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Old 05-20-2010, 10:07 AM
 
Location: Pikesville, MD
5,228 posts, read 15,188,983 times
Reputation: 4846

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drover View Post
Seriously Merc, the guy is not asking about heavily modded racing cars. He's asking about a normal, everyday street car for normal, everyday street use. Do you have any thoughts on that subject?
So no normal every day daily drivers where you live have $50 or more into engine or suspension updates, like intakes, exhausets, shocks, etc?

Or are you stupid enough to think all cars are either COMPLETELY stock or HEAVILY RACE MODIFIED?

You simply cannot make blanket statements about how certain things work if you 1) only have limited experience, and 2) don't know what's out there on the street not only in stock form, but in typically modified form.

let's give an analogy. Someone comes on here and says, "I hate all sedans. I drove my grandma's Olds sedan and I hated it. So I'll stick with my sport hatchback." Well, just because your grandma's Oldsmobile sedan works one way doesn't mean that all street cars work that way. It'd be like saying because your grandma's Olds was a wallowy, floaty old boat that all American street legal cars are wallowy old boats, or that all street legal daily driven SEDANS are wallowy old boats, and that's the only way they can every be otherwise it must be some "heavily modified race car" and not pertinent to the discussion on why you hate sedans.

But no, it's more important to hate on things you have limited experience with instead of keeping an open mind, and realizing that there's more out there than you might know. it's more important to form and hold tightly to an opinion, rather than learn anything. Well, you have the right to your opinion. And I have the right to tell you my opinion OF that opinion, especially when that opinion is one of absolutes an assertion of fact that isn't factual.
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Old 05-20-2010, 01:06 PM
 
Location: Chicago
38,707 posts, read 102,697,699 times
Reputation: 29966
I'll take that as a "no."
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Old 05-20-2010, 01:57 PM
 
32,516 posts, read 36,988,532 times
Reputation: 32571
My first car was a stick and I love them. Nothing like it as far as I'm concerned.

But in L.A. stop and go traffic? Horrible. And I drove in L.A. traffic for years. The only good part is the moment traffic finally clears and you can actually put it into second.
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Old 05-20-2010, 08:50 PM
 
Location: Eastern Washington
17,112 posts, read 56,720,019 times
Reputation: 18365
I'll have to admit I have not tried the BMW 7-series autobox.

I think I didn't write clearly enough on the downshift. If I want to downshift for some engine braking, heading down a hill for example - with a manual I can match revs, let the clutch out with no jerking in the car at all. A deaf guy sitting in the back seat would not know I did anything if he was not watching me shift.

With the automatics I have, take the Toy for example - I can more or less finesse this same spot (a 90 degree right turn and then a downhill to a stop) by letting the car slow down, brake for the turn (down to about 25-30 MPH) and then get on the gas a bit, just enough to get the car to shift down out of overdrive, then lock out the O/D - but it's like I have to work at "tricking" the car into doing what I want. With the Scirocco I just match revs, let the clutch out with no acceleration or deceleration, (to me it's fun to be able to hit that exact throttle setting/RPM that allows this) and then shut the throttle.

They all do a decent job of course of shifting smoothly into passing gear.

But here again, particularly the Subaru and the Toy, the transmission programming is somewhat more willing to wind out to near-redline RPMs than I really want to do on a car with 200K+ miles.

Anyway, getting back to the original question - if the OP gets well accustomed to driving stick, it's do-able in a city environment, depending on the car and the skill of the driver, and how many uphill starts you are stuck with, clutch life may not be great.

Although now thinking about it more, if I were stuck with a lot of creeping "8-lane parking lot" type traffic like I have experienced in CA from time to time - I'd probably rather have an automatic.
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Old 05-21-2010, 09:01 PM
 
Location: WI
3,961 posts, read 10,960,252 times
Reputation: 2503
Quote:
Originally Posted by M3 Mitch View Post
Anyway, getting back to the original question - if the OP gets well accustomed to driving stick, it's do-able in a city environment, depending on the car and the skill of the driver, and how many uphill starts you are stuck with, clutch life may not be great.

Although now thinking about it more, if I were stuck with a lot of creeping "8-lane parking lot" type traffic like I have experienced in CA from time to time - I'd probably rather have an automatic.
I think that about sums it up. After years of driving both, i'd only add: if you are getting the stick for some "enjoyment", then what % of time behind the wheel will allow for that type of driving. If a majority of your drivetime is stop/go and standard traffic, then an AT may take some of the tension out of it and be the way to go. If your "city" driving is somewhat limited and you can and will find time to go and enjoy the car ( not caring what type of car it is ), then a manual can make sense.
Last 5 years we've had the wife's ride/toy which is a stick and can be fun to drive, and whatever suv we use as our "family/boat hauler" is always an AT. So we can switch off, drive what we want based on the needs of the day, etc....
But we both agree the next toy will also be a stick. Heck, it's just more fun to go run thru the gears sometimes. And that 2011 'stang GT is looking a lot like a car that would be fun to row the gears with....
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Old 05-22-2010, 01:36 AM
 
Location: Viña del Mar, Chile
16,401 posts, read 30,807,449 times
Reputation: 16641
After reading everything, I've decided to not search for a manual transmission but I'm also not afraid to buy one, so basically if I find a better deal with a stick shift I'll take it but if the prices are the same I'll probably go with an automatic.

Not really looking for fun or an experience, I was just trying to gauge if the effort was worth the money saved, and I really think it is.

Thanks for all the advice you guys, it really helped a lot!
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Old 05-22-2010, 08:49 AM
 
19,023 posts, read 25,864,073 times
Reputation: 7365
burg, In hard stop n go traffic a stick can get old..., but once your clear of traffic as stop n go it's fine.
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Old 07-19-2010, 06:22 PM
 
12,999 posts, read 18,793,261 times
Reputation: 9236
On some of the older models it was necessary to double-clutch before shifting. That is, have the engine speed match the driving shaft on the gearbox. Still makes the transition smoother and reduces wear on the transmission.
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Old 07-19-2010, 07:34 PM
 
33,387 posts, read 34,622,442 times
Reputation: 20027
it really depends on the car, and how heavy the clutch pedal effort is. for instance, my old 84 F250 had a heavy clutch pedal, and holding it down in traffic could be a real pain in the knee. on the other hand the pedal effort in my old 80 pinto was quite light, and it was a joy to drive with the manual transmission. my mustang and my falcon fall in the middle of these. however these days i tend to prefer an automatic for city type driving, but then i am 51 years old and i deserve to take it easy.
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Old 07-25-2010, 09:28 AM
'M'
 
Location: Glendale Country Club
1,949 posts, read 3,173,523 times
Reputation: 2798
Having had both, and at one time thinking that the only tranmission to have is 4 speed, I now am an automatic transmission-lover. In spite of the seeming consensus that stick is better, especially in bad weather (having had a lot of experience driving in snowy/icy weather with auto), I wouldn't have anything but automatic. I down shift a lot when needed. My current Subie really holds the lower gears well, just like a stick, so can't complain. Used to have a Camry and it didn't hold the lower gears nearly as well. But, if I could drive a vintage Mustang V-8 (guess those are Mach's?), I would be in heaven

When I used to drive rush hour traffic in Denver, the stick was not the easiest. Switching to automatic made rush hour a breeze.
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