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Old 04-13-2018, 06:22 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Koji7 View Post
I think if you add up LGA, EWR and JFK it’s a pretty big number.
It's still behind the sum of the 5 airports in London. But London and NYC are still the top of the aviation pyramid.

Atlanta still has only 2 Pacific nonstop destinations (Tokyo and Seoul) although they are adding Shanghai this summer. Atlanta is primarily a domestic transfer airport. The airport has 14 European nonstop destinations, but that is about the same as Orlando or Boston, and significantly below Miami, JFK, EWR, or Washington DC.

A shocking 1 out of 2 domestic passengers by segment on Delta during the year are going in or out of Atlanta.

American and United are not so dependents on a single airport. Obviously Hawaiian Airlines is almost a single airport airline.

United's biggest airport is Chicago, but they are almost equally spread among Chicago, Newark, Denver and San Francisco with Washington DC and LAX in secondary positions. American is a more concentrated on DFW, but not to the extent that Delta is concentrated in ATL.


Quote:
Originally Posted by sean1the1 View Post
Help!? Delta creates the numbers, the same for Charlotte, and many other major US airports. It would be really interesting to see how many people actually fly to these cities without the hubs.
There are periodic ranking by origin and destination traffic alone. Here is one such ranking from 2009. Note that Orlando and Las Vegas are above Dallas/Ft.Worth and Atlanta. Charlotte is below Kansas city.

Metro Daily O&D total total O&D O&D % # of Airports
New York 127,801 51,883,694 23,131,981 44.60% 6 airports
Los Angeles 104,723 34,789,171 18,954,863 54.50% 4 airports
Chicago 86,821 39,281,585 15,714,601 40.00% 2 airports
Miami 79,636 31,262,044 14,414,116 46.10% 3 airports
Las Vegas 73,138 20,224,090 13,237,978 65.50%
San Francisco 68,838 22,139,378 12,459,678 56.30% 2 airports
Orlando 68,040 18,211,975 12,315,240 67.60% 2 airports
Dallas/Ft.Worth 59,577 31,149,065 10,783,437 34.60% 2 airports
Atlanta 56,645 43,008,154 10,252,745 23.80%
Phoenix 54,040 18,968,897 9,781,240 51.60%
Denver 53,747 24,337,554 9,728,207 40.00%
Washington 52,832 19,915,669 9,562,592 48.00% 2 airports
Boston 44,673 12,068,312 8,085,813 67.00%
Seattle 43,376 14,787,443 7,851,056 53.10%
Philadelphia 41,860 14,878,298 7,576,660 50.90%
Houston 39,021 23,606,848 7,062,801 29.90% 2 airports
Tampa 39,021 9,348,162 7,062,801 75.30% 2 airports
Baltimore 38,901 10,001,992 7,041,081 70.30%
San Diego 36,242 8,171,820 6,559,802 80.30%
Minneapolis 34,399 16,173,119 6,226,219 38.50%
Detroit 33,128 15,715,346 5,996,168 38.20%
Salt Lake City 22,696 9,988,837 4,107,976 41.10%
St. Louis 22,361 6,258,829 4,047,341 64.70%
Portland 22,144 6,116,995 4,008,064 65.50%
Sacramento 20,175 4,356,274 3,651,675 83.80%
Kansas City 19,973 4,685,648 3,615,113 77.20%
Charlotte 19,562 17,215,648 3,540,722 20.60%

Last edited by PacoMartin; 04-13-2018 at 06:43 AM..
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Old 04-13-2018, 07:48 AM
 
2,685 posts, read 2,327,622 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PacoMartin View Post
It's still behind the sum of the 5 airports in London. But London and NYC are still the top of the aviation pyramid.

Atlanta still has only 2 Pacific nonstop destinations (Tokyo and Seoul) although they are adding Shanghai this summer. Atlanta is primarily a domestic transfer airport. The airport has 14 European nonstop destinations, but that is about the same as Orlando or Boston, and significantly below Miami, JFK, EWR, or Washington DC.

A shocking 1 out of 2 domestic passengers by segment on Delta during the year are going in or out of Atlanta.

American and United are not so dependents on a single airport. Obviously Hawaiian Airlines is almost a single airport airline.

United's biggest airport is Chicago, but they are almost equally spread among Chicago, Newark, Denver and San Francisco with Washington DC and LAX in secondary positions. American is a more concentrated on DFW, but not to the extent that Delta is concentrated in ATL.




There are periodic ranking by origin and destination traffic alone. Here is one such ranking from 2009. Note that Orlando and Las Vegas are above Dallas/Ft.Worth and Atlanta. Charlotte is below Kansas city.

