealership.
I paid and went on my way.
some shops will charge a diagnosis fee and either refund or partially refund it when you have the work done at their shop. but not all.
As a former mechanic/business owner (now retired) have seen many of the OP types that want their repairs done at below the comparable Trade rates of the industry.
We had the overhead expenses thrown our way by the City/State/EPA along with the usual small costs of operation.
Do not know the OP education/work experience and what he deems a fair wage for his expertise in his trade ability.
Would almost guarantee he does not work for MINIMUM WAGE.
When I can diagnose and repair a problem that a Dealer failed to repair then I deserve my reasonable shop hourly rate even if it just took me 1/2 hr to do the repair.
A surgeon does a Surgery in 1-1/2 hrs time and another can do the procedure in 1 hr flat. Does that mean he should get paid LESS because the time during Surgery was less?........don't think so.
I had refused to do some jobs for less money when working as I knew my knowledge/experience demanded top dollar even when I never charged the top dollar shop rates in the city.
I was a slow learner from the Old School (learned from my mechanic dad) and like him gave a free diagnosis to many hopeful future customers that had their work done at some other shop for less money since some of the diagnosis was already done.
This experience was obvious later down the road when the car came in and I saw that work had been done (not by me).
We can tell when something was done by another mechanic as the results/evidence is obvious.
As for installing a customers own parts.....................that would bed a THREAD in itself.
Honestly, from the way you wrote this post, you were a shop owner I would be comfortable taking my car to if I had to. I understand YOUR viewpoint. But the Mac, well, he seems to have a different attitude about it. It is clear in the manner in which each of you have written your responses.
About 7 years ago, I had an auto shop do a few repairs on a car I had that was a little bit older at the time. For all 3 repairs he made, (which were all minor), he never charged dignostic fees. And he fixed it up quick and efficient each time. I have since moved, and his shop is no longer available to me. Such is life.
I don't have a problem with mechanics, or auto repair shops. It is a business like everything else. I really respected the place I mentioned from 7 years ago, and THAT was a place I would have taken my car to for ANY upgrade/repair. Because I knew I could trust that shop.
edit: Ok, i was wrong, one of the three times he charged me $50 to diagnose an issue. I understood, as he had to isolate a wiring problem associated with the fuel system. I believe the wiring in the back of the car by the fuel pump had aged enough to where it freyed, and had to be re-wired. But, I think even still, the whole job cost me under $200, including the tow.
I Don't expect something for nothing.
Last edited by AverageGuy2006; 11-28-2012 at 10:58 AM..
Honestly, from the way you wrote this post, you were a shop owner I would be comfortable taking my car to if I had to. I understand YOUR viewpoint. But the other guy, well, he seems to have a different attitude about it. It is clear in the manner in which each of you have written your responses.
About 7 years ago, I had an auto shop do a few repairs on a car I had that was a little bit older at the time. For all 3 repairs he made, (which were all minor), he never charged dignostic fees. And he fixed it up quick and efficient each time. I have since moved, and his shop is no longer available to me. Such is life.
I don't have a problem with mechanics, or auto repair shops. It is a business like everything else. I really respected the place I mentioned from 7 years ago, and THAT was a place I would have taken my car to for ANY upgrade/repair. Because I knew I could trust that shop.
You just think you are original but you are far from it. I have seen guys like you face to face and you think you know something, when in fact you don't.
Your hunches are quite worthless, and if the shop you trusted knew you did they would be happy, but wonder why.
In no case can you prove neglect..... You just want it right and for cheap...
Another guy like you came to me and have a rear axle leak on a GM product. I gave him a quote for parts and labor, and he became angry, stormed off and left.
Next day he came back to mock me, and told me about the most ridiculous charge he had to pay for serious cheap. I knew better than that...
2 Days later he was back and that leak wasn't a little seep anymore.
He begged me to look and so I did and when I saw big scars a chisel made on the flange of that axle I knew not even God could fix that and now this fool needed a new axle.... This is the entire housing and gear sets with in...
I didn't even want that job in the first place and so i told him NO.... never again....
It isn't you, it is your attitude. You might not like it, and or how I say it, but the reality is I am doing you a favor. Sometimes a guy will wake up when you pass a cup of coffee by his nose and others just won't..
That's up to you. I don't care if you put me on ignore....... That's up to you too.
So far I have never done that on any site to anyone ever...
In 28 years I lost 10 customers I told to never come back. About 7 of them wrote bad checks one time too many, or came after they were called being told their car was done, but after hours with another set of keys. And 3 were told to get out and stay out and to tell 10 of their best friends to never bother to show up at the shops.
