Ticket for Holding Phone While Driving (air bag, shops, damage, title)

[galaxyhi]

Originally Posted by Lux Hauler

You people are outrageous. I have no idea what has gotten into some of you.. the guy was selecting a song on his iPod and virtually everyone here wants to nail him to a cross. The only thing that is clear here is that most of you are incapable of understanding the statute in question, picking out pieces to support your wild conclusions.

Well, then, you MUST Think it perfectly OK for a person to drive drunk.

The law is clear, the OP broke the law, and IN MY state {NY} {where the OP is} that is an offense.

IN NY, So is driving drunk or under the influence of OTC OR prescription medications that adversely affect a persons ability to drive.

That's the law.

If you don't like it, don't live in NY state.

No cross needed.

[Electrician4you]

Originally Posted by LeagleEagleDFW

How on earth does that relate in any way to what I said? I was pointing out that the statute is continually being misread by almost everyone in this thread.

It reads like you were stating since lisening/using your phone to play music wasn't specifically listed in the statute it wasn't applicable. It's the use of the phone which normally requires you to take your eyes off the road to use it. For example in order for me to access my music manually I have to enter my security code, then swipe or hit the music icon. Then start scrolling to find the song I want then hit play. That's a lot of taking my eyes off the road. Most phones have a similar sequence.

When using Bluetooth my phone automatically connects to my car and all I need to do is hit the command button n the radio (which is in my line of sight) and then through my radio I can command my phone to play music, call people, read texts etc. I don't respond to texts when I drive. Everyone who knows me knows when I don't answer texts means I'm driving.

Originally Posted by halberto9

There is a big difference between playing music already stored on your phone and composing text messages. Give the guy a break, not all of us drive vehicles with steering wheel controls or bluetooth connectivity. My 2008 Chevy truck (not THAT old) has no wheel controls other than cruise and no bluetooth. Remember, GM was promoting OnStar for many years, so you had to reach for a tiny button on the mirror and of course there was no bluetooth.

As an aside question, I was wondering, since cell phones and hands free laws have been around a lot longer than bluetooth and wheel controls in autos, how did drivers obey the letter of the law back in those days?

Sure a bit of a difference. texting is even worse. I see Norns all the time drving slow. You know exactly what they are doing. And when you get next to them they think they are clever and the phone is down low by the shifter. There were a few who were holding it at eye level. I guess that was their way of watching the road and reading texts at the same time But accessing your phone requires you to look at the phone thus taking your eyes off the road. My truck is WAY older than yours and I was able to get a stereo that does all those things. It even had a remote control I could bolt to the steering wheel to get steering wheel controls. I purchased this stereo specifically because of the law change. My truck didn't come with any connectivity either.

The thing is that OP got popped. He was using his phone when driving. Like I stated before if he feels he was right go to court and fight it.

[dmarie123]

Originally Posted by jbgusa

For everyone above how is it different from changing the stations on a radio dial to get a traffic report?

Because it is ILLEGAL and using the radio you do it by touch and feel, when using the phone it's by sight.

[oceangaia]

Originally Posted by headingtoDenver

If you do take it to court, be sure you print out your phone records so you can prove that you did not send or receive any texts during the time of the incident.

That's not only impractical but it proves nothing. These days there are so many ways to send messages and your phone carrier does not track or make available precise data traffic. One could message with not only SMS but Whatsapp, Messenger, Kik, Imessage, or even inside many games.

[oceangaia]

Originally Posted by PJA

So he's communicating with the song by listening to it? Listening is only a form of communication if you are actually communicating with someone.

So reading a text or email isn't communicating so long as you don't reply?

