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After 10 years being snow-birds on the Big Island Puna district. We have sold our island cottage and will not be returning except maybe as a tourist (come back to visit with friends). We sold due to health reasons as we have to be closer to medical facilities by our mainland home but mainly, We really did not feel the so called Aloha, we think some (not all)locals are just plain rude for the most part, nor do we like the bugs, humidity and the constant maintenance of upkeep on a home in the tropics.
We do not have a mainland attitude we are from a small town of less then population of 400 but grows to the 1,000's in the summer time due to tourist season. We are polite, respectful people who nod our head and smile as we pass by people that is how we were raised.
These are just A couple of things that has happened to us just recently that are fresh in my mind - over the past 10 years there has been plenty more instances such as this but will just mention these few as they just happened within the last year. Yes we are white.. (so already the wrong color skin).
Standing in Line to check out at Hilo, Target, with my spouse, it was a pretty busy day in the store, we waited our turn patiently. It finally was our turn and we are now next inline to check out and there is a rather long line behind us also. Just then a local just barges in front of us does not say anything like "excuse me" or "do you mind if I go first" or anything. just barges in front of us like we were not even there doesn't even look at us and places her items to get checked out. The cashier looks stunned and says to us "I'm sorry ~ I'll check this person out first they only have a couple items". We did not say a word.. just stood there in shock, we waited for her to check out and then we proceeded to check out!! But boy when we got in our vehicle we had plenty to say... even if it was just to each other.
Fast forward SAME thing happens in Malama Market in Pahoa... same exact thing. Long line waiting in line, our turn and wham local just barges in front of us.. no eye contact, does not say anything just barges in and ignores us like we are not even there and checks out ahead of us.
Just the other day... HomeDepot went to purchase a washing machine. Was in appliances and one worker there in that department I asked a couple questions. They answered politely and I continued browsing the various washing machines, the person I spoke with they disappeared. When I found the washer I was interested in purchasing. I waited for someone to come around and no one did about 15 minutes I waited. I seen a worker sitting by a computer and asked if there was someone in appliances I could speak with about a purchase. She said yes "me" but currently I am on the phone placing a sale. I said no problem I am not in a hurry.. Worker stays on the phone, I can hear the conversation it is about kids, pets, a bunch of things just talking story. I patiently waited.. another 30 minutes go by and she finally gets off the phone and then waves for someone else to come over (a local who was also a customer but was only waiting a few minutes) the worker knew I was standing there waiting for her she looked at me multiple times during my wait and already acknowledged me about half an hour ago . She then proceeded to sit with the other customer and place an order for a refrigerator after the order was placed. They proceeded to talk story about doctors appointments, grand kids etc. sometimes looking over at me and then just looking away and continuing to talk story. I waited patiently for another half hour or so. Now it has been well over an hour and I am still waiting to order the washing machine. I get tired of waiting and go to the front desk customer service to see if they can help me place an order. They send me back to appliances.. I go back to appliances and the girl who Initially spoke to who disappeared - reappeared. Apologized to me and said I can't believe no one has helped you. Were you waiting all this time? i said yes I guess they were busy or something. She placed my order for the washing machine and I went on my way. I waited for over an hour and a half just to place an order for a washing machine and the local worker by the phone it was obvious she was ignoring me, again just plain rude people.
Nothing in these instances above were anyway caused from us having a "mainland" attitude.. nada, nothing. It was just plain rudeness and we experienced instances such as above quite a few times over the years. We kept our cool during each instance and bit our tongue as we were taught to turn the other cheek. The only times we were really happy on the island is if we just stayed at our cottage and did not go out in public or we sat down along the ocean somewhere.
With that being said Hawaii is a nice place to visit and vacation but for us anyways.. no way would we ever, ever want to actually live here again. It is not paradise it might be beautiful scenery wise (some areas) but then so are areas of the mainland. There are places on the mainland that we feel are more paradise then the Big Island East side will ever be. Plus we always felt like we were on a rock even though the big island is fairly big it still is an island there are only so many places one can go and its extremely crowded with people and lots of crime island wide.