I am not afraid to loose business from people who would be friends to the likes of that.
My time was and still is worth money....... usually that gets figured in the quote. If people then go somewhere else they do and I just lose.
For people who insisted to bring their own parts I would raise the labor... If they brought the wrong parts the job was shoved out the door until the right parts came. I didn't lift a finger to get the right parts to speed up the job. But i didn't throw these people out either.
One, the worst bugged me so much on a day to day basis hearing noises and the like I played a few jokes on him stealing his gas in the dark of night, putting that gas and MORE back in the car where he would come in a brag about his car getting 100 miles to the gallon........
I stuffed a whistle up his tail pipes that sounded like a whole flock of crows and called the next shop where I knew this customer go to get me my toy whistle back, which they did... Did that whole thing again...
Everyone hearing it would grin, but would tell the customer they heard Nothing........
Finally that guy drove me over my edge and I spent the waste oil on money for beer, corn on the cob clams and lobster, all raw, needing to be cook and called all my biker friends and had them bring their gals and the whole shop too and we met at the customers Fancysmanchy Restaurant, and there we pushed table and chairs to make one table, with other customer watching nervously That old black leather thing)
And I gave the waitress 50 bucks and asked for a church key, and iced mugs.... I gave her a wink and told her that after we were done she had another 50 coming.
We gave her the bags of corn, clams and lobsters.... I heard rather a lot of yelling out back in the kitchen and the Owner, my customer came rattling thru the kitchen doors stammering people DON'T bring their own food into a restaurant and ask to have it cooked!
He was looking all around and didn't recognize me right off...... Oh But when he did that look was priceless.....
I might not throw you out, but I might still do something in line like this to you if i ever had the chance......
I didnt read your post Mac. Again, you are taking this ALL to personnal. I read a thread about purchasing a new car a bit ago. 'Someone' mentioned... "It's only money".... But when I try to get value for MY dollar, you have a problem with it. hmmmm
You have clearly written that you enjoy returning your idea of 'justice' to people who you see fit.
This is why I work on my car most of the time.
I actually have 2 questions here.
Regarding: 1999 Mazda 626 4 cylinder. Auto trans. Approx 150,000 miles.
1.
One of my cars had an issue where I couldn't keep it running last week. I had it towed to what I would consider a high end non dealership auto repair shop. They charge $90 an hour for work/repairs. I believe some places charge $60 an hour, and dealerships charge $120 an hour ?
It took them 1.5 hours to diagnose the issue. they ended up doing a smoke test to find the vacuum leak.
The issue was actually quite minor (a vacuum leak). They replaced an air line, and I am at $205.00
I googled this issue, and I knew ahead of time the issue may be a vacuum leak, but, due to health reasons, I wasnt about to turn wrenches on spark plugs, etc until I figured out the problem.
Now the car runs well, and the issue is fixed.
Is it standard to pay an auto shop at $90 an hour just to diagnose the issue ? Should it take 1.5 hours to find a vacuum leak ? I do understand that I am at their mercy, but I am questioning their integrity a bit here.
2. same car, same auto shop;
Also, this brings me to my second issue. They recommended that I replace the axles (3) because the axle boots are cracked, damaged, and in one case, completely missing. I googled axle boots, and one website recommends that the boots themselves can be replaced, and I shouldn't have to replace the entire axles just because the boot is worn, damaged, etc.
I am normally quite a do-it-youselfer, but health issues is preventing me from serious car repairs for another 6 months or so. But, I think replacing axle boots is something I COULD do. Does anyone with mechanical knowledge know whether or not replacing only the boots vs the axle is an issue here ? I don't HAVE to replace the axle, just because the axle boot is damaged, do I ?
1. Different shops charge different rates, and they vary in the way they charge. $90 per shop hour is not unreasonable. Also, it can be hellaciously difficult to find some vacuum leaks - depending on where they are located. $200 sounds like it might be a touch high, but it's certainly not out of the ballpark.
2. If your CV Boots are shot (and/or missing) you need new front axles. Period. Most of the grease is gone, and there's no way there's not grit in the joints. You probably don't need to rush into it, because they're already shot and aren't going to fall off immediately. There are two CV Boots on each half-axle. There's no point in replacing any of the boots. Two new front axles is probably going to run you in the neighborhood of $500. Like I said, if you want to save up for a couple months, you can probably do that.
