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Vehicles today easily surpass 200,000 miles, without having been meticulously cared for.
Maybe you could occasionally find the rare unicorn of a vehicle that had an engine with over 200,000 miles but as you stated the rest of it was crap.
Today's vehicle are more durable overall - materials, fit, finish, and engines.
The transmissions will go due to aggressive acceleration by their owners before the engine does.. the engines should last forever assuming they don't do stupid stuff like use paper gaskets like Jeep liked to do in the 2000's...
My 15 year old grand am has 180,000 miles on the original engine, transmission, alternator, radiator, etc... only the fuel pump has been replaced, and a fuel pressure regulator and a couple of minor items. I never was hard on the gas pedal so the transmission didn't get heavy abuse or anything. I'm more of a hyper-miler who goes 5 above the speed limit when traffic lets me. I've been looking at getting a used G6 or Vibe with low miles because they are pretty rock solid vehicles in the 2009 and 2010 model year. Had one ready to buy and someone snatched it away 12 hours before my craigslist meetup.. bastards.
I went from a 2000 Jeep Cherokee to a 2016 Mazda CX-5, begrudgingly. In those 16 years I was away from car buying (and the experience buying the mazda at the dealership was just as petty and scummy as I knew it was going to be) the manufacturers apparently placed a premium on 6 cylinder engines, to the point where the 6 banger model greatly outpaced inflation. So I had to inflation adjusted downgrade the amount of engine torque and towing capacity available to me in 2016 on the glorified station wagons I buy, on a dollar for dollar basis.
Apples-Oranges...You compare a Jeep Cherokee to a Mazda CX5...
Quote:
Originally Posted by hindsight2020
Furthermore, electrics-laden vehicles is a liability to my operating mentality of driving a vehicle 220K or 15 years, and so a vehicle without electric windows was straight up not available on the market. I had to buy-in into a car that will most likely become uneconomic to chase down the electrics maintenance rabbit hole (misc electrical wiring failures). The only reason I had to decommission the Cherokee was precisely because the electrics were failing with great frequency, to the point where signal and brake lighting was failing randomly and couldn't pass inspection. Same for airbag sensor lights which are also required to be out in order to pass. Other than that, the engine tranny and drive would still get me to/from. I expect the mazda, with all the extra electrics, to be even more cantankerous in post 7th year operation. This in effect, lowers the ownership length on the replacement vehicle compared to the former, making it even more expensive on an inflation-adjusted basis.
So no, things aren't anywhere near one-for-one on the economics front, just because the new car has more traction control and better crumple zones than the former. This is still a market of forced obsolescence by vehicles purposely designed to self-implode and make it uneconomical to repair/maintain past the 7th year of operation. I don't appreciate that level of contempt for the consumer, regardless of technology. I should have the choice to downgrade the density of electrics in the vehicle to ensure the vehicle will last me 15 years, but the market doesn't offer me that option. Fleet vehicle options don't exist for CUVs (modern station wagons) the way they do for pickup trucks. Maybe a fleet level pickup truck would be a useful purchase for me, something I could ride past 15 years.
It isn't about contempt for the consumer, its about making vehicles that the consumer wants to buy, and can be sold profitably.
You seem to ignore the obvious realities that modern cars last longer. Its that simple. They didn't use to make a 6th digit on the odometer...
Can power windows fail? Sure, but I've gone 150K plus without replacing them and they were working fine when I was done with the vehicle...Can Electrics fail and cause problems? Sure, but that isn't new either; Cars have been having electric problems since they put headlights and turn signals on them, but most don't.
I don't understand why more people don't buy newer used cars. You save 50% on the price and basically have a brand new car. If it has 40k miles on it it's probably not a lemon either.
Because most people don't want to chance ending up with someone else's lemon.
That's because you're smart like me...I think you have to be crazy to pay the showroom price for something brand new. It loses like 4k in value, the second you drive it off the lot.
Sure. My old Citation went 323k before I gave it away, and on the new car side, the Cruzes and Volts seem to be quite durable. And FWD impalas seemed to have been doing OK in taxi fleets nationwide (after they ran their course in police fleets).
The closest one I saw was my 1994 Saturn SL1 with 350,000+ miles on it, when it was sold in 2010.
Sometimes, I miss that car.
Congrats. You were a good owner.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiffer E38
Sure. My old Citation went 323k before I gave it away, and on the new car side, the Cruzes and Volts seem to be quite durable. And FWD impalas seemed to have been doing OK in taxi fleets nationwide (after they ran their course in police fleets).
I don't understand why more people don't buy newer used cars. You save 50% on the price and basically have a brand new car. If it has 40k miles on it it's probably not a lemon either.
From what I'm seeing in my area, particularly trucks hold their value very well. A 2-4 year old rig with 40k miles still goes for a lot of money. If it's a diesel, at 200k miles they are still a good big of coin (unless it's a 6.0 Ford of course).
Prices HAVE gotten out of hand. While newer vehicles have more features and "fluff", they still are about the same size, perform the same function and offer similar comfort to 40 years ago. AC, automatic transmissions, power brakes and windows aren't exactly anything new. Most other products have gone down in price dramatically or offer a whole lot more. My first TV in '85 was a 27" for $700...much better LCD/LED ones are what, $150 now? My first computer was a 128k Mac in '84...for about $2600. 1000x the performance today runs what, $200? Yet cars and especially trucks perform exactly the same function as 40 years ago and cost many times as much. The industry has some serious work to do to offer decent value. Hate to say it, but I doubt I'll ever own a new car or truck again. Too much unnecessary crap, especially what is being mandated by the idiots in DC. Fortunately, new motorcycles are a fraction of the costs of most new cars or trucks and are much more fun to operate..weather permitting of course.
Not a 65, but my 89 Chevy PU had 225k on it when I sold it, never had the engine or transmission opened up, still got 2500 miles or more on a quart of oil. Parts were cheap, made cross country runs at max GVW, worked the heck out of it on country roads, yanking/skidding logs, lots of, if not abuse, hard work. Thing was bulletproof. I don't think I put a total of $1000 in parts into in in the 15 or so years I had it, not counting tires. These days, one little fix will cost that much. I replaced a water pump on that 350 Chev...$18 at NAPA, changed it in 1/2 hour in their parking lot. Exactly what does it cost to have one changed on any new 1/2 ton truck?
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