Why Is Boulder Snobbish, Cliquish, And Racist? (Denver, Colorado Springs: sale, houses)

[dreamboatannie953]

Maybe we need to go France in this country and just socialize medical care? When the bottom line is the financial well being of the medical professionals over the lives of patients we are in big trouble. Just my opinion, but I have a sister living in Paris, France and the medical system there works very well for her. Our mother was french so she is a dual citizen there.

[subsound]

Originally Posted by dreamboatannie953

Maybe we need to go France in this country and just socialize medical care? When the bottom line is the financial well being of the medical professionals over the lives of patients we are in big trouble. Just my opinion, but I have a sister living in Paris, France and the medical system there works very well for her. Our mother was french so she is a dual citizen there.

Go to Great Debates where it is a topic, I've already posted things comparing the US system to the Canadian system. All I can say is that you get what you pay for, from taxes or from private insurers. If you want the best doctors, they cost...you want the top of the line equipment, it costs...you want the newest drugs, they cost...you want enough medical professionals to see people in a reasonable time, it costs. The information I put up provides the average wait times for care (18 - 30 weeks in Canada, 5 weeks max in the US), the average market time of approval for drugs (once approved it's out in the US and carriers determine, depends in Canada on the cost...average found was 2-3 years, more so for expensive cancer drugs), availability of PET and MRI's...etc.

Go there, check it out...let the thread go back to topic.

[CCCVDUR]

I think I've figured it out. There are three types of American Cities:

1. Cities that are overcrowded wastelands with millions of people (Phoenix, Seattle, Denver, New York, Chicago, etc.).

2. Cities that are small, traditional, artsy, rich, expensive, cliquish, and who don't want or like new people (Boulder, Flagstaff, Santa Fe, Sedona).

3. Cities that welcome newcomers and new businesses and have limited growth restrictions and welcome poor people with low rents/low taxes (Albuquerque, perhaps Austin?, perhaps Yucca Valley, CA.?).

Anyone have more categories?

[vegaspilgrim]

Originally Posted by subsound

Go to Great Debates where it is a topic, I've already posted things comparing the US system to the Canadian system. All I can say is that you get what you pay for, from taxes or from private insurers. If you want the best doctors, they cost...you want the top of the line equipment, it costs...you want the newest drugs, they cost...you want enough medical professionals to see people in a reasonable time, it costs. The information I put up provides the average wait times for care (18 - 30 weeks in Canada, 5 weeks max in the US), the average market time of approval for drugs (once approved it's out in the US and carriers determine, depends in Canada on the cost...average found was 2-3 years, more so for expensive cancer drugs), availability of PET and MRI's...etc.

Go there, check it out...let the thread go back to topic.

I agree with subsound. As of this point in time, Tom Lane, I think you've run through this Boulder forum about as much as you're going to get out of it. Time to move on. I second subsound's suggestion of the "Great Debates" forum, sounds like you may like that.

[subsound]

I'm just too lazy to write it all again

I think Boulder fits the college town profile too, with a major university right at it's heart that employs, teaches, and requires support of a pretty significant percentage of the population.

[cpm725]

I like how this thread turned from talking about Boulder into a debate over Medicare and medical access!

[suzco]

Originally Posted by cpm725

I like how this thread turned from talking about Boulder into a debate over Medicare and medical access!

Given that the thread was started with a post that was extraordinarily negative and assumed that Boulder was a not very pleasant place (asking "why is Boulder snobbish, cliquish, and racist"), where it ended up was a turn for the better.

[dreamboatannie953]

I think Tom had questions about if health care was more available in Boulder than in Flagstaff. He made comments about how these liberal towns didn't do more to make healthcare available to those on medicaid and medicare. That's when the subject became about healthcare, when another member answered Tom with a conservative view of capitalistic healthcare. I'm a 10 year breast cancer survivor and I've been in the medical system in this country. I have some agreements and disagreements with the member who wrote about people in countries with socialized medicine have long waits for things like chemo. That certainly would have cost my life. Is there a happy medium between capitalistic healthcare and socialized. But the member with the capitalistic view wanted to change it back to the subject of the thread once they made their point (maybe their view being the only important one?). But, their point was well made and we did get off subject. But how funny is it that it was a more positive discussion than the thread? Reading these opinions on Boulder has just scared me silly. My hubby was born in Boulder and he's trying to convince me to move there with him from the Seattle area. This thread has really made me wonder about life in Boulder?