[LeagleEagleDFW]

Originally Posted by Mac_Donalds

Just another example of your extreme level of immaturity. Deliberately choosing to not understand what I, and every other person in this thread has been saying to you, so as to play the role of the over-dramatic hysteric. Anyways, I'm done with this thread. As everyone else here has tried to tell you, we don't want you on the road, at all. Not sure how old you are, but certainly not mature enough to be trusted with a driver's license. Hope you gain some maturity before you kill someone. That's real, btw. The guy across the street from me killed someone. Reminds me off you. Used to drink and drive all the time. People would warn him, and warn him and warn him. One day he's in the paper; killed a pedestrian crossing the street at 2:00 a.m. while he was driving home drunk from the bar. He went to prison, got out and he's not nearly the same loud, obnoxious, wise-cracking idiot. Killing someone, and then spending 3 years in prison, and being on parole for 10 years will knock an obnoxious, self-centered narcissist back down to where they should be. I expect it's going to take something similar to straighten you out. Or, maybe it will be you that dies.

I have no idea where the multitude of personal attacks is coming from. I'm simply reacting to what you said, which is (and I quote) "Stuff the law. We care about getting certain people off the road, for the good of everyone. The law is a means to an end. We'd slash tires and burn their vehicles with gasoline if we could get away with it."

All I have pointed out in this thread, repeatedly, is that people are completely misreading the statute and that the OP broke no laws as the statute is written. Since when did I say anything about it being right or wrong, or driving drunk, or anything of that nature? Pretty sure its you who is the immature hysteric if you think that laws don't matter and the means justifies the end no matter what.

I haven't opined on the morality or my personal feelings on what the OP did at all, because its irrelevant.

[LeagleEagleDFW]

Originally Posted by Electrician4you

It reads like you were stating since lisening/using your phone to play music wasn't specifically listed in the statute it wasn't applicable.

That's exactly what I'm saying. The statute as written does not apply to what the OP stated he was doing. he didn't receive a ticket under a "distracted driving" law.

[LeagleEagleDFW]

Originally Posted by galaxyhi

Actually the OP IS:

the law as the OP provided states clearly:

(b) "Using" shall mean holding a portable electronic device while viewing, taking or transmitting images, playing games, or, for the purpose of present or future communication: performing a command or request to access a world wide web page, composing, sending, reading, viewing, accessing, browsing, transmitting, saving or retrieving e-mail, text messages, instant messages, or other electronic data.

The OP accessed {performing a command or REQUEST TO ACCESS } the "radio" or "stored song history" {OTHER ELECTRONIC DATA}.

So, the OP clearly violated the law.

No, he didn't. I enjoy all the non-lawyers demonstrating why law school may have been more valuable than I thought it was.

"Performing a command" is only relevant if it is for the purposes of present or future communication, and the law as written is an anti-texting law, and doesn't appear to pull in playing music as a form of communication.

[Electrician4you]

Originally Posted by LeagleEagleDFW

That's exactly what I'm saying. The statute as written does not apply to what the OP stated he was doing. he didn't receive a ticket under a "distracted driving" law.

It falls under portable electronic device and other electronic data. As it is electronic it's data and it's coming from a portable electronic device but like I already stated twice if he feels that he as unfairly targeted then he needs to go to court and fight it.




1225-c. Use of mobile telephones.

1. For purposes of this section, the following terms shall mean:

(a) "Mobile telephone" shall mean the device used by subscribers and other users of wireless telephone service to access such service.

(b) "Wireless telephone service" shall mean two-way real time voice telecommunications service that is interconnected to a public switched telephone network and is provided by a commercial mobile radio service, as such term is defined by 47 C.F.R. § 20.3.

(c) "Using" shall mean (i) holding a mobile telephone to, or in the immediate proximity of, the user's ear; and (ii) with respect to a person operating a commercial motor vehicle, holding a mobile telephone to, or in the immediate proximity of, the user's ear, or dialing or answering a mobile telephone by pressing more than a single button, or reaching for a mobile telephone in a manner that requires such person to maneuver so that he or she is no longer in a seated driving position, restrained by a seat belt that is installed in accordance with section 393.93 of title 49 of the code of federal regulations and adjusted in accordance with the vehicle manufacturer's instructions.

(d) "Hand-held mobile telephone" shall mean a mobile telephone with which a user engages in a call using at least one hand.

