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Old 10-12-2016, 03:27 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Indentured Servant View Post
The median age in the Buffalo metro area is nearly 39 while the median age in the Grand Rapids area is 33. A high median age, for an area, means that there are not enough young workers to replace retiring workers and you cannot get economic expansion if you do not have the new workers entering the workforce to not only offset retiring workers, but for net job growth.

Census Data: Metropolitan Area Age & Sex

A metro area has to become attractive to young people in order to be viable, unless it is a retirement community or the like. Young people follow trends. They tend to move to where people are already moving and move away from places where people are already moving from. Growth perpetuates growth and decline perpetuates decline unless energies are spent or the laws of supply and demand change the direction of trends. Eventually boom towns become a victim of their own success, via the law of supply and demand.

I think a lot of energy (wealth) has been spent that last few decades in Grand Rapids to make it attractive to young people. If you cannot attract young people and the best and brightest among them, then your local companies are going to be at a disadvantage with their competitors located in places that young people find attractive.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cWjb9_1i10Q
Buffalo has just really started getting on the radar for young people, but I also think that this may be a reason for the refugee resettlement that has also occurred in the area relatively recently. http://www.bizjournals.com/buffalo/n...is-on-the.html

Millennials returning home to Buffalo, for career and family - The Buffalo News
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Old 10-12-2016, 03:35 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Indentured Servant View Post
All true. I think also that negative name recognition simply works against many places that are seen as "has been" cities. There are the current boom towns of the last 20 or so years, then there are the "has been" cities that peaked as major cities back in the 50's, that suffer from negative momentum, but may actually be better places to live, in regards to quality of life, than many of the boom town who are benefiting from positive momentum. Once you get momentum going, you do not have to expend as much energy to keep it going. However, when you suffer from negative momentum, you tend to just keep going down unless there is a massive investment of energy to move in a different direction.

The thing about Grand Rapids is that it really did not have any name recognition. Ten or more years ago Grand Rapids was not even on the map. I remember telling a co-worker once, about 20 years ago, that I was flying to Grand Rapids and he asked me if jets flew into the airport there. This was not an uneducated guy.....we was actually my Manager at a fortune 100 company....lol.

In light of that, when people hear about Grand Rapids today, it is not thought of as a "has been" city....like Buffalo or even Detroit. Hence, people and investors are willing to give it a second look because it seems new and untapped. Image is everything and Grand Rapids was off the radar so it did not get a negative image and hence does not have to swim against the current of negative perception. In fact, the area would do even better if not for it being associated with a state that has a negative image, via the fallacy of division. Some people see Michigan as a "has been" state then assume all the cities in Michigan are therefore "has been" cities.

Aside from the racial aspect of the Grand Rapids area......I am really impressed with it. It is an underrated area in my opinion, that should be booming given the natural amenities of the area and recent economic performance. Grand Rapids should have a growth rate of about 2.5% annually, at least.....based upon what the area has to offer and based upon what I have seen in other boom towns in the south and west whose growth rate are much higher but whose quality of life is much lower. Grand Rapids challenge is making it attractive to a diverse demographic.
When you say making it attractive to a diverse demographic, what some things that you are referring to?
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Old 10-12-2016, 03:38 PM
 
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Originally Posted by mjlo View Post
I think the similarities are mainly limited to the metro areas on paper. If one were to stand in downtown Buffalo, and then do the same in downtown Grand Rapids they would likely conclude that Buffalo is a much larger city. Grand Rapids from a built standpoint has more in common with Syracuse than a Buffalo or Rochester.


https://www.census.gov/quickfacts/ta...15/36029,26081


I created a table comparing the two core counties and they are fairly similar demographically. I imagine the subsets of European culture in Buffalo would be more evident. Grand Rapids has one of the higher proportions of Hispanic/Latino residents in the Midwest. They are the largest minority group in the metro area now, I wonder if that also plays a factor.
It does seem like Grand Rapids is similar to Syracuse in that regard and what Syracuse would be if it could maintain steady growth.

Buffalo does seem to have growing Hispanic and Asian populations, in spite of its population situation. If it were to grow economically at a higher rate, both groups are likely to increase even faster.
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Old 10-12-2016, 06:50 PM
 
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Originally Posted by ckhthankgod View Post
When you say making it attractive to a diverse demographic, what some things that you are referring to?
Well...for one....Grand Rapids is rated as one of the worst cities economically for African Americans. Despite all its growth and amenities, I would still rather live in Detroit than Grand Rapids...because black culture is something that I value.
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Old 10-12-2016, 07:36 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Indentured Servant View Post
Well...for one....Grand Rapids is rated as one of the worst cities economically for African Americans. Despite all its growth and amenities, I would still rather live in Detroit than Grand Rapids...because black culture is something that I value.
Got it and while Buffalo's Black community/population has its economic issues as well, people may not know that it has the highest percentage of Black owned businesses with paid employees(11%), it has the oldest/continuously running urban radio station in the country(WBLK), WUFO is a Black owned radio station and there is WWWS(1400 AM with an oldies format targeted towards the community), it has a Black based Chamber of Commerce, there are several high schools in the area with at least substantial Black student populations that have Black graduation rates near to above the state graduation percentage, it has had Black individuals in high level government positions on the local level and some other aspects covered in one of the threads in the general section of the NY forum that may not be found by just checking out mainstream media. So, that aspect is something that Buffalo may do better in, comparatively speaking.