[Count David]

Originally Posted by Tom Lane

I think I've figured it out. There are three types of American Cities:

1. Cities that are overcrowded wastelands with millions of people (Phoenix, Seattle, Denver, New York, Chicago, etc.).

2. Cities that are small, traditional, artsy, rich, expensive, cliquish, and who don't want or like new people (Boulder, Flagstaff, Santa Fe, Sedona).

3. Cities that welcome newcomers and new businesses and have limited growth restrictions and welcome poor people with low rents/low taxes (Albuquerque, perhaps Austin?, perhaps Yucca Valley, CA.?).

Anyone have more categories?

Um, Tom, not EVERYTHING needs to be categorized. I don't see how every large city could be considered a wasteland, I think many residents of those cities you mentioned would highly disagree.

Your #2, most of those cities are filled with out-of-towners.
For example: (census 2000)
-In Boulder, only 24.2% were even born in Colorado, with only 55% living in Boulder County more than five years
-In Flagstaff, 41.6% were born in Arizona, with 60% living in Coconino County more than five years
-In Santa Fe, 44.8% were born in New Mexico, with 73% living in Santa Fe County for more than five years, this one fits your supposed profile, a little bit
-Here's the kicker! In Sedona ONLY 10.9% were born in Arizona, with 58% living in Coconino/Yavapai Counties for more than five years

So, in the cases of Boulder, Flagstaff and Sedona, surely those towns are at least somewhat welcoming to newcomers, or there wouldn't be so many there!!!

I would think Albuquerque wouldn't be a uber-welcoming place, but I would think Austin would be. Yucca Valley is pretty dependent on the military, yet I would imagine there is a class of people there that wouldn't welcome in outsiders. (I lived in a similar town)

There are plenty of places that have low rents that don't welcome outsiders in, I would think it's the other way around, places are expensive because people want to live there, and people don't want to pay high rents to live in unwelcoming places. Remember, super welcoming San Francisco is one of the most expensive metros in the nation.

Where I live, (Denver Metro), I can't think of anywhere around here that would be considered unwelcoming, and that includes Boulder. Anybody can move from around the nation (or world), plop down, and start a life, without anybody interfering or holding them back. About half of the population here is transplanted, so newcomers have something in common with half the people already here. Natives are a little harder to crack, but if you prove your worth to them, as a person and a friend, they will welcome you in as well. IMO, that would be the case anywhere.

There will be something you don't like about anywhere you go. Stop categorizing/judging so much, and open your mind up. Go somewhere that has a weather/climate that suits you. Go somewhere that has a population/density you can live with. Don't bother worrying about the people in said place. You can't expect people or a place to change to suit you. Bend or open up a little so you can suit them. IMO, it takes at least 18-24 months to assimilate into a new hometown. Your preconceptions/misconceptions about your #2/#3 places are or could be dead wrong. If you open up and welcome people in, they will welcome you in, anywhere.

Scrap the categories, no two places are alike.

[subsound]

The thing is Boulder has a huge student population that rotates in and out in total every 4 years. There's always going to be idiots doing racist and stupid things, especially stupid kids, but because Boulder bills itself as one of the most progressive cities in the country....when bad things happen it gets more attention then anywhere else. Boulder is the city that reminds me more of the Pac NW then anywhere else (I'm in Portland now, and did my HS and college in Boulder)....it's not much different but for the rain.

The reason I wanted to push the health care discussion to another thread is because the research and writing have already been done for both sides, including references in comparison to capitalistic and socialistic health care...best to take it to the proper venue where the debate is ongoing.