Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
The plan now is is to eliminate ethanol entirely and bring on Isobutanol. Iso gas is still made from the same feedstocks but the yield is better and there are alternatives to corn for the feedstocks. The advantages are clear going to iso gas. It does not attack the fuel system, it does not absorb water out of the air, it has almost the same BTUs as the gasoline. You'll get a cleaner running engine, fewer fuel issues like separation over time, maintains its octane rating, and provides more power to the same engine and better fuel mileage. I've personally run it in my 3.7 F150 Supercrew. The difference is noticeable after the first tank. While the 3.7 in that heavy platform is considered a dog, it wakes up with Iso gas. I can literally smoke the back 275/60/20 tires. Gas mileage was up roughly 20%. The engine ran effortlessly. The downside to it as of now, the cost. It cost me right at 4 bucks a gallon and that will buy you 93 octane rated Iso gas. As the product gains production, the expected cost will about the same as ethanol. You can buy it today as Gulf Racing Fuel or Gevo. Isobutanol and Going Ethanol Free - Gulf Racing Fuels - Gulf Racing Fuels NMMA Testing Demonstrates Gevo’s Isobutanol-Gasoline Blend is Superior to E15 Fuel for Boaters | Gevo https://www.boatingmag.com/ethanol-versus-isobutanol
I love ethanol. Great for performance engines, especially turbo/supercharged. I couldn't get above 280whp on 93, with an ethanol blend I was able to hit 350whp on a 2.3 turbo motor.
Even a naturally aspirated 5.0 will see about 12whp/12wtq gain across the entire power band tuning on ethanol alone.
Most people know about the Ethanol scam, but both Republicans, and Democrats support it because they want the votes, and political donations from corn farmers.
And we have a winner!*
*I don't think most people know how much bull***t corn ethanol is. They're just told that it's good, and it's MADE IN THE USA, so lemme wave muh flag and fill up muh SUV.
Now, ethanol made from sugarcane is a different story.
you guys are only looking at one thing and trying to rationalize your hate for ethanol, reality check here, i have already noted the benefits to corn ethanol, and they have been known for decades, but you are ignoring them.
as for damaging engines, that is pure rubbish, i have dealt with alcohol fuels for decades as well, the only issues i have run across is fuel system parts that are not designed to handle ethanol, since alcohol is a solvent. once ethanol proof fuel lines are installed, and ethanol proofing is done in the rest of the fuel system is done, ethanol is quite a viable fuel.
First, I never said it would ruin engines. Screwing with fuel systems is reason enough to hate it. The stuff is hygroscopic. It doesn't belong in anything of any value. Period!
Unfortunately I must have missed your posts about the advantages. In my opinion growing food safe crops for fuel is a waste. Now if you were extolling the virtues of taking old corn stalks or sugar cane refuse or clearing land of weeds and such and turning it into ethanol then that would be acceptable particularly for quick turn around applications where the fuel does not get a chance to sit for any length of time. Plus I don't want the gov't telling me that is my only option at the pump as it is here in NY.
I would like to see what you believe are the advantages. I'm not going to search for it but if you provide a link I would certainly read them. Thanks.
Ethanol loves to eat carburetor gaskets for breakfast, lunch and dinner. It’s not made for older cars that sit a lot either.
All my classic cars need the carb gaskets replaces every year or 2, because of ethanols corrosive properties and it’s ability to attract moisture that rust out metal gas tanks and fuel lines.
Not sure how the gas is in other states, but CA fuel is a Franken mixture of all kinds of crap that really screws up older carbureted vehicles.
It also throws off the mixture adjustments, since 10% ethanol fuel has less energy content vs 100% pure gas, I have enrichen the idle/air adjustment screws beyond specs because none of my classic cars will run smoothly anymore if I still went by what the shop manual states.
Carb shop owner has told me how bad ethanol gas is for carbs as it causes leaks and possibly start fires if not caught in time, his business has increased because of it he said to me with sad but quirky smile on his face.
Ethanol loves to eat carburetor gaskets for breakfast, lunch and dinner. It’s not made for older cars that sit a lot either.
All my classic cars need the carb gaskets replaces every year or 2, because of ethanols corrosive properties and it’s ability to attract moisture that rust out metal gas tanks and fuel lines.
Not sure how the gas is in other states, but CA fuel is a Franken mixture of all kinds of crap that really screws up older carbureted vehicles.
It also throws off the mixture adjustments, since 10% ethanol fuel has less energy content vs 100% pure gas, I have enrichen the idle/air adjustment screws beyond specs because none of my classic cars will run smoothly anymore if I still went by what the shop manual states.