I really do not expect everyone to agree with me but I think some can relate to our experiences. Yes, we have met some really nice people on the island and have made some life long friends but generally the locals if they don't know you are "rude, rude, rude". ... at least that is how we feel.
We sold our island home we have one week left on island and then we can move on to exploring other areas of this beautiful world.
There are lots of places that are paradise!
I posted this same post on another topic in this forum.. Wasn't sure which OP it was best suited for.
I have seen lots of episodes of dreamers whose dreams where shattered by whatever circumstances thay ran into, and started a thread on CD to that effect. Most are a bit emotional and resentful.
There is a group of posters here who will chime in, say, if effect, that it MUST by the OP's fault, because they never, or only rarely, ever experience anything but aloha and never have any such problems.
To be honest, I tend to believe the OPs and their experiences far more than I believe those who place the blame on them with their "gee, we never have experienced anything but aloha" rebuttal posts - especially on the BI. I love Hawaii, but the culture?.... Not so much. However, I make an exception for the Japanese and a few other asian communities who, IMHO, are fine people and a credit to the islands.
Greetings all,
We may be new to the forum but not to the Big Island. Was wondering after a few years here and not receiving anything close to the true Aloha that we sold all for, has anyone else received less than favorable responses to this place? Has anyone else experienced a level of hypocrisy and hatred that in even times of war the enemy has been friendlier than these so called island folk?
Curiosity has this cat tangled in the very ball of yarn it was given shortly after stepping off the plane. Thanks in advance for your truthful comments and experiences.
Actually, considering how many billions of dollars the Hawaii Visitor's Bureau has spent over the years to promote Hawaii as some sort of Paradise, it's probably not unreasonable to expect folks to be expecting perhaps something other than what they meet up with when they arrive here. FWIW, if you're just visiting, you're much more likely to meet up with the HVB's version of Hawaii. As for the rest of us, we don't live in Paradise, no matter what the HVB promotes.
And, as the locals say, "what goes around, comes around".
Actually, considering how many billions of dollars the Hawaii Visitor's Bureau has spent over the years to promote Hawaii as some sort of Paradise
Billions would be a stretch since they spend about $150 Million annually and were formed in 1999. That number is only that high in recent years due to record spending at hotels/visitors. About 1/3 of the money is used to promote the convention center.
Considering Hawaii is currently a $17 Billion a year tourist industry, seems money well spent.
150 million times ten years is still a lot of money spent trying to promote Hawaii as Paradise. Hmm, that's still only about $1 per person if we go on a population basis, so I suppose it's a good thing.
It still kinda promotes the "Paradise" mythos and raises expectations sometimes to levels that are hard to sustain. I suppose as visitors, Hawaii can seem like Paradise, but then we get those poor misguided souls who want to move here and live in vacation land Hawaii Paradise expecting it to be a reality. Which is where the OP got tangled up, perhaps?
Haven't you been doing HR, Vipe? Any idea of how many of your relocated mainland employees show up expecting some sort of island paradise?
Any idea of how many of your relocated mainland employees show up expecting some sort of island paradise?
The issue tends to be less of an expectation of an island paradise - as, after the honeymoon period ends, reality sets in. Many can't handle the smaller place (even though they thought they could initially), the lower pay gets to them, not having visitors (because they often can't stay at their place), difficulty making friends, rock fever, workplace culture, and traffic - are just some of things that don't make these transient workers stay beyond 1 to 2 years. Quite frankly, if we repeat these spring/summer/fall temperatures - that'll be another item added to the list.
...was talking story about this very thing at the swap meet in O.V yesterday, someone brought up 'that 75% of the people that move to Hawai'i with the expressed intention of staying pack up and leave within two years'...i poked around a bit looking for some stats...this number seems pretty high, was wondering if it's even close to the actual statistic...
