Traditional fine dining in Boston?

[missionhill]

OP asked the very same question on Trip Advisor and got quite different responses including several mentions of the Parker House.

Here on C-D people are offering critiques of the term "fine dining." I assume it means a formal, traditional atmosphere and high-quality service--not just people waiting tables until something better comes along but people who make a career of excellent service.

I don't know how many "old standbys" have given up-- for example, I assume Maison Robert was a fine dining sort of place but it only began in the '70s and is already gone so not sure it qualifies as an old standby. The two famously crusty places here no more are the old Ritz Carlton dining room overlooking the Public Garden, which was the place for dignified dining in Boston in a beautiful setting since it opened in the '20s, and Locke-Ober (although L-O had this strangely sexist history and so maybe not up to the standard of the Ritz). No reason why newer places like Grill 23 wouldn't offer fine dining too. Kinda surprised at the question really-- so many good restaurants, great atmosphere, delicious food.

[mwj119]

Yeah, they've all been mentioned..

But Grill 23, Atlantic Fish, Bondir, Abe & Louie's, O Ya, Craigie on Main, Oleana, Guilia, Menton, Aquitaine all come to mind. Not a ton of old school, established, or Al Capone hangout type of eateries that would be considered fine dining.

[G-fused]

Originally Posted by missionhill

OP asked the very same question on Trip Advisor and got quite different responses including several mentions of the Parker House.

Here on C-D people are offering critiques of the term "fine dining." I assume it means a formal, traditional atmosphere and high-quality service--not just people waiting tables until something better comes along but people who make a career of excellent service.

I don't know how many "old standbys" have given up-- for example, I assume Maison Robert was a fine dining sort of place but it only began in the '70s and is already gone so not sure it qualifies as an old standby. The two famously crusty places here no more are the old Ritz Carlton dining room overlooking the Public Garden, which was the place for dignified dining in Boston in a beautiful setting since it opened in the '20s, and Locke-Ober (although L-O had this strangely sexist history and so maybe not up to the standard of the Ritz). No reason why newer places like Grill 23 wouldn't offer fine dining too. Kinda surprised at the question really-- so many good restaurants, great atmosphere, delicious food.

I mentioned the Parker House. The definition is important though. I do not consider a place like Abe and Louis fine dining, others do.

Fine dining to me would be a place I would not feel comfortable in if I was not wearing a tie, sportcoat, etc. Abe and Louis has the elements but I am very comfortable there in business casual.

[lrfox]

Originally Posted by G-fused

I mentioned the Parker House. The definition is important though. I do not consider a place like Abe and Louis fine dining, others do.

Fine dining to me would be a place I would not feel comfortable in if I was not wearing a tie, sportcoat, etc. Abe and Louis has the elements but I am very comfortable there in business casual.

That's why I don't think it's too big a deal that people here got into it about the definition of "Fine Dining." It doesn't mean the same thing to everyone and if you want the recommendations to be helpful, it's good to ask the OP to be a bit more specific.

[porterhouse]

Originally Posted by G-fused

I do not consider a place like Abe and Louis fine dining, others do.

I remember when Abe & Louies was J.C. Hillarys. The room is pretty much exactly the same save some wood paneling, and it was originally an upscale concept from the same restaurant group. Tough for me to consider that one fine dining under any circumstances.

[redplum33]

Originally Posted by lrfox

That's why I don't think it's too big a deal that people here got into it about the definition of "Fine Dining." It doesn't mean the same thing to everyone and if you want the recommendations to be helpful, it's good to ask the OP to be a bit more specific.

He was rather specific -- formal, traditional fine dining, not French, not new & hip.

I don't know of any restaurant in Boston that meets that criteria.

I think the OP is going to have to drop the formal requirement.

What I think the OP is looking for (or will have to settle for) is a restaurant that

• is expensive
• has high quality food
• doesn't have any French words on the menu
• doesn't offer a 19 course tasting menu
• doesn't use the terms "small plates" and "large plates"

If that works, there are plenty of options. Personally, I would recommend any of the higher end steakhouses.

