Things that Birmingham wants/should have...what would you like to see? Suggest it and let's make it happen!!! (section 8, condos)

[3am green coffee]

Originally Posted by bluebeard

Ideally, this and other metro areas would have metro regional gov'ts, so every city and county would cooperate instead of over-competing. but we're a long way off from anything like that happening.

It's a long way off because: Who would really want to take on Birmingham's problems and be governed by Birmingham's incompetents? It's much safer for the other localities in the metro area to keep Birmingham's politicians and irritations isolated inside the Birmingham city limits.

[cpg35223]

Originally Posted by pvjd

Maybe you can get together with Langford and figure out a way to get all that done, and how to pay for it. I think that these are all things that would be nice if they just suddenly appeared in our Christmas stocking, but I am not convinced of the practicality of it. Another thing I think of is that if downtown becomes gentrified with lofts and martini lounges, what will become of all the facilities and networks that are there to help the homeless and mentally ill? What about affordable housing? If people can't afford to live there, homelessness will increase, and all the metrolites will want the safehavens and centers for homeless and mentally ill people out of their back yards. I agree that downtown should not be a wasteland, and in my opinion there is no excuse for it. I just worry about what will happen to those that are not able to support themselves otherwise.

Well, there are no houses downtown, if you discount the Hope VI project, which has performed miracles for the area's character. Maybe a few row houses toward the western fringe of downtown, but not much beyond that.

As far as all that other stuff, Birmingham has just sat here for decades and parrotted just what you just posted, while cities such as Nashville, Jacksonville, and Tampa have surpassed us. That is just a lack of vision on the part of the civic leadership and our people.

[pvjd]

There are a lot of apartments, and if you go down north ave, and west and east Birmingham, there are a lot of houses. You have to look for them, but they exist. Even the housing projects have families, and good people who are in need of a roof over their head.

[3am green coffee]

You know what I wish Birmingham had?

A Polish or Ukrainian restaurant.

Why don't we have an eastern European diner, like you find in New York? Peirogies, latkas, kielbasa, kraut, stuffed cabbage, challah bread french toast...

I'm hungry.

While we're at it, we need an Ethiopian place too. People here could learn to eat with their fingers.

And a regular old-fashioned American diner. I'm really looking forward to the arrival of the Cheyenne Diner. The Cheyenne is an old free-standing dining car restaurant on the west side of Manhattan. It had to be moved to make way for a condo development. The owner sold it to a guy here in Birmingham, Joel Owens, who is supposed to be putting the building on a truck and bringing it here to operate as a restaurant somewhere on Birmingham's east side. Birmingham has plenty of "meat and three" places, but they're not quite the same thing as diner food.

I just hope the Cheyenne is run like a real diner, open 24 hours with a real diner menu and reasonable prices. I'm afraid he'll try to upscale it and make it a meta-diner like John's. I also hope he doesn't store the thing on his car lot and leave it there for ten years without ever opening it.

[Saintmarks]

Originally Posted by pvjd

Maybe you can get together with Langford and figure out a way to get all that done, and how to pay for it. I think that these are all things that would be nice if they just suddenly appeared in our Christmas stocking, but I am not convinced of the practicality of it. Another thing I think of is that if downtown becomes gentrified with lofts and martini lounges, what will become of all the facilities and networks that are there to help the homeless and mentally ill? What about affordable housing? If people can't afford to live there, homelessness will increase, and all the metrolites will want the safehavens and centers for homeless and mentally ill people out of their back yards. I agree that downtown should not be a wasteland, and in my opinion there is no excuse for it. I just worry about what will happen to those that are not able to support themselves otherwise.

Let them go to Mountain Brook!

(and eat cake)

Just look east at Atanta, plenty of development in the city center, plenty of urban loft and highrise condo development, many gentrified neighborhoods, but the poor and homeless are still there. Atlanta has seen a huge population growth in this decade, 100,000+ since the 2000 census, white percentage of the city population has increased as people are returning to the city in large numbers for the first time since the 50s.

My main fault with Birmingham as a city and as a metro area is how segragated it is. Red Mountain is a racial wall. It has to be the most segregated city (meaning metro area) in the south, both in terms of race and economic status.

I don't have statistics to back this up, perhaps it is the perception caused by the physical presence of Red Mountain, but I don't know any other city that has such a night and day difference as when you cross that ridge.

[SouthernBoy205]

A domed stadium-might need to have 70,000-80,000 seats to support large sporting events such as the Magic City Classic

5-10 40+ skyscrapers downtown-a nice skyline but could stand to be a lot taller

More healthy and good in the west, north, and east-nice growth, but too much growth is focused in the south creating an unbalanced metro in terms of population

Widened all urban/suburban interstates to 8+ lanes along with HOV lanes-metro interstates are terrible and are smaller: need to widened I-65 to 8+ lanes from north Chilton County to a few miles beyond Gardendale, need to widened I-20/59 to 8 lanes from the I-459 junction to Fairfield, need to widened I-459 all over to 8+ lanes, need to widened I-20 6-8 lanes to Pell City (widening already proposed), and need to widened I-59 to 6-8 lanes from the junction with I-20 to Gadsden

A beltline around Birmingham-needs a beltine around Birmingham: going through north Jefferson, parts of east Tuscaloosa, central Shelby, and west Saint Clair counties

A mass transit system that serves the whole metro-needs a mst that would serve the entire metro, including Saint Clair County

Need to attract a diverse population-needs a diversed metro area with different races owning local businesses

Need a mega mall and an aquarium-needs to attract different venues that will spark more tourism

Need to fix up the bad areas within the city limits-need atractive neighborhoods with parks, better roads, more services, more development, improved crime, and better schools

Need a better government-needs a better government that will run the city and metro into a brighter future

Need to improve the airport-although the airport is going to be improved and expanded, it still needs to be bigger and better; may need to be moved to Shelby County or to some spots in Jefferson County

Need to improve highway 280-need to build the limited access portion on top to help relieve traffic and stress; need to convince the residents north of I-459 that they need the limited access portion; and need to widened it beyond Chelsea

[pvjd]

Originally Posted by Saintmarks

Let them go to Mountain Brook!