Carb shop owner has told me how bad ethanol gas is for carbs as it causes leaks and possibly start fires if not caught in time, his business has increased because of it he said to me with sad but quirky smile on his face.
I have several old tractors, one of them works, the others are show pieces. Ive ran E85 in them for years, and have never had to replace anything related to the fuel system on any of them. Some of them sit for as long as a year, and have the same E85 in them for 2 years at least. Never have any problems! In fact, I have less problems with fuel systems than we ever did when we farmed. I do believe it has caused people problems, but it hasn't caused me any, nor any one else I know except those lazy friends who don't take care of their stuff anyways.
First, I never said it would ruin engines. Screwing with fuel systems is reason enough to hate it. The stuff is hygroscopic. It doesn't belong in anything of any value. Period!
Unfortunately I must have missed your posts about the advantages. In my opinion growing food safe crops for fuel is a waste. Now if you were extolling the virtues of taking old corn stalks or sugar cane refuse or clearing land of weeds and such and turning it into ethanol then that would be acceptable particularly for quick turn around applications where the fuel does not get a chance to sit for any length of time. Plus I don't want the gov't telling me that is my only option at the pump as it is here in NY.
I would like to see what you believe are the advantages. I'm not going to search for it but if you provide a link I would certainly read them. Thanks.
as i said i have been dealing with ethanol and methanol for over thirty years now, in fact i first started looking into it while in high school in the mid 70s. especially after attending an energy seminar at the university of arizona in 1976. ever since i have studied as much as i could find, back then everything was in paperback book form.
and i recognize that there are drawbacks to alcohol as a fuel, but they are easily overcome with a few changes here and there.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sdlife619
Ethanol loves to eat carburetor gaskets for breakfast, lunch and dinner. It’s not made for older cars that sit a lot either.
All my classic cars need the carb gaskets replaces every year or 2, because of ethanols corrosive properties and it’s ability to attract moisture that rust out metal gas tanks and fuel lines.
Not sure how the gas is in other states, but CA fuel is a Franken mixture of all kinds of crap that really screws up older carbureted vehicles.
It also throws off the mixture adjustments, since 10% ethanol fuel has less energy content vs 100% pure gas, I have enrichen the idle/air adjustment screws beyond specs because none of my classic cars will run smoothly anymore if I still went by what the shop manual states.
Carb shop owner has told me how bad ethanol gas is for carbs as it causes leaks and possibly start fires if not caught in time, his business has increased because of it he said to me with sad but quirky smile on his face.
these days if you are having issues with carb gaskets leaking due to ethanol in the fuel, you are clearly using substandard gaskets. holley upgraded their line of gaskets to incorporate materials to deal with ethanol in the fuel. so instead of buying the cheapest gasket set you can find, go with something good instead. and by the way edelbrock also upgraded their gasket materials as well as i have never had an issue with either holley or edelbrock carbs and ethanol fuels.
something else that has been known for decades, but most people who are anti corn ethanol forget, is that there are corn stocks that are not edible by humans, but the ARE edible by farm animals. however even the farm animals have issues digesting those corn stocks in raw form.
however once these feed stocks of corn have been processed into ethanol, the mash becomes quite easily edible for farm animals, so in the end corn ethanol is a win win situation, people get fuel for their cars, and the animals get a feed stock they can digest without issue.
Or some of that farmland could be returned to use growing crops for human consumption, or to pasture for grass-fed meat and dairy animals. Corn ethanol is with us for the same reasons as HFCS: a powerful lobby supports it.
I honestly have no opinion regarding the effect of ethanol on cars, but it does make me angry to see it promoted as "clean" energy. It isn't.
Or some of that farmland could be returned to use growing crops for human consumption, or to pasture for grass-fed meat and dairy animals. Corn ethanol is with us for the same reasons as HFCS: a powerful lobby supports it.
I honestly have no opinion regarding the effect of ethanol on cars, but it does make me angry to see it promoted as "clean" energy. It isn't.
i agree that it isnt the clean energy that some make it out to be, in fact i point this out in just about every thread made about ethanol fuels. the myth comes from the early days of emissions testing when the sensors were tuned for gasoline only. ethanol burns too cold for those sensors to pick up the emissions from burning that particular fuel.
but dont forget that corn has more uses that food and fuel. fructose is a form of sugar that is inexpensive to make, as is corn syrup, plastic, etc. and most of these products are made from feed stock corn not food stock corn. so the land that this feed stock corn is grown on, will still be used for growing feed stock corn, so we may as well use it to the fullest extent.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