[G-fused]

Originally Posted by redplum33

He was rather specific -- formal, traditional fine dining, not French, not new & hip.

I don't know of any restaurant in Boston that meets that criteria.

I think the OP is going to have to drop the formal requirement.

???

That is not specific at all. Traditional fine dining? what is that?

My third cousin's brother in law (Earl) from the bayou would consider Outback as fine dining (as would his buddies). I mean heck, it's got cloth napkins! He might even put the napkin in his lap for a minute and giggle about how the other side lives (must be nice). But would OP consider that fine dining? My guess is no.

Ok, a bit of an extreme example but just illustrating the point. If OP wants a good suggestion he/she would fill in the blanks. Otherwise they are at risk of taking a suggestion and being disappointed.

Disclosure: I don't have a third cousin's brother in law named Earl.

And OP is going to have to drop the formal requirement? This is Boston, it is a formal place. Sure, you've got plenty of hipsters but suit and tie folks abound.

I think some of the options already mentioned by folks are good ones. Whether they qualify as fine dining to the OP is unclear.

[redplum33]

Originally Posted by G-fused

???

That is not specific at all. Traditional fine dining? what is that?

My third cousin's brother in law (Earl) from the bayou would consider Outback as fine dining (as would his buddies). I mean heck, it's got cloth napkins! He might even put the napkin in his lap for a minute and giggle about how the other side lives (must be nice). But would OP consider that fine dining? My guess is no.

Ok, a bit of an extreme example but just illustrating the point. If OP wants a good suggestion he/she would fill in the blanks. Otherwise they are at risk of taking a suggestion and being disappointed.

Disclosure: I don't have a third cousin's brother in law named Earl.

And OP is going to have to drop the formal requirement? This is Boston, it is a formal place. Sure, you've got plenty of hipsters but suit and tie folks abound.

I think some of the options already mentioned by folks are good ones. Whether they qualify as fine dining to the OP is unclear.

Dude, I'm pretty sure the OP is looking for a fancy, expensive restaurant that wouldn't be considered trendy.

I enjoyed the story about your hillbilly cousin, but the fact that the OP is looking for a formal restaurant pretty much rules out the subjectivity of fine dining. He/She is looking for the best of the best.

And, yes, tons of suits and ties in Boston...but I am unaware of any restaurants in Boston with a formal dress code. The top restaurants in Boston allow casual attire.

[lrfox]

Originally Posted by redplum33

He was rather specific -- formal, traditional fine dining, not French, not new & hip

My take on the request was similar to yours, but given that "formal, traditional fine dining" in the sense of a strict dress code, traditional fare, classical elegant interior is no longer considered synonymous with the "best" restaurants and is becoming closer and closer to non-existent in all but a handful of cities (even NYC, London, and Paris), it's fair to ask for clarity so they're not steered wrong. The problem is that each of those things you (and the OP) listed are not at all specific:

1. "Formal" if we're being ultra traditional can mean nothing less than a tuxedo/dark suit and an evening gown. So even places with jacket requirements may not meet the "formal" criteria depending on what the OP means. It could even mean service style - Tasting Counter in Somerville is high end/fancy fine dining, but it's not a formal setting (as the name implies, it's a counter).
2. "Traditional fine dining" could mean anything to anyone. Many chains and mediocre places market themselves as "fine dining" and there are a ton of different measures (from Yelp reviews to Michelin Stars).
3. "Not French" is, again, also vague. What is French food? Menton is French-Italian. Does that count? Many "New American" restaurants are French-inspired. Is that too French?
4. "Not new & hip" means nothing. What does the OP consider "new and hip?" New in restaurant terms could mean 3 months, but to some people "new" could mean anything less than 5 years old. And what's "Hip?" does that refer to the decor? If so, does that mean it can't be a long-standing old restaurant like the recently departed Le Espalier which relocated from a historic back bay building to a modern new construction and with a trendy and updated interior. Or does "hip" mean it can't have a more modern/trendy way of serving food (again, like Tasting Counter).

[Ne999]

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