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It also depends on how far you want to go in classifying a car into a separate class.
For example - They made quite a lot of Pontiac G8s. Fewer were GXP models. Fewer of those had a manual transmission.
SO depending on whether you are looking at "are G8s rare?" No. "G8s with a V8?" Not really. "GXP?" You can probably call those rare, or rare-ish. Manual GXPs? Very rare.
How many made vs. how many survive can also make a difference. They made a lot of Jensen Healey Roadsters. However because unleaded gasoline tended to dissolve the fuel T between the carbs, there are very few remaining - so they are pretty rare (and because it costs more the rebuild the limited life racing engine than the car is worth)
However as mentioned rare does not translate to collectible or valuable. You can get a running J.H. for $3500, a very good condition one for $500 - $7500 and perfect/fully restored for $12K - $20K.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katana49
Agreed... rarity depends on a variety of factors. They've made a lot of Vipers, for example, but ACR Vipers are considerably more rare.
Sometimes just having a rare paint color can make a car rare. I had a car once with a factory paint color that was only offered for one year, and they only made 92 that year. As far as that car with the same paint color and options, that was extremely rare, but the model itself wasn't really rare.
Quote:
Originally Posted by eaton53
Example: Cadillac XLR got a refresh in 2009, 987 sold so it's rare.
A few of those were XLR-V's. That car is very rare.
Black Cherry was only offered that year. A Black Cherry XLR-V is very, very rare.
Combined with certain interior colors, I suppose it's possible that a single example exists.
Gonna be collectable down the road.
I'd only be willing to sub-classify down to the body level. Year, make, model, body. Motor, paint, accessories (IMHO) should be excluded because it brings too many unimportant factors into the discussion.
I'd only be willing to sub-classify down to the body level. Year, make, model, body. Motor, paint, accessories (IMHO) should be excluded because it brings too many unimportant factors into the discussion.
Muscle car collectors would disagree with you. Some of the most rare and expensive examples are only rare because they have a certain engine option from the factory, and a numbers matching example can be worth hundreds of thousands of dollars.
Muscle car collectors would disagree with you. Some of the most rare and expensive examples are only rare because they have a certain engine option from the factory, and a numbers matching example can be worth hundreds of thousands of dollars.
That is true, when we are talking about a room full of collectors of that particular car.
But what of a room full of CD Forum members; is detailed level as important for these folks? For example, if I were at a party and someone said to me, I have a early sixties Mustang, I'd be like "ok". But if they added it's a 64-1/2 Mustang... 2+2 Fastback, my ears would perk up. If they further added "mine has the 'sharp edge hood'", I might be even more interested, but most people in the room would have lost any understanding of the rarity and interest in the subject when you got past 1964.
So, in general conversation, what level do you suggest? Engine, transmission, paint color, radio installed? I guess if I were trying to create a definitive list, all factors would be important. But is that still true in casual conversation?
Example: Cadillac XLR got a refresh in 2009, 987 sold so it's rare.
A few of those were XLR-V's. That car is very rare.
Black Cherry was only offered that year. A Black Cherry XLR-V is very, very rare.
Combined with certain interior colors, I suppose it's possible that a single example exists.
Gonna be collectable down the road.
Maybe it will be collectible, because at least to some, it's a desirable car.
Consider the E30 M3. About 5000 were imported to the US. At first it didn't get any respect, people would drive them on the street for a while and then turn them into a track rat. A lot of people did that.
Now, probably less than 1000 good, unmolested cars remain. They went from a 15-20K car back in the early 2000s to something around $40K now.
I think what the OP really meant to ask, is "What makes a car appreciate?" - and the short answer to that is there needs to be more demand for the car than there are cars out there.
Collect-ability is not always about being fast. Priced a 21-window VW bus lately?
I had an 07 MB that there was only 148 made for North America that year. They made an 08 with around same numbers. The 08 Black Series of it are the collectible ones holding value now (it's one of the best cars ever made)
Muscle car collectors would disagree with you. Some of the most rare and expensive examples are only rare because they have a certain engine option from the factory, and a numbers matching example can be worth hundreds of thousands of dollars.
Like a Hemi Cuda Convertible - made for one or two years and only a few hundred ever made. Worth millions. Pretty much any other Cuda is worth maybe hundreds of thousands at best most are worth tens of thousands (there might be some exceptions,but I have never seen one).
That is true, when we are talking about a room full of collectors of that particular car.
But what of a room full of CD Forum members; is detailed level as important for these folks? For example, if I were at a party and someone said to me, I have a early sixties Mustang, I'd be like "ok". But if they added it's a 64-1/2 Mustang... 2+2 Fastback, my ears would perk up. If they further added "mine has the 'sharp edge hood'", I might be even more interested, but most people in the room would have lost any understanding of the rarity and interest in the subject when you got past 1964.
So, in general conversation, what level do you suggest? Engine, transmission, paint color, radio installed? I guess if I were trying to create a definitive list, all factors would be important. But is that still true in casual conversation?
In a general conversation, in the type of situation you are implying means that not all participants in the conversation are knowledgeable about the subject matter.
In my example above, it's not the car itself that is rare... what made it rare is the factory engine and options chosen when ordered. For someone to understand the rarity, you would need to include WHY it's rare... and in this case, it's an engine/options package on an otherwise normal car that isn't rare at all.
Some people will either get it or they won't. This is also why a lot of people get taken when buying an automobile... they either don't know what they have when selling, or if buying, they think that ALL cars are worth the same as a numbers matching, special options code build.
Like a Hemi Cuda Convertible - made for one or two years and only a few hundred ever made. Worth millions. Pretty much any other Cuda is worth maybe hundreds of thousands at best most are worth tens of thousands (there might be some exceptions,but I have never seen one).
That is true, when we are talking about a room full of collectors of that particular car.
But what of a room full of CD Forum members; is detailed level as important for these folks? For example, if I were at a party and someone said to me, I have a early sixties Mustang, I'd be like "ok". But if they added it's a 64-1/2 Mustang... 2+2 Fastback, my ears would perk up. If they further added "mine has the 'sharp edge hood'", I might be even more interested, but most people in the room would have lost any understanding of the rarity and interest in the subject when you got past 1964.
So, in general conversation, what level do you suggest? Engine, transmission, paint color, radio installed? I guess if I were trying to create a definitive list, all factors would be important. But is that still true in casual conversation?
Just because one party to the conversation doesn't understand the rarity, doesn't make it stop being rare. Same with art, jewelry, etc. Something that's rare and valuable remains so even if not everyone in the room understands why.
Maybe it will be collectible, because at least to some, it's a desirable car.
Consider the E30 M3. About 5000 were imported to the US. At first it didn't get any respect, people would drive them on the street for a while and then turn them into a track rat. A lot of people did that.
Now, probably less than 1000 good, unmolested cars remain. They went from a 15-20K car back in the early 2000s to something around $40K now.
I think what the OP really meant to ask, is "What makes a car appreciate?" - and the short answer to that is there needs to be more demand for the car than there are cars out there.
Collect-ability is not always about being fast. Priced a 21-window VW bus lately?
No, the OP just wanted to know what people consider "rare" and what metrics they use to determine this.
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