Metro Daily O&D total total O&D O&D % # of Airports
New York 127,801 51,883,694 23,131,981 44.60% 6 airports
Los Angeles 104,723 34,789,171 18,954,863 54.50% 4 airports
Chicago 86,821 39,281,585 15,714,601 40.00% 2 airports
Miami 79,636 31,262,044 14,414,116 46.10% 3 airports
Las Vegas 73,138 20,224,090 13,237,978 65.50%
San Francisco 68,838 22,139,378 12,459,678 56.30% 2 airports
Orlando 68,040 18,211,975 12,315,240 67.60% 2 airports
Dallas/Ft.Worth 59,577 31,149,065 10,783,437 34.60% 2 airports
Atlanta 56,645 43,008,154 10,252,745 23.80%
Phoenix 54,040 18,968,897 9,781,240 51.60%
Denver 53,747 24,337,554 9,728,207 40.00%
Washington 52,832 19,915,669 9,562,592 48.00% 2 airports
Boston 44,673 12,068,312 8,085,813 67.00%
Seattle 43,376 14,787,443 7,851,056 53.10%
Philadelphia 41,860 14,878,298 7,576,660 50.90%
Houston 39,021 23,606,848 7,062,801 29.90% 2 airports
Tampa 39,021 9,348,162 7,062,801 75.30% 2 airports
Baltimore 38,901 10,001,992 7,041,081 70.30%
San Diego 36,242 8,171,820 6,559,802 80.30%
Minneapolis 34,399 16,173,119 6,226,219 38.50%
Detroit 33,128 15,715,346 5,996,168 38.20%
Salt Lake City 22,696 9,988,837 4,107,976 41.10%
St. Louis 22,361 6,258,829 4,047,341 64.70%
Portland 22,144 6,116,995 4,008,064 65.50%
Sacramento 20,175 4,356,274 3,651,675 83.80%
Kansas City 19,973 4,685,648 3,615,113 77.20%
Charlotte 19,562 17,215,648 3,540,722 20.60%
I wonder what the 6th in NY metro are. I live here, 5 are JFK, LGA, EWR, Islip (LI), White plans (Westchester) I wonder if the 6th is? I assume it's Trenton NJ or SWF in Orange County NY.
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Old 04-13-2018, 08:39 AM
 
Location: Howard County, Maryland
16,554 posts, read 10,618,310 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PacoMartin View Post
A shocking 1 out of 2 domestic passengers by segment on Delta during the year are going in or out of Atlanta.
Anyone raised in the South will be familiar with this old saying: "Whether you're going to Heaven or Hell, you have to change planes in Atlanta."


Quote:
Originally Posted by PacoMartin View Post
Metro Daily O&D total total O&D O&D % # of Airports
New York 127,801 51,883,694 23,131,981 44.60% 6 airports
Los Angeles 104,723 34,789,171 18,954,863 54.50% 4 airports
Chicago 86,821 39,281,585 15,714,601 40.00% 2 airports
Miami 79,636 31,262,044 14,414,116 46.10% 3 airports
Las Vegas 73,138 20,224,090 13,237,978 65.50%
San Francisco 68,838 22,139,378 12,459,678 56.30% 2 airports
Orlando 68,040 18,211,975 12,315,240 67.60% 2 airports
Dallas/Ft.Worth 59,577 31,149,065 10,783,437 34.60% 2 airports
Atlanta 56,645 43,008,154 10,252,745 23.80%
Phoenix 54,040 18,968,897 9,781,240 51.60%
Denver 53,747 24,337,554 9,728,207 40.00%
Washington 52,832 19,915,669 9,562,592 48.00% 2 airports
Boston 44,673 12,068,312 8,085,813 67.00%
Seattle 43,376 14,787,443 7,851,056 53.10%
Philadelphia 41,860 14,878,298 7,576,660 50.90%
Houston 39,021 23,606,848 7,062,801 29.90% 2 airports
Tampa 39,021 9,348,162 7,062,801 75.30% 2 airports
Baltimore 38,901 10,001,992 7,041,081 70.30%
San Diego 36,242 8,171,820 6,559,802 80.30%
Minneapolis 34,399 16,173,119 6,226,219 38.50%
Detroit 33,128 15,715,346 5,996,168 38.20%
Salt Lake City 22,696 9,988,837 4,107,976 41.10%
St. Louis 22,361 6,258,829 4,047,341 64.70%
Portland 22,144 6,116,995 4,008,064 65.50%
Sacramento 20,175 4,356,274 3,651,675 83.80%
Kansas City 19,973 4,685,648 3,615,113 77.20%
Charlotte 19,562 17,215,648 3,540,722 20.60%
Some rankings lump Baltimore in with the other two Washington airports. If this one had done so, the greater Washington region would have ranked in 3rd place.
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Old 04-13-2018, 10:17 AM
 
Location: Frisco, TX
1,879 posts, read 1,553,712 times
Reputation: 3060
Quote:
Originally Posted by PacoMartin View Post
There are periodic ranking by origin and destination traffic alone. Here is one such ranking from 2009. Note that Orlando and Las Vegas are above Dallas/Ft.Worth and Atlanta. Charlotte is below Kansas city.

