White Flight just for whites? (Baltimore, Towson: section 8, apartment, co-op)

[Tinawina]

Continuation of an argument started in another thread. Have at it fellas!

[KLynch10]

Of course not, Baltimore County has seen a large growth in African Americans, and North Anne Arundel, and Howard have also seen a lot of flight from African American Baltimoreans. If anything there is almost a reverse right now as young whites and empty nesters are moving back into the city in big numbers... DC is almost majority white at this point... which is a huge change considering it's nickname is the Chocolate City.

[Woodlands]

Originally Posted by Tinawina

Continuation of an argument started in another thread. Have at it fellas!

White Flight is probably a dated term.. Now its just 'abandonment' or 'flight' since white people are not the only ones with wings(money to move)..

Now if a racial identifier is given its "white resettlement" which has been changed to the more PC though politically charged term "Gentrification". Here again.. it depends on the community. Gentrification could be racial change.. and/or economic. Federal Hill and Hampden could be good examples of Gentrified or Gentrifying..though more so based on income since most of the residents leaving were likely blue collar whites being replaced with upper income and younger white families (i.e. yuppies) It is also more gradual with many of the families passing their home on to their live in children who remain in the neighborhood for one reason or another which is different than what you see in say DC.. where people either take the money and move to the burbs, are forced out because of apartment conversions or inability to pay taxes and what not and ultimately could not afford to move back into the same neighborhood. That is not the usually the primary issue in Baltimore.

Then you have "redevelopment" which usually means all the old blighted housing stock/buildings are torn down and replaced with new buildings.. though the same income and sometimes the same residents move back into the neighborhood/development. Numerous public housing projects have undergone this type of process.. the co-op over in Sandtown Winchester in West Baltimore along Fulton may be a good example.


There is also "neighborhood revitalization" This is a mixture of Gentrification and Redevelopment.. where you have buildings torn down, new ones built, and potentially old ones rehabbed. The difference is that some of the existing residents or ones with similiar income move in/remain AND you have new usually middle or upper income residents move in as well.

Jonestown over on the eastside of downtown used to be a housing project and now is a mixed income community. It is probably a good example of a "neighborhood revitalization" deveopment.

So, "white flight" has morphed into a variety of other types of scenarios and housing choices and lifestlye changes and the driver is usually income/economics moreso than race.....IMHO

[goodlife36]

Who cares?

[Huckleberry3911948]

as AA moves up and out, they do identical behavior. u mean stay on the hood and get shot for their efforts to raise up the community? i dont think. so they move to a wasp neighborhood just like everybody else.

[gwillyfromphilly]

Originally Posted by KLynch10

Of course not, Baltimore County has seen a large growth in African Americans, and North Anne Arundel, and Howard have also seen a lot of flight from African American Baltimoreans. If anything there is almost a reverse right now as young whites and empty nesters are moving back into the city in big numbers... DC is almost majority white at this point... which is a huge change considering it's nickname is the Chocolate City.

Ironically the main reason Washington DC is called the "Chocolate City" is because of decades of white flight that started back in the 1950's.

[misterlou]

When I worked for a state agency I saw numerous examples of non-white white flight. I believe that in Baltimore white flight now means that anyone with enough means and the basic wherewithal gets out. This applies to white, black, and brown. As soon as you join the middle class you look around Baltimore City and say something like "This aint for me." And then you move to Randallstown, Towson, Pikesville, Owings Mills, Pasadena, or anywhere else you can afford where the schools are good enough to use.

I know that there are people of means in Baltimore who say they love it but I contend they are a small minority. Many of them have enough money that they can insulate themselves from the City's shortcomings. This means living in a deluxe neighborhood and paying to keep your kids and family separate from the riffraff. Others have just grown accustomed to some really awful conditions in the city.

[B.K.]

It has not been just "white flight" for a long time. I live in NE and many of the neighborhoods here have been inundated by former inner-city dwelling poor black families receiving Section 8. Many I have spoken to have informed me that they have been on waiting lists to receive Section 8 vouchers for county properties, but that the wait has become years long due to tens of thousands of others in their same situation seeking to flee downtown Baltimore. We're located less than a mile from the city/county line both north and east, so we're the next closest place to wait it out until something in the promised land becomes available.

Somewhat paradoxically, it seems that a large percentage of new city residents are young upwardly mobile white people intrigued by the City's vibe and amenities and the idea of urban living/renewal. Poke around this forum and you'll find quite a few of them, I gay-run-tee! Kind of funny when you think about it: poor black folks fleeing the selfsame city that upper-middle class white folks are fleeing suburbia to occupy.

[KLynch10]

I think there is a natural desire to live an adult life opposite of what you grew up around. Most younger white people lived in the suburbs growing up, now they want to live in the cities, our parents lived in the cities. Many African Americans grew up in the city, and now want something different.

With that said, yuppies, hipsters, and other are not exclusively white. I've had many African American friends in Federal Hill and every time I go to Hampden, I always see many African American Hipsters, as well as every other race in both areas. There are also aren't a lot of blue collar whites moving back to the cities, it's mostly college educated people of all races.

[MrRational]

Originally Posted by B.K.

Somewhat paradoxically, it seems that a large percentage of new city residents are young upwardly mobile white people intrigued by the City's vibe and amenities and the idea of urban living/renewal. Poke around this forum and you'll find quite a few of them, I gay-run-tee!

For the singles and dinks? No doubt.

The problem remains though for when rug-rats start showing up.
At some point between kindergarten and about 4th... you're back to that economic migration again.
Well, unless they can afford private tuition.