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Old 01-14-2020, 12:10 PM
 
Location: ✶✶✶✶
15,216 posts, read 30,558,979 times
Reputation: 10851

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack Lance View Post
BTW The 2017 Astro's had a better road record than home record check it out for yourselves.
They also had a higher BA/OBP/SLG/OPS and more home runs.

The Astros did strike out a hundred or so times less at home, but that's not an abnormal deviation. It stands to reason you're going to swing and miss and/or take called third strikes less in a ballpark where you're familiar, where you're tuned to that batters eye background etc. as opposed to elsewhere.

In 2017 over 2016, there were much fewer chases outside the zone, which has often been mentioned. What's not mentioned is exactly how the whistling/banging could convey both type of pitch and location.





The home/away splits for the regular season What the Astros might have actually done is a sort of longform Mythbusters episode that showed that intercepting catcher signs might not actually create more offense, kind of like how that show experimented with corking bats and finding out that it makes the bat lighter, but doesn't actually impart any more carry because of lower density, and a greater likelihood of breaking.

The numbers are different for the postseason, but that's also a much smaller sample size.




None of that really is going to matter in the court of public opinion. In every way, the scheme appears to have been unnecessary.

The only thing it clearly achieved is the destruction of the franchise's reputhesults.

That's what I have a problem with. That and the sheer thickheadedness. Having executives send out mass emails(!) discussing placements of cameras in the stands? In the end, the crime was acute stupidity.

Hinch and Luhnow are suspended for, basically, what was referred to a "lack of institutional control" in the case of Joe Paterno and the Penn State president not doing something about their chomo ex-defensive coordinator. That was several orders of magnitude more serious than stealing signs in a baseball game, but the same principle applies. In the Wall Street world, they would have just gotten a $15 million golden parachute complete with stock options so they can profit later off the firm's recovery once someone else fixes it, and basically just spend the rest of their lives slamming coke and hookers if they want and never go back to work if they don't want. Not everything can be like that, though. That's definitely not how it works for you or me.
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Old 01-14-2020, 12:23 PM
 
Location: Parts Unknown, Northern California
48,564 posts, read 24,122,692 times
Reputation: 21239
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfre81 View Post
They also had a higher BA/OBP/SLG/OPS and more home runs.

The Astros did strike out a hundred or so times less at home, but that's not an abnormal deviation. It stands to reason you're going to swing and miss and/or take called third strikes less in a ballpark where you're familiar, where you're tuned to that batters eye background etc. as opposed to elsewhere.
.
It is not an abnormal deviation, but studies have discovered that the deviation is a product of umpires favoring the home team in close calls. Umpires are human beings and they are subject to the intimidation of the crowds, so they have unconsciously tended to favor the home team. That study is among the reasons that MLB decided to go with replay reviews for calls in the field, and within a few years, will start using cameras and electronics to call balls and strikes.
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Old 01-14-2020, 12:31 PM
 
Location: California
2,211 posts, read 2,616,055 times
Reputation: 2136
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfre81 View Post
Should they issue a recall of all the replica championship rings they handed out on at least two occasions?

No, can't recall things already sold, just can't sell anything resembling a championship going forward. This will go down in history as the most disgraced championship in professional sports.

Fans who have a replica championship rings will own a ring they will be too ashamed to wear.
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Old 01-14-2020, 12:38 PM
 
Location: ✶✶✶✶
15,216 posts, read 30,558,979 times
Reputation: 10851
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grandstander View Post
It is not an abnormal deviation, but studies have discovered that the deviation is a product of umpires favoring the home team in close calls. Umpires are human beings and they are subject to the intimidation of the crowds, so they have unconsciously tended to favor the home team. That study is among the reasons that MLB decided to go with replay reviews for calls in the field, and within a few years, will start using cameras and electronics to call balls and strikes.
I can buy that too. Either way, stealing signs wouldn't have affected how umpires call balls and strikes.

Really this is a perception over reality thing. Perception is reality in the court of public opinion.
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Old 01-15-2020, 05:07 PM
Status: "We need America back!" (set 2 days ago)
 
Location: Suburban Dallas
52,688 posts, read 47,955,803 times
Reputation: 33845
All the Astros can do now is go forward. They've still got a division-winning group of guys. They just need now to go out and play clean ball (which they are certainly capable of) and make fans believe and not lose hope.

By the way, I've got a great suggestion for the next general manager in case they don't hire from within. He's a familiar name to Houston fans. He's also responsible for the success of Jose Altuve, Dallas Keuchel, and George Springer, and a big reason they're in the league.


Know who that is??



None other than...............................Ed Wade.

Hey, why not? He's available. Why not just bring him back? He's earned a reputation as one of baseball's best drafters.
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Old 01-16-2020, 09:13 AM
 
Location: California
2,211 posts, read 2,616,055 times
Reputation: 2136
Quote:
Originally Posted by case44 View Post
All the Astros can do now is go forward. They've still got a division-winning group of guys. They just need now to go out and play clean ball (which they are certainly capable of) and make fans believe and not lose hope.

By the way, I've got a great suggestion for the next general manager in case they don't hire from within. He's a familiar name to Houston fans. He's also responsible for the success of Jose Altuve, Dallas Keuchel, and George Springer, and a big reason they're in the league.


Know who that is??



None other than...............................Ed Wade.

Hey, why not? He's available. Why not just bring him back? He's earned a reputation as one of baseball's best drafters.
Do they? We don't know how they will perform without cheating. That goes for Altuve too!! Lets see how they do this year.
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Old 01-16-2020, 11:28 AM
 
Location: ✶✶✶✶
15,216 posts, read 30,558,979 times
Reputation: 10851
Quote:
Originally Posted by Just One of the Guys View Post
Do they? We don't know how they will perform without cheating. That goes for Altuve too!! Lets see how they do this year.
Did Altuve's career begin in 2017, or are you implying that the sign stealing started well before 2017 like Altuve's career did?

It's probably worth mentioning here that he won two of the previous three AL batting titles, nobody else in baseball had more hits than he did from 2014-16, and he hit the same amount of home runs in '17 as he did the year before, except he actually struck out more in '17.

Also, we're just speculating that they must have been cheating somehow last year in a way that MLB doesn't know about yet, which is probably not that likely considering they've interrogated just about everyone in the organization.
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Old 01-16-2020, 01:40 PM
 
Location: USA
6,904 posts, read 3,742,467 times
Reputation: 3499
The latest trending on SM has the Astros wearing buzzers inside their jerseys, including Altuve's homer off Chapman.
If thats true, WOW!
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Old 01-16-2020, 04:01 PM
 
Location: Beautiful Northwest Houston
6,292 posts, read 7,500,301 times
Reputation: 5061
Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveM85 View Post
The latest trending on SM has the Astros wearing buzzers inside their jerseys, including Altuve's homer off Chapman.
If thats true, WOW!
The Commissioners report stated the scheme ended during the 2018 season before the playoffs that year. So Chapman can rest assured he gave up a legitimate gofer ball....
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Old 01-16-2020, 04:21 PM
Status: "We need America back!" (set 2 days ago)
 
Location: Suburban Dallas
52,688 posts, read 47,955,803 times
Reputation: 33845
Alright, y'all, MLB's investigation is over, so let's move on from all this. I'm ready as I'll be for Spring Training.
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