Metro Daily O&D total total O&D O&D % # of Airports
New York 127,801 51,883,694 23,131,981 44.60% 6 airports
Los Angeles 104,723 34,789,171 18,954,863 54.50% 4 airports
Chicago 86,821 39,281,585 15,714,601 40.00% 2 airports
Miami 79,636 31,262,044 14,414,116 46.10% 3 airports
Las Vegas 73,138 20,224,090 13,237,978 65.50%
San Francisco 68,838 22,139,378 12,459,678 56.30% 2 airports
Orlando 68,040 18,211,975 12,315,240 67.60% 2 airports
Dallas/Ft.Worth 59,577 31,149,065 10,783,437 34.60% 2 airports
Atlanta 56,645 43,008,154 10,252,745 23.80%
Phoenix 54,040 18,968,897 9,781,240 51.60%
Denver 53,747 24,337,554 9,728,207 40.00%
Washington 52,832 19,915,669 9,562,592 48.00% 2 airports
Boston 44,673 12,068,312 8,085,813 67.00%
Seattle 43,376 14,787,443 7,851,056 53.10%
Philadelphia 41,860 14,878,298 7,576,660 50.90%
Houston 39,021 23,606,848 7,062,801 29.90% 2 airports
Tampa 39,021 9,348,162 7,062,801 75.30% 2 airports
Baltimore 38,901 10,001,992 7,041,081 70.30%
San Diego 36,242 8,171,820 6,559,802 80.30%
Minneapolis 34,399 16,173,119 6,226,219 38.50%
Detroit 33,128 15,715,346 5,996,168 38.20%
Salt Lake City 22,696 9,988,837 4,107,976 41.10%
St. Louis 22,361 6,258,829 4,047,341 64.70%
Portland 22,144 6,116,995 4,008,064 65.50%
Sacramento 20,175 4,356,274 3,651,675 83.80%
Kansas City 19,973 4,685,648 3,615,113 77.20%
Charlotte 19,562 17,215,648 3,540,722 20.60%
I’m surprised LA has such little O&D traffic. I thought it was ranked one of the highest in the country.

Do you know if AA will dehub CLT? It seems like a huge redundancy.
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Old 04-14-2018, 05:40 AM
 
Location: Atlanta
9,818 posts, read 7,926,133 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PacoMartin View Post
It's still behind the sum of the 5 airports in London. But London and NYC are still the top of the aviation pyramid.
Yes, as they always have been. This doesn't take away the fact that Atlanta is still the busiest Airport in the world, with the world's largest single Airline hub.

Quote:
Atlanta still has only 2 Pacific nonstop destinations (Tokyo and Seoul) although they are adding Shanghai this summer.
Atlanta has the only nonstops to Asia from the Southeast, including Miami. Seoul is also our largest O&D International route, due the large Korean residential and business community here. This is unique among U.S. cities, as most have either London or Toronto and their top International destination.

Quote:
Atlanta is primarily a domestic transfer airport. The airport has 14 European nonstop destinations, but that is about the same as Orlando or Boston, and significantly below Miami, JFK, EWR, or Washington DC.
Atlanta has 19 nonstop European destinations served by Air France, British Air, Delta, KLM, Lufthansa, Turkish Air and Virgin Atlantic. Atlanta has the only U.S. nonstops to Stuttgart as well.

Atlanta also has nonstops to Doha in the Middle East, and Lagos and Johannesburg in Africa.

Quote:
A shocking 1 out of 2 domestic passengers by segment on Delta during the year are going in or out of Atlanta.
Not shocking at all, considering that Delta operates the largest single Airline hub in the World here.

Quote:
American and United are not so dependents on a single airport. Obviously Hawaiian Airlines is almost a single airport airline.

United's biggest airport is Chicago, but they are almost equally spread among Chicago, Newark, Denver and San Francisco with Washington DC and LAX in secondary positions. American is a more concentrated on DFW, but not to the extent that Delta is concentrated in ATL.
Yet Delta is more profitable than American and United, has much better labor relations, scores higher with J.D. Powers as a better Airline and has paid their employee's over one Billion dollars in bonuses for the past 4 years.