(e) "Hands-free mobile telephone" shall mean a mobile telephone that has an internal feature or function, or that is equipped with an attachment or addition, whether or not permanently part of such mobile telephone, by which a user engages in a call without the use of either hand, whether or not the use of either hand is necessary to activate, deactivate or initiate a function of such telephone. Provided, however, that for purposes of this section, a mobile telephone used by a person operating a commercial motor vehicle shall not be deemed a "hands-free mobile telephone" when such person dials or answers such mobile telephone by pressing more than a single button.

(f) "Engage in a call" shall mean talking into or listening on a hand-held mobile telephone, but shall not include holding a mobile telephone to activate, deactivate or initiate a function of such telephone.

(g) "Immediate proximity" shall mean that distance as permits the operator of a mobile telephone to hear telecommunications transmitted over such mobile telephone, but shall not require physical contact with such operator's ear.

(h) "Commercial motor vehicle" shall have the same meaning as such term is defined by subdivision four-a of section two of the transportation law.

(i) "Motor carrier" shall have the same meaning as such term is defined by subdivision seventeen of section two of the transportation law.

2. (a) Except as otherwise provided in this section, no person shall operate a motor vehicle upon a public highway while using a mobile telephone to engage in a call while such vehicle is in motion; provided, however, that no person shall operate a commercial motor vehicle while using a mobile telephone to engage in a call on a public highway including while temporarily stationary because of traffic, a traffic control device, or other momentary delays. Provided further, however, that a person shall not be deemed to be operating a commercial motor vehicle while using a mobile telephone to engage in a call on a public highway when such vehicle is stopped at the side of, or off, a public highway in a location where such vehicle is not otherwise prohibited from stopping by law, rule, regulation or any lawful order or direction of a police officer.

(b) An operator of any motor vehicle who holds a mobile telephone to, or in the immediate proximity of, his or her ear while such vehicle is in motion is presumed to be engaging in a call within the meaning of this section; provided, however, that an operator of a commercial motor vehicle who holds a mobile telephone to, or in the immediate proximity of, his or her ear while such vehicle is temporarily stationary because of traffic, a traffic control device, or other momentary delays is also presumed to be engaging in a call within the meaning of this section except that a person operating a commercial motor vehicle while using a mobile telephone to engage in a call when such vehicle is stopped at the side of, or off, a public highway in a location where such vehicle is not otherwise prohibited from stopping by law, rule, regulation or any lawful order or direction of a police officer shall not be presumed to be engaging in a call within the meaning of this section. The presumption established by this subdivision is rebuttable by evidence tending to show that the operator was not engaged in a call.

(c) The provisions of this section shall not be construed as authorizing the seizure or forfeiture of a mobile telephone, unless otherwise provided by law.

(d) No motor carrier shall allow or require its drivers to use a hand-held mobile telephone while operating a commercial motor vehicle as provided in this section.

3. Subdivision two of this section shall not apply to (a) the use of a mobile telephone for the sole purpose of communicating with any of the following regarding an emergency situation: an emergency response operator; a hospital, physician's office or health clinic; an ambulance company or corps; a fire department, district or company; or a police department, (b) any of the following persons while in the performance of their official duties: a police officer or peace officer; a member of a fire department, district or company; or the operator of an authorized emergency vehicle as defined in section one hundred one of this chapter, or (c) the use of a hands-free mobile telephone.

4. A violation of subdivision two of this section shall be a traffic infraction and shall be punishable by a fine of not less than fifty dollars nor more than two hundred dollars upon conviction of a first violation; upon conviction of a second violation, both of which were committed within a period of eighteen months, such violation shall be punished by a fine of not less than fifty dollars nor more than two hundred fifty dollars; upon conviction of a third or subsequent violation, all of which were committed within a period of eighteen months, such violation shall be punished by a fine of not less than fifty dollars nor more than four hundred fifty dollars.

§ 1225-d. Use of portable electronic devices.

