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As someone posted earlier, any and every student in Idaho is allowed religious release. In fact, as a Christian who attended Centennial my friends and I actually started a bible study that we got religious release for. The LDS community just offers structured classes. For a long time I knew Borah high school also offered a regular Bible class that any student could attend and also qualified for religious release. Other religions just don't start the classes.
On the legalism of Centennial...welcome to the rule of Mrs Graham haha. The principal at the time was a bit intense. Although fun fact was that while my brothers were still there (I escaped before Graham became principal) but my mom is actually the one who started those Wednesday free lunches at the church on McMillan. And Graham said the juniors couldn't leave that year. My mom went to the school board and said if juniors were allowed to leave campus for lunch (they were allowed to go to the seminary building) then so could non LDS juniors. And she won. All juniors were allowed off campus.
And finally, I'm sorry to get on a soapbox but people have got to stop with this misuse of church and state. The constitution does not ever use the phrase "separation of church and state". That comes from a letter Jefferson wrote. The First Amendment phrase states that "Congress shall make no law respecting of an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof". So, if a public school required any student to attend a religious class, they would be breaking the First Amendment. If the public schools did not allow a student to attend a religious class, they would be violating the First Amendment. Allowing a student to attend a seminary class not on campus isn't a violation in any way. Sorry but it just really bugs me when people misuse that term.
In the spirit of full objectivity though I will admit that if you want to get religious release and are not LDS it will take a little more effort. Much of that stems from the fact that they donate more to school programs. But if you put forth the effort to get religious (or nonreligious) release, the state will give it to you.
As someone posted earlier, any and every student in Idaho is allowed religious release. In fact, as a Christian who attended Centennial my friends and I actually started a bible study that we got religious release for. The LDS community just offers structured classes. For a long time I knew Borah high school also offered a regular Bible class that any student could attend and also qualified for religious release. Other religions just don't start the classes.
On the legalism of Centennial...welcome to the rule of Mrs Graham haha. The principal at the time was a bit intense. Although fun fact was that while my brothers were still there (I escaped before Graham became principal) but my mom is actually the one who started those Wednesday free lunches at the church on McMillan. And Graham said the juniors couldn't leave that year. My mom went to the school board and said if juniors were allowed to leave campus for lunch (they were allowed to go to the seminary building) then so could non LDS juniors. And she won. All juniors were allowed off campus.
And finally, I'm sorry to get on a soapbox but people have got to stop with this misuse of church and state. The constitution does not ever use the phrase "separation of church and state". That comes from a letter Jefferson wrote. The First Amendment phrase states that "Congress shall make no law respecting of an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof". So, if a public school required any student to attend a religious class, they would be breaking the First Amendment. If the public schools did not allow a student to attend a religious class, they would be violating the First Amendment. Allowing a student to attend a seminary class not on campus isn't a violation in any way. Sorry but it just really bugs me when people misuse that term.
In the spirit of full objectivity though I will admit that if you want to get religious release and are not LDS it will take a little more effort. Much of that stems from the fact that they donate more to school programs. But if you put forth the effort to get religious (or nonreligious) release, the state will give it to you.
This is one of the best posts I have seen in this thread. I think you did a good job covering it from an objective standpoint. I concur that the biggest thing holding back the non-LDS religious classes is the lack of established structure and the fact that many just don't take advantage of it.
Our church is pretty close to Boise High and has started a program to attract kids who don't want to go to the LDS Seminary. There is a movement afoot to have an evangelical seminary-type program in the Boise and Meridian districts. Should hopefully be up and running by the time school starts in the fall.
By law, ALL students are allowed "release" time for religious studies if it doesn't interfere with their regular course of study. In Utah, Idaho and Arizona, very few other religions have opted to organize that - most likely because only the LDS church owns property that shares boundaries with the public school (an arrangement that is made at the time the school itself is designed). Other churches whose numbers aren't nearly as great as the LDS church in those states cannot do this since the law requires that these classes be "off campus". There are rarely any facilities nearby they could use. So, it is a very fine legal line that the LDS church walks constitutionally in Mormon dominated states. In other states, like in New Jersey where I live now, LDS seminary takes place at the ward (church) or another member's home and students go before their regular school hours. They are then taken back home to go to school or take themselves to school if they drive. In the early 70s, seminary WAS required to graduate from Utah high schools. But, they were sued by an outraged parent (their isolation was crumbling) who was able to have that requirement removed from ALL students. I'm not opposed to religious instruction. I'm not even opposed to generic religious studies wherein an overview of world religions is taught so students could have a better understanding of who believes what. But, I am opposed to one church having the power and political influence to make themselves the only one truly able to offer religious studies.
What happened to separation of church and state? We want to take the word "God" out of the pledge of allegiance, but it's okay to send LDS students to church for an hour out of each day???? Makes no sense...they need to go to church on their own time outside of the school day!
The word God was never a part of the pledge of allegiance until 1954. Obviously, our country didn't fall apart while it was absent. If it is ever removed, we still won't fall apart. But, students who CHOOSE religious study, providing they have more than one religion to choose from, is not a violation. Their desires cannot be denied simply because it's religion.
What happened to separation of church and state? We want to take the word "God" out of the pledge of allegiance, but it's okay to send LDS students to church for an hour out of each day???? Makes no sense...they need to go to church on their own time outside of the school day!
Why on earth would you care? Seminary classes are an elective, just like music classes and art class. The difference is that the cost of the buildings in which the classes are taught and the salaries of the teachers is taken on by the church instead of by the state, and no high school credit is given for Seminary classes. Consequently, the LDS students have to work even harder to get in all of the credits they need for graduation if they take seminary during the school day. Besides, any religion is permitted to offer such classes. If few opt to, that's their problem. At any rate, it doesn't effect anybody who doesn't choose to attend one darned bit.
Funny thing is if there were classes similar to Seminary during the school day for Muslims or Wiccan followers or even atheists, the people who admonish a christian seminary class would consider the other followers I mentioned diversity and it would be ok.
Why did chatombreux bump a thread which is over two years old? bitter feelings?
This issue was decided by the Supreme Court in 1952 Zorach vs Clauson. It is one of those first year law school studies and follows.
No. 431 Argued: January 31 --- Decided: April 28, 1952
Under § 3210 of the New York Education Law and the regulations thereunder, New York City permits its public schools to release students during school hours, on written requests of their parents, so that they may leave the school buildings and grounds and go to religious centers for religious instruction or devotional exercises. The same section makes school attendance compulsory; students not released stay in the classrooms, and the churches report to the schools the names of children released from public schools who fail to report for religious instruction. The program involves neither religious instruction in public schools nor the expenditure of public funds.
Held: This program does not violate the First Amendment, made applicable to the States by the Fourteenth Amendment. McCollum v. Board of Education, 333 U.S. 203, distinguished. Pp. 308-315.
(a) By this system, New York has neither prohibited the "free exercise" of religion nor made a law "respecting an establishment of religion" within the meaning of the First Amendment. Pp. 310-315.
(b) There is no evidence in the record in this case to support a conclusion that the system involves the use of coercion to get public school students into religious classrooms. Pp. 311-312.
Personally, as a retired public school teacher I never had a single student fail because he/she went off campus for religious instruction. Where I taught it was Catholics and Baptists who used the released time. It seems the objections are by those who are either ignorant of the law or biased against religion in general. There are far greater issues facing the state of education in this country than released time.
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