Quote:
There are periodic ranking by origin and destination traffic alone. Here is one such ranking from 2009. Note that Orlando and Las Vegas are above Dallas/Ft.Worth and Atlanta. Charlotte is below Kansas city.
Orlando is the largest tourism destination in the World, and had over 60 million visitors last year. Las Vegas is also a huge tourism market. Because of this these two cities have larger O&D than Metro areas much larger than them, not just Atlanta and Dallas. They also are both the top Convention cities in the U.S., and are numbers one and two with the most hotel rooms in the Country. With the exception of New York and L.A., it's pretty hard to compete with this.

And your 2009 O&D ranking is woefully outdated. Atlanta's O&D is currently 35.6 million a year, which is over 97,000 daily.

Not sure why you are biased against Atlanta or Delta, but your attempt to minimize both is pretty weak.
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Old 04-14-2018, 05:44 AM
 
Location: Atlanta
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Soccernerd View Post
I’m surprised LA has such little O&D traffic. I thought it was ranked one of the highest in the country.

Do you know if AA will dehub CLT? It seems like a huge redundancy.
These figures are very outdated. And Charlotte is American's most profitable hub, it isn't going anywhere.
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Old 04-14-2018, 07:45 AM
 
14,611 posts, read 17,547,250 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JMatl View Post
And your 2009 O&D ranking is woefully outdated. Atlanta's O&D is currently 35.6 million a year, which is over 97,000 daily.
Granted, but I couldn't easily find newer information.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JMatl View Post
Atlanta has 19 nonstop European destinations served by Air France, British Air, Delta, KLM, Lufthansa, Turkish Air and Virgin Atlantic. Atlanta has the only U.S. nonstops to Stuttgart as well.
I must have miscounted.
  1. London
  2. Paris
  3. Amsterdam
  4. Dublin
  5. Manchester
  6. Madrid
  7. Barcelona
  8. Brussels
  9. Frankfurt
  10. Munich
  11. Stuttgart
  12. Dusseldorf
  13. Rome
  14. Istanbul

Quote:
Originally Posted by JMatl View Post
Not sure why you are biased against Atlanta or Delta, but your attempt to minimize both is pretty weak.
My comments were not meant to minimize either Atlanta or Delta. ATL broke into the top 10 in the mid 1950's, and has been the world's busiest by number of passengers for 20 years now.

The observation that 1 out of 2 passengers on domestic segments by Delta are coming or leaving from ATL is meant to be an observation that concentrating into mega hubs is actually very efficient. Southwest makes a big deal out of the fact that they do not have a hub and spoke system.

I have questioned if it makes sense for Delta to maintain their TransPacific hub in Detroit, where it was established by Northwest. It's been 10 years, and I would have thought they would have moved it to Atlanta where they have so many domestic connections. But I wouldn't call that "minimizing" Delta.

Last edited by PacoMartin; 04-14-2018 at 09:08 AM..
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Old 04-14-2018, 09:48 AM
 
Location: Atlanta
9,818 posts, read 7,926,133 times
Reputation: 9991
Quote:
Originally Posted by PacoMartin View Post
Granted, but I couldn't easily find newer information.


I must have miscounted.
  1. London
  2. Paris
  3. Amsterdam
  4. Dublin
  5. Manchester
  6. Madrid
  7. Barcelona
  8. Brussels
  9. Frankfurt
  10. Munich
  11. Stuttgart
  12. Dusseldorf
  13. Rome
  14. Istanbul
Yes, you did miscount. And I stand corrected, it's 18 cities.

15. Milan
16. Venice
17. Lisbon
18. Zurich

Quote:
My comments were not meant to minimize either Atlanta or Delta.
That was clearly the tone of your post.
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Old 04-14-2018, 10:52 AM
 
14,611 posts, read 17,547,250 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JMatl View Post
That was clearly the tone of your post.
In general I think that the country needs to expand it's international gateways more away from JFK,EWR, MIA LAX, SFO. They are severely overtaxed already and don't have real estate to expand.

Chicago is also very space limited as is PHL.

Atlantic available seats for US flagged carriers
17.4% JFK
15.4% EWR
10.0% ATL
9.1% ORD
7.6% PHL
7.2% IAD
4.4% DTW
4.4% DFW
4.1% CLT

Pacific available seats for US flagged carriers
19.0% SFO
17.1% HNL
16.9% LAX
9.0% ORD
8.3% DFW
7.6% DTW
5.5% EWR
5.4% SEA
2.8% ATL
2.7% IAD

LatinAmerica available seats for US flagged carriers
17.3% MIA
12.8% JFK
11.2% IAH
10.6% ATL
8.4% FLL
8.3% DFW
6.3% LAX
4.5% EWR
2.5% CLT
2.0% ORD
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Old 10-31-2018, 11:01 AM
 
Location: Nashville, TN
9,680 posts, read 9,387,327 times
Reputation: 7261
Istanbul aims to replace Atlanta as the busiest airport.

https://www.bizjournals.com/nashvill...-perch-as.html
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