1. Except as otherwise provided in this section, no person shall operate a motor vehicle while using any portable electronic device while such vehicle is in motion; provided, however, that no person shall operate a commercial motor vehicle while using any portable electronic device on a public highway including while temporarily stationary because of traffic, a traffic control device, or other momentary delays. Provided further, however, that a person shall not be deemed to be operating a commercial motor vehicle while using a portable electronic device on a public highway when such vehicle is stopped at the side of, or off, a public highway in a location where such vehicle is not otherwise prohibited from stopping by law, rule, regulation or any lawful order or direction of a police officer.

1-a. No motor carrier shall allow or require its drivers to use a portable electronic device while operating a commercial motor vehicle as provided in this section.

2. For the purposes of this section, the following terms shall have the following meanings:

(a) "Portable electronic device" shall mean any hand-held mobile telephone, as defined by subdivision one of section twelve hundred twenty-five-c of this article, personal digital assistant (PDA), handheld device with mobile data access, laptop computer, pager, broadband personal communication device, two-way messaging device, electronic game, or portable computing device, or any other electronic device when used to input, write, send, receive, or read text for present or future communication.

(b) "Using" shall mean holding a portable electronic device while viewing, taking or transmitting images, playing games, or, for the purpose of present or future communication: performing a command or request to access a world wide web page, composing, sending, reading, viewing, accessing, browsing, transmitting, saving or retrieving e-mail, text messages, instant messages, or other electronic data.

(c) "Commercial motor vehicle" shall have the same meaning as such term is defined by subdivision four-a of section two of the transportation law.

(d) "Motor carrier" shall have the same meaning as such term is defined by subdivision seventeen of section two of the transportation law.

3. Subdivision one of this section shall not apply to (a) the use of a portable electronic device for the sole purpose of communicating with any of the following regarding an emergency situation: an emergency response operator; a hospital; a physician's office or health clinic; an ambulance company or corps; a fire department, district or company; or a police department, (b) any of the following persons while in the performance of their official duties: a police officer or peace officer; a member of a fire department, district or company; or the operator of an authorized emergency vehicle as defined in section one hundred one of this chapter.

4. A person who holds a portable electronic device in a conspicuous manner while operating a motor vehicle or while operating a commercial motor vehicle on a public highway including while temporarily stationary because of traffic, a traffic control device, or other momentary delays but not including when such commercial motor vehicle is stopped at the side of, or off, a public highway in a location where such vehicle is not otherwise prohibited from stopping by law, rule, regulation or any lawful order or direction of a police officer is presumed to be using such device, except that a person operating a commercial motor vehicle while using a portable electronic device when such vehicle is stopped at the side of, or off, a public highway in a location where such vehicle is not otherwise prohibited from stopping by law, rule, regulation or any lawful order or direction of a police officer shall not be presumed to be using such device. The presumption established by this subdivision is rebuttable by evidence tending to show that the operator was not using the device within the meaning of this section.

5. The provisions of this section shall not be construed as authorizing the seizure or forfeiture of a portable electronic device, unless otherwise provided by law.

6. A violation of this section shall be a traffic infraction and shall be punishable by a fine of not less than fifty dollars nor more than two hundred dollars upon conviction of a first violation; upon conviction of a second violation, both of which were committed within a period of eighteen months, such violation shall be punished by a fine of not less than fifty dollars nor more than two hundred fifty dollars; upon conviction of a third or subsequent violation, all of which were committed within a period of eighteen months, such violation shall be punished by a fine of not less than fifty dollars nor more than four hundred fifty dollars.

[LeagleEagleDFW]

It's astonishing to me that so many people STILL can't grasp why the statute is inapplicable despite related explanation.

Again, for the slower readers, you can't just cherry pick what you like from the statute. That laundry list that everyone who is misreading the statute pulls their selected choice of words from is entirely dependent on the first clause regarding present or future communication. That entire list only applies if the device is being used for the purposes of present or future communication. If that isn't happening, none of that laundry list matters.