(and eat cake)

Just look east at Atanta, plenty of development in the city center, plenty of urban loft and highrise condo development, many gentrified neighborhoods, but the poor and homeless are still there. Atlanta has seen a huge population growth in this decade, 100,000+ since the 2000 census, white percentage of the city population has increased as people are returning to the city in large numbers for the first time since the 50s.

My main fault with Birmingham as a city and as a metro area is how segragated it is. Red Mountain is a racial wall. It has to be the most segregated city (meaning metro area) in the south, both in terms of race and economic status.

I don't have statistics to back this up, perhaps it is the perception caused by the physical presence of Red Mountain, but I don't know any other city that has such a night and day difference as when you cross that ridge.

I see your point, it is just that Birmingham is much smaller than Atlanta. There have been a few homeless people spotted and rounded up in Hoover and Vestavia in the past year or so, and I think it is because downtown is focusing less on services to help them (I know it is not a popular stance, but not everybody is capable of doing for themselves, especially when there is mental illness and years of drug addiction), and more on the highrise developments, etc. Even though the cheap housing and shelters might be an eyesore and attract some of the unsavory types, the good that they do is to help people stay off of the street, and help people to be linked with services to help them get back on their feet. I don't mind my tax dollars going to help people, frankly I think it is my duty to do so. I just wish there was an even-handed balance so we could have some growth, but still keep services for people. I guess if we were larger, there would be a better chance of that. I know that in the past when there have been residential programs to help the seriously mentally ill, or a transitional living program to help people who are homeless or in recovery, they have been protested by people in the more moderate income neighborhoods. This forces them to the depths of the city, in some pretty dangerous and run down areas. I worry about their options if everything around them is built up, and nobody wants them there anymore.

[bluebeard]

Originally Posted by pvjd

I see your point, it is just that Birmingham is much smaller than Atlanta. There have been a few homeless people spotted and rounded up in Hoover and Vestavia in the past year or so, and I think it is because downtown is focusing less on services to help them (I know it is not a popular stance, but not everybody is capable of doing for themselves, especially when there is mental illness and years of drug addiction), and more on the highrise developments, etc. Even though the cheap housing and shelters might be an eyesore and attract some of the unsavory types, the good that they do is to help people stay off of the street, and help people to be linked with services to help them get back on their feet. I don't mind my tax dollars going to help people, frankly I think it is my duty to do so. I just wish there was an even-handed balance so we could have some growth, but still keep services for people. I guess if we were larger, there would be a better chance of that. I know that in the past when there have been residential programs to help the seriously mentally ill, or a transitional living program to help people who are homeless or in recovery, they have been protested by people in the more moderate income neighborhoods. This forces them to the depths of the city, in some pretty dangerous and run down areas. I worry about their options if everything around them is built up, and nobody wants them there anymore.

I don't like how we give tax breaks to only big businesses. If you want to attract businesses then give acroos the board tax breaks to new businesses... but then they have an advantage over smaller businesses...
It sounds nice to attract big bussineses and those decent chunks of jobs, but small businesses make plenty of jobs too, and at least the money created stays more local instead of going to some corporate headquarters.

[RebelPhotog]

Leadership

[Saintmarks]

Originally Posted by pvjd

I see your point, it is just that Birmingham is much smaller than Atlanta. There have been a few homeless people spotted and rounded up in Hoover and Vestavia in the past year or so, and I think it is because downtown is focusing less on services to help them (I know it is not a popular stance, but not everybody is capable of doing for themselves, especially when there is mental illness and years of drug addiction), and more on the highrise developments, etc. Even though the cheap housing and shelters might be an eyesore and attract some of the unsavory types, the good that they do is to help people stay off of the street, and help people to be linked with services to help them get back on their feet. I don't mind my tax dollars going to help people, frankly I think it is my duty to do so. I just wish there was an even-handed balance so we could have some growth, but still keep services for people. I guess if we were larger, there would be a better chance of that. I know that in the past when there have been residential programs to help the seriously mentally ill, or a transitional living program to help people who are homeless or in recovery, they have been protested by people in the more moderate income neighborhoods. This forces them to the depths of the city, in some pretty dangerous and run down areas. I worry about their options if everything around them is built up, and nobody wants them there anymore.

I don't think Atlanta has found an answer to your concern anymore than Birmingham. Being larger doesn't fix the problem. If the city is larger and has more money, the problem is that much bigger in comparison, so there are always those that fall between the cracks, always the NIMBYers, never enough money to solve the problem.

My response was that you seemed to be anti any redevelopment of downtown because these people will be pushed out. A primary way to grade a major city is by the health of its downtown. An alive, vibrant inner city that is safe, walkable, vibrant with business, entertainment options and residents is a key ingredient to a progressive city and metro area as a whole. To throw in the towel because some might become dispossessed is never a valid argument. They will always be with us, there will always be a place for them to be, good or bad (and most of the time it is bad).

My point of comparing to Atlanta and its resurgence in the inner city is that the poor and mentally disabled were not dispossessed. In some cases I am sure they moved a few blocks away, but a city is not transformed over night, Atlanta still has a long way to go. I was just bewildered by your post that seemed to want to put a stop on any resurgence for downtonw B'ham because of these people.