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Zeynep Tufekci wrote at length about SWA recent embarrassment.
But is there anyone besides me that remembers that airlines used to run pretty well pre-internet? Maybe part of the problem is that things were allowed to become over-complex?
The Shameful Open Secret Behind Southwest’s Failure
This problem — relying on older or deficient software that needs updating — is known as incurring “technical debt,” meaning there is a gap between what the software needs to be and what it is. https://dnyuz.com/2022/12/31/the-sha...wests-failure/
Location: We_tside PNW (Columbia Gorge) / CO / SA TX / Thailand
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Unfortunately, this has not been a secret to employees, investors, or passengers. (for the last 15 yrs).
But... it still works (usually).
6 flights on SWA in the last 4 days. All were seamless except one, and it was a doosy. (as can happen). Weather at destination caused delay of departure, then... there was a significant 'gate-back-up' at destination due to missed slots, so... the dominoes fell... and everyone got delayed (all incoming flights).
Consider SWA a 'recreational' airline. Get there when you get there, likely today, maybe tommorrow, maybe in 2-3 weeks. (I.e. Plan accordingly). If you're giving the invocation for a funeral (or wedding), get there a day or 2 early. Or roll the dice with another carrier. SW has always got me there, much more than I can say for some legacy's. Where we have boarded, waited, then pilot comes out of cockpit and says he has to go off duty, so flight is cancelled, i.e. you are not going anywhere. (on my way to a funeral), so it was 100% up to me how I rearranged a way to get there. This airline 'might' go later that week.
SWA has a very, very complex game to keep rolling, more-so that other carriers, so... expect some issues (on occassion). But... SWA IT is garbage, and always has been, making the probablility of a meltdown a reality.
Southwest's problem is more than just software, it's their entire route model. To understand the problem you have to understand the origin of the airline. It was simply a triangle between Houston, Dallas and San Antonio. As destinations grew, so did the triangle. And more triangles were added. It's simply just a bunch of triangle route pairings that patchwork the entire country. Frankly, even with new software I think we still would have had the same mess between Christmas and New Years because I think that the airline would have needed to do a "reset" either way. You would still need to reposition planes and crews, and then what? They will most likely be timed out either immediately or halfway through the trips. They did what was best and halted everything and started fresh.
I was part of that meltdown, having a flight from SAT to RDU during that week. Couldn't rebook, couldn't reach anyone. I bought a one way from AUS to RDU on American, and got home. In the end, SWA refunded my original ticket, reimbursed me for my AA fare and threw me a nice bonus in FF miles. They did right in my book. I do, however, feel for people who may not have been as fortunate to be able to afford a flight home, or did not have the transportation to get to an alternate airport.
Despite the hiccup, I still have no reservations about booking future trips on SWA if they are the most advantageous flight to my destination.
Not exactly. several factors - the plane tickets were significantly more expensive. Far fewer people existed - let alone, chose to fly, as it was a splurge. USA population before the internet (say, the 1990's) was 100 million less than now.
There were about half the passengers - annually - but NOT half the airplanes (something more than half) so planes were frequently half empty. Many hubs. Many routes. Many non-stops. Throughout the 90s, jet fuel was 10% the cost it is now.
Many - many - reasons - so, yup, "run pretty well" - but those days are gone. New reality. (Not sure if you were saying it's related to the internet or just using it as a timestamp - but either way...)
Two main things have collided here, modern times, 30% more people exist, and the "budget airline" has sprung into existence. Net result is busy, busy, busy - and if ya don't have the infrastructure to support it - you will eventually suffer.
Not exactly. several factors - the plane tickets were significantly more expensive. Far fewer people existed - let alone, chose to fly, as it was a splurge. USA population before the internet (say, the 1990's) was 100 million less than now.
There were about half the passengers - annually - but NOT half the airplanes (something more than half) so planes were frequently half empty. Many hubs. Many routes. Many non-stops. Throughout the 90s, jet fuel was 10% the cost it is now.
Many - many - reasons - so, yup, "run pretty well" - but those days are gone. New reality. (Not sure if you were saying it's related to the internet or just using it as a timestamp - but either way...)