...was talking story about this very thing at the swap meet in O.V yesterday, someone brought up 'that 75% of the people that move to Hawai'i with the expressed intention of staying pack up and leave within two years'...i poked around a bit looking for some stats...this number seems pretty high, was wondering if it's even close to the actual statistic...
I've worked at 2 large employers in Hawaii and the number is closer to 90%. About 50% leave at year 1 when the lease is up to be renewed. Then all but the remaining 10% leave at year 2. If they stick it out that long, they often stay. This is for the 18-55 age range.
I suspect retiree's and the 55+ crowd have a much higher retention rate of more than 2 years (if they live that long)
I dunno, Nyfinestbxtf, in a small town everyone seems to not only know everyone but their relatives as well. We all socialize with each other and do a lot of things with our neighbors as well. Perhaps because we are so remote and it's a lot nicer sharing the hour's drive to Costco or the forty five minute ride to the beach? There's only two days a week anymore where our family doesn't have some sort of social group to meet up with if we want. Everyone seems to be meeting up at the local farmer's market and having breakfast on the weekend now. If the pool would ever open again, there'd be another two dozen friends we'd see again on a regular basis although we also see them in other places, but the pool gave us more time to socialize than on the town's sidewalk.
As for the OP, I'd guess they didn't quite get into the giving part of being in the islands. The island society here doesn't take or trade, they give which can be seen as 'aloha', I suppose? But, not to folks who only take, there needs to be a give back or the giving stops. It doesn't have to be an even exchange or even a material item for a material item, but there needs to be some sort of give back of some sort and not just take, take, take all the time. When we all give from abundance, everyone has abundance but most folks don't have a lot so they can't afford to give things with nothing coming back. Someone gives extra fruit, they receive effusive thanks and help unloading the truck is an even exchange, even though the person receiving had no material goods to give back.
That's partly why it's good to be established. During avocado season, everyone we know gets avocados. Various other extras flow out as well, but for us the majority of extra is the avocados. Which are seasonal so even though folks give us various things during the rest of the year, they know that when the avos are ripe, they will be getting avos and we aren't just taking without returning. It's not a stated exchange, there's no "I'll trade you these extra tomatoes for avocados later", it's just that they will give the surplus tomatoes and then when we have surplus avocados, we give back. The exchange starts by giving, not negotiations. If folks are receiving and not giving anything back, then the aloha vanishes.
I think hotcatz puts it well. And it's not only big island but for all of hawaii. might sound cliche, but many times it is the thought that counts, moreso than the dollar value. if your neighbor goes on vacation, offer to help keep an eye on the house, take in the newspaper, or whatever. Island living can be tough, but it's better if people try to help each other out. This more than physical presense helps establish you as a "local"
I've worked at 2 large employers in Hawaii and the number is closer to 90%. About 50% leave at year 1 when the lease is up to be renewed. Then all but the remaining 10% leave at year 2. If they stick it out that long, they often stay. This is for the 18-55 age range.
I suspect retiree's and the 55+ crowd have a much higher retention rate of more than 2 years (if they live that long)
There's a net outflow of our younger 20-30 educated crowd. And a net inflow of mainland dreamers. If it wasn't for immigration from the mainland, hawaii's population would be declining yearly. Increasingly, the population is consisting of younger people (many on government assistance) and older people (many on government assistance). The middle class is shrinking.
I think you're right that the retired crowd that has money has a greater chance to stay, while the younger crowd finds out how tough it is, and leaves within 2 years.
have you looked at oahu? or too metropolitan for you? Outer islands is very different, and the pace is very slow. If you can't get used to that, you'll hate it. People drive slow, are slow to checkout or do errands because they want to shoot the breeze in the checkout line holding the entire thing up, people think slow, etc etc. Sometimes the slower pace is nice, but for me, it's too much. Makes more sense to move to outer islands as a retiree that has tons of free time on their hands.
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