Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Entertainment and Arts > Books
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 02-04-2016, 10:12 AM
 
1,256 posts, read 2,491,476 times
Reputation: 1906

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by i_love_autumn View Post
Read that one, it was really sick how infatuated she was with him! Otherwise, a good read.
I can understand where you are coming from. On the surface it does seem a little "sick."

But I try to remember that at the time, there was far less info about serial killers than there is today. There was a common misconception that they were identifiably evil and ogreish.

Rule was a divorced, tired, overworked mother and Bundy was an attractive and charismatic man. I think she was infatuated by him, yes, and pretty flattered by his attention. He was fun to be around, witty and entertaining. She didn't know him as a murderer at first, or even as a boyfriend. (she was too tired, overworked and busy raising her daughters). That's why it was such a revelation that this charming man whom she considered a friend was in fact a serial killer of women.

I think she was pretty honest about all of the above. She was also honest about the fact that she continued the friendship after his incarceration and sentencing out of pragmatism. She was a writer, and knew that the access she had to arguably the most flamboyantly evil criminal of 20th century was a goldmine.

And it was a two-way street: Bundy craved the attention. He was a narcissist, and he wanted an audience. (which is very typical of serial killers). Rule may have exploited her access to him, but it was with Bundy's full permission.

If nothing else, Rule's book serves as an important cautionary tale and really the first detailed example of the fact that a serial killer isn't always some leering, strange weirdo who keeps to him/herself and is easy to avoid. A serial killer can in fact be the guy next door with a wife and a job, or that cute and funny guy at work whom you secretly wish would ask you out ...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 02-04-2016, 01:44 PM
 
Location: north central Ohio
8,665 posts, read 5,842,089 times
Reputation: 5201
Yep, but what sickened me about her was that even when the brutality of his murders was exposed, she
still seemed to have the hots for him, ewwwww!


Books about thee sub-humans really are terrifying, by showing how well these monsters can hide what they are. Goes to show that you never really know another person and what they are capable of.


Just recently watched a movie on Netflix that was like that~An Officer and a Murderer (2012) (TV Movie) Gary Cole, Laura Harris
The riveting film is based on the true story of a powerful and respected military officer who committed numerous brutal crimes and was eventually brought down by a tenacious small town police detective.
An Officer and a Murderer (TV Movie 2012) - IMDb
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-09-2016, 10:22 PM
 
Location: U.S. Pacific Northwest
251 posts, read 203,683 times
Reputation: 596
Books I liked:

Non-fiction
Mindhunter
The Girl with the Crooked Nose
Of Spirits and Madness
The Anatomy of Motive

Fiction
Scandinavian noir, in general
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-11-2016, 10:01 PM
 
Location: The New England part of Ohio
24,094 posts, read 32,431,870 times
Reputation: 68263
As an undergrad, Erich Goode was one of my professors. His book is thought of by many as the gold standard in the subject of deviance. I had the privilege to work with him on a much earlier edition.

http://www.amazon.com/Deviant-Behavi.../dp/0205899668
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-12-2016, 08:10 AM
 
Location: So Ca
26,712 posts, read 26,770,596 times
Reputation: 24770
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brookside View Post
Would add "The Stranger Beside Me" by Ann Rule. She was a co-worker - and friend! - of Ted Bundy. She knew him first as a charming man, then - a monster.
But she never really went into how he became the way he was; it seemed more about her shock and confusion that someone she worked with and who could appear so "normal" was capable of such horrific crimes. I wanted to find out about what caused him to become so angry and psychotic.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-12-2016, 09:29 AM
 
Location: north central Ohio
8,665 posts, read 5,842,089 times
Reputation: 5201
Quote:
Originally Posted by CA4Now View Post
But she never really went into how he became the way he was; it seemed more about her shock and confusion that someone she worked with and who could appear so "normal" was capable of such horrific crimes. I wanted to find out about what caused him to become so angry and psychotic.


