I Sell Cars for a Living at a Big Dealership - Ask Me Anything (wagon, Dodge)
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What about when it is higher? Do you want to ignore all those times when people pay more than MSRP because it doesn't fit your narrative?
That's the same principle (the market) working in the opposite direction (demand/scarcity drive up the price), so of course it fits my narrative. My narrative is the very fundamentals of economics. I didn't invent it, I just subscribe to it. I would guess that it only applies to high end or limited production models though. I worked for a guy who bought the first 2014 Corvette delivered to NJ from F.C. Kerbeck in Atlantic City (they specialize in Corvettes) simply because he wanted to be the first to have it. I'm sure he paid way over MSRP, but again, that's far from a normal case.
What type of vehicles are these buyers paying sticker for? Rare, high performance, or specialty models I hope lol.
Okay, so? Some people want to talk about rare, high performance, specialty electric cars so badly as the standard for which all manufacturers should operate so that seems fair to me.
That's the same principle (the market) working in the opposite direction (demand/scarcity drive up the price), so of course it fits my narrative. My narrative is the very fundamentals of economics. I didn't invent it, I just subscribe to it. I would guess that it only applies to high end or limited production models though. I worked for a guy who bought the first 2014 Corvette delivered to NJ from F.C. Kerbeck in Atlantic City (they specialize in Corvettes) simply because he wanted to be the first to have it. I'm sure he paid way over MSRP, but again, that's far from a normal case.
Exactly. Teslas are "far from a normal case." So why worry about them so much? Especially since you haven't bought one.
Sigh. Apple controls the pricing at those stores. Walmart might get a little ballsy and price something at 699.70 instead of 699.99, but that's it. Apple owns all their Apple stores. True statement. I did not say that you could only buy their product at an Apple store. But you will pay Apple designated pricing. If you don't they yank all your inventory if they can or claim that any chump that buys its product from you has a voided warranty and no tech support. Sounds nice and friendly huh? What if Toyota did that? All you that paid less than MSRP for a Camry have a voided warranty! Ha ha, yeah right.
"Online sales" would be the same as "factory direct sales." I can buy "online" through a dealer right now and pay less than MSRP if they accept my offer. Why is that bad?
So what about all of those cars that sell for much less than MSRP that are a normal case?
That the dealer's choice when working with customers or responding to market forces. Why would you want that to go away or be hindered by factory set pricing?
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Originally Posted by IShootNikon
I'm not the one crying about collusion
I'm not crying about anything, sport. I just call it what it is. Unless all dealers become factory outlets (which isn't going to happen) a group or region of dealers can't "agree" to set pricing. Google "car dealer price collusion" and get your read on how the FTC will break it off in 'em if they think a group of dealers are doing that.
This has been pointed out many times in this thread. The dealership apologists simply dismiss this as an anomaly and get very angry when it's brought up. Then they cite Saturn's failure at no haggle pricing. I would argue that it failed because they were still using the dealership model and because everyone else was using the "lots of haggle pricing" model.
Tesla is a boutique manufacturer that doesn't sell cars in every state and only makes a very small number of cars on an annual basis. Most every Tesla you see cost at or close to $100,000 or more. Their business model is not applicable to the general purchase of a car by most people.
That the dealer's choice when working with customers or responding to market forces. Why would you want that to go away or be hindered by factory set pricing?
If the dealers were removed from the equation and the cars were just sold at factory outlet stores the manufacturers would have to respond to market forces and price accordingly. Instead of the consumer having to cajole the dealer into selling the vehicle at market price, the market would dictate the price the vehicle. Manufacturers who set their price too high would be stuck with inventory that wouldn't be sold until the price was lowered to a price the market would bear. Again, it's hard to believe that high school level economics is escaping people on this thread.
If the dealers were removed from the equation and the cars were just sold at factory outlet stores the manufacturers would have to respond to market forces and price accordingly. Instead of the consumer having to cajole the dealer into selling the vehicle at market price, the market would dictate the price the vehicle. Manufacturers who set their price too high would be stuck with inventory that wouldn't be sold until the price was lowered to a price the market would bear. Again, it's hard to believe that high school level economics is escaping people on this thread.
Personal attacks are signs of a weak argument...so you know.
Who works at these so called "factory outlet stores?" Is it just a kiosk with robots? Or do they have employees? Do all they operate the same in all 50 states? Do all 50 states have the same laws? Emissions? Taxes? Demand? Do they give away land and buildings or does that cost money?
After they take over all the dealers, and become the dealers they will end up operating like the dealers. So what your saying is just what I've always been saying - your solution is to mirror the setup we already have. The car manufacturers introduce rebates, special APRs and low lease factors to push old inventory.
If the dealers were removed from the equation and the cars were just sold at factory outlet stores the manufacturers would have to respond to market forces and price accordingly. Instead of the consumer having to cajole the dealer into selling the vehicle at market price, the market would dictate the price the vehicle. Manufacturers who set their price too high would be stuck with inventory that wouldn't be sold until the price was lowered to a price the market would bear.
This is how it works now. That's why manufacturers issue rebates and other incentives to move inventory.
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Again, it's hard to believe that high school level economics is escaping people on this thread.
Yes. Yes, it is.
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That's the same principle (the market) working in the opposite direction (demand/scarcity drive up the price), so of course it fits my narrative. My narrative is the very fundamentals of economics. I didn't invent it, I just subscribe to it. I would guess that it only applies to high end or limited production models though. I worked for a guy who bought the first 2014 Corvette delivered to NJ from F.C. Kerbeck in Atlantic City (they specialize in Corvettes) simply because he wanted to be the first to have it. I'm sure he paid way over MSRP, but again, that's far from a normal case.