Final resolution as follows, being completely honest:
Brand new parts consisting of 2 front axles: $81.XX TOTAL
Installation of 2 front axles WITH oil change: $171.XX Total
Everything parts and labor total up to be $252.XX
I appreciate the feedback regarding my experience/ questions on this thread.
Here is how I ended up with my $252.XX total (compared to initial quote of $600 from shop in OP) 2 steps insued:
Step 1: Parts
Driving to work this week I noticed a clicking type noise coming from the drivers side suspension of my vehicle. Thanks to the warning of my axle boots from the shop in the OP, I assumed it was time to replace my axles. Over the months I had priced out front axles online a little bit, and I expected to pay about $60.00 per axle for the front replacements. Thanks to one of my friends, just this week he somehow found an online coupon for the ligitimate auto parts store based off of price per part. This awesome coupon gave me $20.00 off EACH axle. I am thinking, wow, nice easy way to save $40.00. Brand new (not remanufactured) New front axles cost: $37.99 each, plus tax. I even asked the guy at the desk from the store that I picked the axles up at whether or not these relacement parts had tolerance issues, or poor fitting issues due to them not being OEM remanfactured. He said no. Mind you, this axles were from a reputable auto parts chain store. I have a normal receipt and everything. Warranty, all that jazz included. (read: NOT junk parts)
Step 2: Labor
In the time since the OP, I have come to trust a shop that does car repair work, exhaust, brakes, etc. This is a chain of reputable Auto repair facilities in a large metropolitan area. Mind you, in a smaller more rural area, I might not have been able to get the pricing I received. I called up 3 places that are quote local to me. One place was basically a tire shop, but they said they would do the work for $75.00 per axle. I was a little hesitant to use the tire shop, but the price was amazing. Then I called local established auto repair shop. He quoted me $225.00 for install. He said it was 2.5 hour job, so I assume $90.00 an hour. Per previous posts on this thread, I understand $90.00 is quite acceptable, and I almost took my car there, as I liked the location, and I have seen the shop. It's clean, nice, etc. Then, I called a local-to-me version of the shop I have come to trust for some repair work. They quoted me at $80.00 per axle, and they were 6 miles away. They had no problem installing parts I supplied, as no one else had an issue with that either. I walked out paying $170.00 for the axle work, and the oil change ($13.99 for the oil change). This repair shop said that replacing the rear axle on the vehicle was not even a consideration, as it was absolutely not required. I will absolutely take my car to these facilities probably for the rest of my life when repair work is needed. I will also recommend this autoshop as the hands down go to place for any repair work, especially nuts and bolts type repairs.
So in all, I saved myself just under $350.00 for spending the time and energy to purchase my own parts, and price shop around to different repair shops, especially when compared to the $600.00 quote that was recommended by the shop from my OP.
Would paying the $600.00 been easier ? Yes
Did I take a chance that my axles could break on my driving down the highway doing 60 MPH ? Yes, but I am familiar enough with cars to be able to determine when something is wrong, and I was able to avoid dealing with a mechanical failure while I was driving.
I just wanted to follow up with my experience on addressing a car repair issue that some people may have paid (or recommended to charge) $600.00, for a repair that ended up costing me about $252.XX
Thanks again for all the people who posted, as I really did enjoy learning about axles, and axle boots, and what is considered good practice regarding repair work, and pricing.
WOW!!!!!!! $170.00 Labor just to install YOUR PARTS.
Wonder where the shop gets his money to pay the RENT....for his tools....City/State License/Hazard fees/ Workmans Comp etc.
When in business I had all those expences plus a Waste Oil Fee to haul away the Hazard Oil as they call it.
Bound to be a few responses.......I'm waiting.
I am assuming their rates are more around $60.00 an hour. There were kinda busy, with no lack in business. It was a decent size shop, and it was full most of the 3 hours I spent there. I didn't even haggle, I figured $80.00 an axle was cheap enough, and I wasn't going to ask them to drop more from there. I actually would have paid the $225 and would have been satified. But when I called up the third place and simly asked for a price, I obviously could not pass up $80.00 per axle.
Price shopping is huge around here. There is enough competition around here in which shops can survive on $60.00 an hour.
If the boots are cracked/missing, it means that the bearings have been running dry. The boots keep the bearings lubricated. If you look under the fender wells, you'll probably see alot of black grease. You probably also get loud clunking/clicking noises when you make slow, sharp turns. Each rebuilt shaft is about $200. If the bearings are still ok, you can repack the bearing and use a repair boot.
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