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Old 04-28-2018, 01:29 PM
 
Location: Atlanta, Birmingham, Charlotte, and Raleigh
2,580 posts, read 2,485,733 times
Reputation: 1614

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https://www.bizjournals.com/birmingh...ners-over.html

Quote:
Two landowners have sued the city of Hoover over a 2016 decision to rezone 273 acres near Patton Creek Shopping Center that were being eyed for an apartment development. Landowners Meade Whitaker Jr. and Frances W. Schoonover filed the lawsuit earlier this month in U.S. District Court. Defendants are the city of Hoover, as well as members of the Hoover City Council who voted in favor of the rezoning.

The lawsuit claims the decision to rezone the bulk of the property from an R4 residential designation – which would have allowed a planned apartment development – to a commercial use designation violated their property rights.
Now this can get very messy, very quickly. The reluctance of other jurisdictions aside from Birmingham from allowing new multifamily residential developments could cost them more than they realize in the long run (financially and feasibility of future growth wise). This is the same site that has sat vacant for over a decade adjacent to the Patton Creek development when the original developers of the development opted to not expand upon the site. Instead the owners wanted to put apartments on the site since the zoning already supported this, but Hoover took it upon itself to upzone the site.

I'm only loosely familiar with Alabama zoning law, you cannot upzone a site without proper notice and consent of the owner unless it is tied to a master plan. This does not appear to be the case, so Hoover could wind up losing millions of dollars and wind up sending a message statewide that spot rezoning without documented justification may not be the wisest thing for a jurisdiction to attempt.

Also it will be very embarrassing since Hoover looks to be in trying to avoid a financial deficit because of lack of economic growth. Hoover is currently working on a citywide master plan that will make the jurisdiction more appealing to young professionals and thoes whom want smart growth urbanism of walkability and live/work/play without having to reside in Birmingham proper. Economic development that appeals to millennials and young professionals are not exactly fond of dealing with places that discourage multifamily development. Many young professionals are just trying to find a hip, cool place have possesses a variety of housing choices from smaller lot, single-family to multifamily residential lofts, condos, townhouses, and apartments that is walkable and safe activity centers.
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Old 04-29-2018, 11:55 AM
 
Location: Ayy Tee Ell by way of MS, TN, AL and FL
1,717 posts, read 1,987,200 times
Reputation: 3052
I know Hoover is in the midst of that new master plan, but honestly I think they are making a huge mistake if they choose to do the urbanism/walkability thing. People already have a better version of that (Birmingham, Homewood, and to an extent Bessemer if you're talking about urban core). That is not Hoover's strength. Hoover's strength is tied to the family and recreation - more bike paths, green spaces, and sidewalk's in certain locations, like Riverchase.

Hoover doesn't need or want the apartments.
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Old 04-29-2018, 02:18 PM
 
Location: Atlanta, Birmingham, Charlotte, and Raleigh
2,580 posts, read 2,485,733 times
Reputation: 1614
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mississippi Alabama Line View Post
I know Hoover is in the midst of that new master plan, but honestly I think they are making a huge mistake if they choose to do the urbanism/walkability thing. People already have a better version of that (Birmingham, Homewood, and to an extent Bessemer if you're talking about urban core). That is not Hoover's strength. Hoover's strength is tied to the family and recreation - more bike paths, green spaces, and sidewalk's in certain locations, like Riverchase.

Hoover doesn't need or want the apartments.
The current leadership of Hoover wants to remain a principal city of the metro rather than being replaced by Tuscaloosa with the likelihood of the two metro/consolidated areas merging in the very near future. Hoover could really use some infill and redevelopment along Montgomery Highway, Lorna Road, and John Hawkins Parkway corridors. Most of those areas are at lease a decade old and will eventually have to be redeveloped into a mixed use. Hoover's leadership is using style of citywide master planning that places like Altamonte Springs, Florida and Franklin, Tennessee. That style of master planning/smart growth those places are using to convert its underutilized commercial corridors into mixed used, multimodal corridors with a mixture of commercial, multifamily residential, and offices, maintaining its dominance as an employment hub, while preserving its suburban, community character in the residential areas. It can be done if the leadership maintains that the vision rather not saying no to any infill multifamily residential development.
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Old 04-29-2018, 07:22 PM
 
Location: Ayy Tee Ell by way of MS, TN, AL and FL
1,717 posts, read 1,987,200 times
Reputation: 3052
Quote:
Originally Posted by jero23 View Post
The current leadership of Hoover wants to remain a principal city of the metro rather than being replaced by Tuscaloosa with the likelihood of the two metro/consolidated areas merging in the very near future. Hoover could really use some infill and redevelopment along Montgomery Highway, Lorna Road, and John Hawkins Parkway corridors. Most of those areas are at lease a decade old and will eventually have to be redeveloped into a mixed use. Hoover's leadership is using style of citywide master planning that places like Altamonte Springs, Florida and Franklin, Tennessee. That style of master planning/smart growth those places are using to convert its underutilized commercial corridors into mixed used, multimodal corridors with a mixture of commercial, multifamily residential, and offices, maintaining its dominance as an employment hub, while preserving its suburban, community character in the residential areas. It can be done if the leadership maintains that the vision rather not saying no to any infill multifamily residential development.
It can't hurt I guess. I'd be willing to bet any new multi-family stuff will have to be higher end, not cookie cutter crap like they have now.

Hoover definitely needs to get out of the 90s. I don't know much about Altamonte Springs, but Hoover doesn't seem to have much in common with Franklin, TN, does it? Maybe it does. I just think trying to develop a 'downtown' in Hoover is a futile effort.

