Non-Hybrid Compacts Getting 45 MPG HWY by 2015? (vehicle, motorcycles, spark plugs, fuel)

[RunTheDistance476]

What do you guys think? Do you think we will see an EPA-estimated 45 mpg car that is a non-hybrid by the 2015 model year?

[GarageLogic]

We already have them. Volkswagen has been making them since the mid-70s.

[RunTheDistance476]

Originally Posted by GarageLogic

We already have them. Volkswagen has been making them since the mid-70s.

I mean a car that is typical (aka non-diesel) and VW's best TDI gets only 43...but the gas is also 10% more.

[choo_choo_train_lol]

92-95 Honda Civic VX gets over 50mpg highway according to EPA rating I think? I wonder why that hasn't been recreated. Too light for proper safety rating maybe? It's really cool how fuel efficiency in cars has been improving a lot in the last few years.

[RunTheDistance476]

Originally Posted by choo_choo_train_lol

92-95 Honda Civic VX gets over 50mpg highway according to EPA rating I think? I wonder why that hasn't been recreated. Too light for proper safety rating maybe? It's really cool how fuel efficiency in cars has been improving a lot in the last few years.

Yeah, but unfortunately, gas has really taken away any excitement. +1 or 2 mpg isn't enough for the next year or two. With gas approaching $4.00 (or more in many areas), either the mpgs need to hit 50 within the next 5 years or electric cars need to become affordable and with long range options.

[tickyul]

There is a TON of things they could do to a ICE vehicle to make it get 50MPG...easily.

But when it comes down to it....not enough people are not willing to pay 30K and up for a small compact that gets, just because it gets 50MPG+.

[RunTheDistance476]

Originally Posted by tickyul

There is a TON of things they could do to a ICE vehicle to make it get 50MPG...easily.

But when it comes down to it....not enough people are not willing to pay 30K and up for a small compact that gets, just because it gets 50MPG+.

Well no... I mean, it has to make sense. If the initial cost is $15k, Im good with 25-30 mpg life for the vehicle. if the initial cost is $25k, it doesnt make much sense (thats 10 years of not saving gas at all).

[LRPct]

Originally Posted by choo_choo_train_lol

92-95 Honda Civic VX gets over 50mpg highway according to EPA rating I think? I wonder why that hasn't been recreated. Too light for proper safety rating maybe? It's really cool how fuel efficiency in cars has been improving a lot in the last few years.

Even if it was the EPA testing was different back then and mileages were higher than today. Who has an on and off ramp directly to and from their destinations anyway. Even those few regular gas cars that can approach impressive hwy MPG, none of them are very impressive for combined mileage compared to modestly priced hybrids, some also having a bunch more power and comfort than the econoboxes.

[MountainGuy74]

Here is the biggest irony....

Those of us that are affected by fuel prices, the ones that cringe when the prices rise, are the least likely to afford the hybrids and other compact fuel efficient vehicles. I know I could never afford a 25K+ hybrid of electric vehicle even though it would benefit me the most because fuel prices do affect my life.

On the other hand, lets say they make a good electric car that is far superior to anything that uses fuel. No more need to stop at a gas station ever again. Prices can reach $10 a gallon and it wouldn't affect me at all. That type of car would be pretty pricey no doubt. Who could afford such a car? Higher income folks. The irony is that although they could easily afford a $40K+ car the price of gas doesn't really affect them that much anyway because they have the funds to buy it no matter what the price may be.

It sucks to be poor...

[StealthRabbit]

Originally Posted by wlw2009

I mean a car that is typical (aka non-diesel) and VW's best TDI gets only 43...but the gas is also 10% more.

Ouch, your replies don't sound too 'objective'. (but being a fellow WA resident, I fully understand your contention )

Yes... I've been getting 50 mpg since 1976, and VERY conventionally... no Dinosaurs requiredie,diesel has been around for over 100 yrs, and was DESIGNED to run veggies oil. Most of the time my fuel cost me ZERO. (I have 34 Diesel VW's NONE cost me over $1800, most under $300.)

I can burn WASTE engine oil, or Jet A, or heating oil, or palm oil, or veggie oil, home brew Bio-D, and yes EVEN dino Diesel .

My latest TDI that I created last spring (97 B4V Wagon) has been getting 53.5 COMBINED mileage (I track it VERY closely). I just dropped from 55.5 to 53.5, due to a Friday afternoon trip in Portland TRAFFIC and several construction zones. Average speed over last 1500 miles is 28mph (thus combined mileage, not Highway only). I get 58.5MPG EZ on the highway, and I have a 25 gal tank (~1300 mile range) and a car weighing 3800# (2000# more than my Rabbits).

RE: GAS (ick) cars... There are MANY that have been near 50 mpg during the last 30 yrs. It is completely reasonable to expect 50 MPG in 2015. (Would be EZ'r without CARB. )

I remember the mileage contests we were having in the late 1970's. My BIL got 50mpg in his Saab Sonnet and he loved to tease my Rabbit performance (all 52 hp of it...) But... His Saab is MANY yrs dead, and my many VW's are clattering along. (over 3 million fleet miles). He has been trying to beat me through MANY Honda's, but recently he bought 2 TDI's and added Grease-kits. He gets as much FREE veggie oil as he wants from a commercial veggie hauler who has to 100% clean tank trucks between loads.

I like my vintage motorcycles that get 80 - 100 mpg (1970's)

My company had 'plug-in' parking for full electric cars in the 1970's. Us engineers made many different models of full electric cars as 'projects'. My favorite was an MGB-GT. One guy made a full electric from a Simca (which I thought was a waste, b'cuz I got nearly 50 mpg from my stock Simca's. (I had 3). Even my English Ford Anglia (1959) got well over 30 mpg. With fuel injection and computerized timing features combined with combustion modeling. Economy has come a long way in spite of EPA torpedoing most advances in efficient technology.

BTW my Diesels NEVER use GAS

For me... I will stick with diesel technology and work for Algae feedstock (thanks to a BIG boost from our Seattle venture capital guy.)

I LUV the robust service life of Diesel (up to 1 million miles+ in my Cummins, and 500k miles+ EZ in VW,) and the ULTRA low maint costs.
($7 timing belt every 100k, and fresh filters 1/yr ($4 ea)
NO spark Plugs, NO high power wires, no Ethanol issues, no in-tank fuel pumps, no Catalytic Convertor (when running on alternative fuel), no muffler required (when with turbo).

BTW. You can find these things (VW Diesels) FREE in your neighbor's brier patch! I have gotten several that way and have 3 in my 'sights' at the moment.

Seattle has a very strong Bio-diesel group that meets monthly at Phinney.