Two main things have collided here, modern times, 30% more people exist, and the "budget airline" has sprung into existence. Net result is busy, busy, busy - and if ya don't have the infrastructure to support it - you will eventually suffer.
Budget airlines have always been around. I remember back in the day, everyone took that Iceland Air flight to Belgium because it was the cheapest way to get to Europe back in the ‘80s. I think Bill Bryson discussed it in his book and IIRC, I took it with my parents for my 2nd trip to Europe. Iceland Air is still budget and still going strong. I took budget airlines ATA during my college years and the prices were tickets were really cheap.
I think one main difference that people haven’t addressed is that through the ‘90s, most airlines had huge call center operations. That was still the primary way to book and change flights, so they had to have the personnel available to access the reservation systems. In my hometown, we had a big center for Northwest at the edge of the airport property. Once the internet became the primary way to make reservations, a lot of those centers closed down. This isn’t an issue with other airlines since you can easily go online and make changes. However, SWA is so outdated that you usually have to call to make changes.
When the entire system has to call in and you have only a small fraction of staff you had in the pre-internet days, that’s going to cause a total meltdown. This is especially the case when the system also includes pilots and flight attendants. There is an interesting NYTimes podcast available right now discussing it. It was so bad that SWA apparently had flight attendants and pilots sitting as passengers on planes willing to work but they weren’t able to get through to HQ to say that they could take over a slot of another pilot/flight attendant stuck in another city. That sort of scheduling was the stuff we had when I was working in call centers in the ‘90s- everyone had to submit stuff either by some phone system or some other system that was not yet automated/online. It’s ridiculous that in 25 years, that process has still not been updated.
Budget airlines have always been around. I remember back in the day, everyone took that Iceland Air flight to Belgium because it was the cheapest way to get to Europe back in the ‘80s. I think Bill Bryson discussed it in his book and IIRC, I took it with my parents for my 2nd trip to Europe. Iceland Air is still budget and still going strong. I took budget airlines ATA during my college years and the prices were tickets were really cheap.
I think one main difference that people haven’t addressed is that through the ‘90s, most airlines had huge call center operations. That was still the primary way to book and change flights, so they had to have the personnel available to access the reservation systems. In my hometown, we had a big center for Northwest at the edge of the airport property. Once the internet became the primary way to make reservations, a lot of those centers closed down. This isn’t an issue with other airlines since you can easily go online and make changes. However, SWA is so outdated that you usually have to call to make changes.
When the entire system has to call in and you have only a small fraction of staff you had in the pre-internet days, that’s going to cause a total meltdown. This is especially the case when the system also includes pilots and flight attendants. There is an interesting NYTimes podcast available right now discussing it. It was so bad that SWA apparently had flight attendants and pilots sitting as passengers on planes willing to work but they weren’t able to get through to HQ to say that they could take over a slot of another pilot/flight attendant stuck in another city. That sort of scheduling was the stuff we had when I was working in call centers in the ‘90s- everyone had to submit stuff either by some phone system or some other system that was not yet automated/online. It’s ridiculous that in 25 years, that process has still not been updated.
Don't forget People's Express and Tower Airlines, though they may have been a bit later.
shameful is a judgement.
safety, i think, is objective.
SWA has now had the "wake up call".
computers cost money to maintain.
pay LOTS of money to update
or LOTS people could die.
In what way would "LOTS people could die"?
I know SWA already spends a lot to maintain there computer systems - it was just one of the systems that is behind the scenes that was having issues coping with the changes.
The system impacted were routing and scheduling due to a weather storm during the holidays, nothing really to do with safety. These scheduling systems are very complicated - optimizing costs, revenue, pilot availability, plane usage and many other things - probably with lots of newer "patches" as requirements change. Reworking such a system may take years.
I know SWA already spends a lot to maintain there computer systems - it was just one of the systems that is behind the scenes that was having issues coping with the changes.
The system impacted were routing and scheduling due to a weather storm during the holidays, nothing really to do with safety. These scheduling systems are very complicated - optimizing costs, revenue, pilot availability, plane usage and many other things - probably with lots of newer "patches" as requirements change. Reworking such a system may take years.
Back of the envelope estimates I’ve seen to build a new scheduling system from scratch would run them $500 million to $1 billion. So 1-2 years of stockholder dividends in normally times.
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