I think we've got a ways to go before talking about any real merger of Tuscaloosa and Hoover. By ways, I mean like 50 more years. Tuscaloosa isn't even in the same MSA.
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Old 04-30-2018, 07:15 AM
 
Location: Atlanta, Birmingham, Charlotte, and Raleigh
2,580 posts, read 2,485,733 times
Reputation: 1614
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mississippi Alabama Line View Post
It can't hurt I guess. I'd be willing to bet any new multi-family stuff will have to be higher end, not cookie cutter crap like they have now.

Hoover definitely needs to get out of the 90s. I don't know much about Altamonte Springs, but Hoover doesn't seem to have much in common with Franklin, TN, does it? Maybe it does. I just think trying to develop a 'downtown' in Hoover is a futile effort.

I think we've got a ways to go before talking about any real merger of Tuscaloosa and Hoover. By ways, I mean like 50 more years. Tuscaloosa isn't even in the same MSA.
When I am mean 'principal city', I'm referencing how the metro area is Birmingham-Hoover metropolitan area and the consolidated area is Birmingham-Hoover-Talladega consolidated statistical area (CSA) per the Office of Management and Budget (OMB). Cullman got bumped from the principal city title with the 2013 designations. Tuscaloosa (county) is likely to merge into the CSA in the next decade since the economic ties between Bibb, Tuscaloosa, and Jefferson are intertwined with the major expansion of the Mercedes-Benz facility. I'm not talking about the municipalities of Hoover and Tuscaloosa themselves per say when I am making that reference.

Now, the point of a 'downtown' for Hoover, that is needed. The reason why suburbs run into major problems in the 2000s are the fact they have no sense of place. A 'Main Street with a town/city center" is needed since the place is well beyond its growth for growing sake phase of existence. You see former bedroom communities of major cities nationwide that are now basically interurban suburbs like Hoover redevelop and create a central 'gather' place with green space in the community to host events. The best location would be along Montgomery Highway between Lorna Road and I-459 to provide a centralized location for the community. Dunwoody and Sandy Springs, GA would be other great examples for Hoover to look towards since those communities have historically lacking town centers or downtowns, but are planning and developing such now. Hoover can learn from those examples as well like the other two places Altamonte Springs and Franklin, they are major employment centers in the suburban areas of their respective regions.

On multifamily residential developments, those should accommodate working class to upper middle class households. You cannot legislate out working class households because all it does cause a housing problem that Hoover nor the metro area should be dealing with dealing this time of metro area's aggressive recruitment of economic development. We all like what we like, but we have to remember that the purpose of region is to be welcoming to all types so the region can grow and thrive in the eyes of the potential major businesses and economic sustainability.
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Old 04-30-2018, 10:04 AM
 
Location: Ayy Tee Ell by way of MS, TN, AL and FL
1,717 posts, read 1,987,200 times
Reputation: 3052
Quote:
Originally Posted by jero23 View Post
The best location would be along Montgomery Highway between Lorna Road and I-459 to provide a centralized location for the community.
I agree with this is theory. I just question the practicality of it. I would expand that all the way down to Valleydale Road.

Here's the issue though. You have Ross Bridge, which is Hoover. You have Preserve, also Hoover. You have the area we're talking about around the Galleria. You have Bluff Park. You have Veterans Park and the little finger through neighborhoods between Valleydale and I-459 on the east side of I-65. Then you have the 280 sprawl and Greystone areas to the extreme east. My point, is it even possible to have a sense of community in one place?

That being said, east of I-65 is what it is. It's most residential and will always be until you get to 280, which is sprawl and will continue to be. So yeah, maybe a downtown Hoover development could be attained in the area we speak of above. I hope it is.

Hoover started as the Galleria. May as well build the downtown close to it.
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Old 04-30-2018, 02:21 PM
 
Location: Atlanta, Birmingham, Charlotte, and Raleigh
2,580 posts, read 2,485,733 times
Reputation: 1614
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mississippi Alabama Line View Post
I agree with this is theory. I just question the practicality of it. I would expand that all the way down to Valleydale Road.

Here's the issue though. You have Ross Bridge, which is Hoover. You have Preserve, also Hoover. You have the area we're talking about around the Galleria. You have Bluff Park. You have Veterans Park and the little finger through neighborhoods between Valleydale and I-459 on the east side of I-65. Then you have the 280 sprawl and Greystone areas to the extreme east. My point, is it even possible to have a sense of community in one place?

That being said, east of I-65 is what it is. It's most residential and will always be until you get to 280, which is sprawl and will continue to be. So yeah, maybe a downtown Hoover development could be attained in the area we speak of above. I hope it is.

Hoover started as the Galleria. May as well build the downtown close to it.
Exactly! The area along Montgomery Highway is destined become the Hoover City Center. I recall over a decade ago the Regional Planning Commission of Greater Birmingham (RPCGB) was pushing for a citywide transportation plan including a road diet with a dedicated multimodal path (walkway) and bicycle lane for both sides of Montgomery Highway from Lorna Road to John Hawkins Parkway, but the former mayor and ALDOT pushed back and killed the idea. I can bet that that will come back as an idea this time around along with the push for sidewalks along Lorna Road, Acton Road, John Hawkins Parkway, Rocky Ridge Road, Patton Chapel Road, Chapel Lane, and Altadena Road. All of these roads are collectors and/or arterial roads that lead to major points of interest and/or schools. The funds are clearly there also with the Safe Routes to Schools program and available funds to be provide from the metropolitan planning organization (MPO) at RPCGB along with the required 20% match from Hoover itself.
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