No she didn't, which was the rejection by his girlfriend, and why he chose victims who resembled her.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-12-2016, 11:33 AM
 
Location: So Ca
26,712 posts, read 26,770,596 times
Reputation: 24770
Quote:
Originally Posted by i_love_autumn View Post
No she didn't, which was the rejection by his girlfriend, and why he chose victims who resembled her.
But aren't thousands of people rejected by a former partner at some point in their lives? Something else--obviously multiple things--must have caused him to commit those gruesome murders.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-12-2016, 04:12 PM
 
Location: north central Ohio
8,665 posts, read 5,842,089 times
Reputation: 5201
Quote:
Originally Posted by CA4Now View Post
But aren't thousands of people rejected by a former partner at some point in their lives? Something else--obviously multiple things--must have caused him to commit those gruesome murders.

That is a good point. Of course many , many go through rejection without turning into a subhuman monster like Bundy. Obviously freaks like him are mentally defective and abnormal. From case histories
of serial killers, none came from loving homes, so lack of love and nurturing has a lot to do with warping a child.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-13-2016, 06:02 AM
 
Location: So Ca
26,712 posts, read 26,770,596 times
Reputation: 24770
Susan Klebold, the mother of Dylan Klebold, one of the Columbine shooters, has written a book. Apparently she did not recognize any signs of depression or rage in her son before the shootings.
A MOTHER'S RECKONING - A Mother's Reckoning - Hardcover
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-13-2016, 09:02 AM
 
1,256 posts, read 2,491,476 times
Reputation: 1906
Quote:
Originally Posted by CA4Now View Post
But she never really went into how he became the way he was; it seemed more about her shock and confusion that someone she worked with and who could appear so "normal" was capable of such horrific crimes. I wanted to find out about what caused him to become so angry and psychotic.
Oh my goodness - you have not read Rule's book!

"The Stranger Beside Me" is almost exclusively devoted to why Bundy became a monster. Their relationship was only a small part of it. A few excerpts:

Chapter 49 - devoted to the origins of antisocial personality, and parallels events from Ted Bundy's life from the very beginning that made him this way.

1. He was raised believing his biological mother was his sister. When he found out the truth, he hated his mother for lying to him. He never knew who his biological father was.

2. Raging ambivalence towards mother: she treated him like he was special, unique, and destined to achieve wealth and greatness. While her ministrations fed his ego, he felt very insecure about living up to her expectations. Believed all of his life that he was destined for greatness, and yet never quite achieved it. Resented his mother for placing an inordinate amount of pressure on him. Roots of his hatred of women in general can be found in his relationship with his mother.

3. He also hated her for marrying someone of limited financial and social means – Johnny Bundy (who adopted him). He considered Bundy an inadequate role model of manhood who did not adequately support the family. Bundy resented their low socio-economic status and was very, very insecure about it. Resented his mother even more, because if she could not find success and stability with her husband, it placed an even greater burden on Ted to be successful.

4. Rule also goes in to the origins of why almost every one of his victims had long dark beautiful hair - because the first woman who rejected him fit this profile. Bundy above all could not take rejection.

5. The book also quotes extensively from the psychiatrists who examined him and the conclusions they drew about the origins of his behaviors. Rule extensively delved into Bundy's background and again drew parallels from Bundy's early life that contributed to his deviant behavior:

Psychopaths usually become that way because of events that happened to them before the age of five. In an addendum in the book from 1989, Rule reveals that Ted's grandfather Sam Cowell, whom Ted for many years thought was his biological father, and who he apparently idolized, was a tyrannical and often sadistic man. When his daughter Louise gave birth to Ted (illegitimately), she was forced to leave him in a foster home for several months. Abandoned babies often have trouble bonding. And when Louise finally retrieved him from the foster home, there was a lot of shame and rage and anger about the disgrace she had brought on the family. They concocted a story that her father and mother adopted the little boy, so Louise could never fully act as a loving, nurturing mother towards Ted, less the secret get out. His grandfather was not very nurturing, and his grandmother was very ill – some hint that she was profoundly depressed and bedridden for most of his childhood.

The book is full of the type details the OP claimed to be seeking. They are well researched and substantiated.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Entertainment and Arts > Books

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:30 PM.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top