I do know that suburbs in the GR area like Wyoming and Kentwood have areas that are visibly diverse on a cultural level and have for a longer time than other suburbs in that area. In Buffalo, besides Lackawanna(essentially a steel town south of Buffalo), Amherst is a suburb that has areas of the town that are more diverse and comparatively for a longer time, with parts of Cheektowaga becoming so in recent years. Niagara Falls and to a lesser degree Lockport are a couple of smaller cities in the Buffalo metro that also have some degree of a diverse population.
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Old 10-13-2016, 06:09 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ckhthankgod View Post
Got it and while Buffalo's Black community/population has its economic issues as well, people may not know that it has the highest percentage of Black owned businesses with paid employees(11%), it has the oldest/continuously running urban radio station in the country(WBLK), WUFO is a Black owned radio station and there is WWWS(1400 AM with an oldies format targeted towards the community), it has a Black based Chamber of Commerce, there are several high schools in the area with at least substantial Black student populations that have Black graduation rates near to above the state graduation percentage, it has had Black individuals in high level government positions on the local level and some other aspects covered in one of the threads in the general section of the NY forum that may not be found by just checking out mainstream media. So, that aspect is something that Buffalo may do better in, comparatively speaking.

I do know that suburbs in the GR area like Wyoming and Kentwood have areas that are visibly diverse on a cultural level and have for a longer time than other suburbs in that area. In Buffalo, besides Lackawanna(essentially a steel town south of Buffalo), Amherst is a suburb that has areas of the town that are more diverse and comparatively for a longer time, with parts of Cheektowaga becoming so in recent years. Niagara Falls and to a lesser degree Lockport are a couple of smaller cities in the Buffalo metro that also have some degree of a diverse population.
I used to be a resident of Grand Rapids, as well as Detroit. Educated black people usually get out of Grand Rapids unless, upon finishing college, they get an offer from a local company to stay. Culturally, for African Americans, Grand Rapids is weak. Grand Rapids just got its first FM black format radio station this year. Prior to that, all it had was AM and that had to go off at sunset because AM radio signals travel farther at night. There are hardly any clubs or bars in the black community like there used to be......which is a catch 22 because those places would have shootings every weekend. Now young people hang out in parking lots of fast food joints in the inner city, because they are open at night.

All said, I still think that all other things considered, besides the cultural aspect, Grand Rapids is a great area with a lot to offer families. Gentrification is going on strong and the center city is walkable and vibrant....you just do not see enough African Americans taking part in the new vibrancy. The same can be said for Detroit. It just makes me feel really sad that the economic difference is STILL so wide in 2016.
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Old 10-13-2016, 07:05 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Indentured Servant View Post
I

I used to be a resident of Grand Rapids, as well as Detroit. Educated black people usually get out of Grand Rapids unless, upon finishing college, they get an offer from a local company to stay. Culturally, for African Americans, Grand Rapids is weak. Grand Rapids just got its first FM black format radio station this year. Prior to that, all it had was AM and that had to go off at sunset because AM radio signals travel farther at night. There are hardly any clubs or bars in the black community like there used to be......which is a catch 22 because those places would have shootings every weekend. Now young people hang out in parking lots of fast food joints in the inner city, because they are open at night.

All said, I still think that all other things considered, besides the cultural aspect, Grand Rapids is a great area with a lot to offer families. Gentrification is going on strong and the center city is walkable and vibrant....you just do not see enough African Americans taking part in the new vibrancy. The same can be said for Detroit. It just makes me feel really sad that the economic difference is STILL so wide in 2016.
I think some of the first part of this has been an issue in Buffalo as well, but maybe not to the same degree. Does Grand Rapids have any parts of the city/area where there is at least a substantial concentration of a Black middle class? I know in the Buffalo area, some neighborhoods west of Main Street(Parkside, Central Park, North Park, North Buffalo, etc.), in Hamlin Park, the far eastern part of the Kensington Heights neighborhood into western Cleveland Hill and maybe NW Pine Hill in Cheektowaga, parts of Eggertsville and in some of the far northern neighborhoods of the Sweet Home SD both in Amherst and I believe even in parts of Lincoln Park in the eastern part of the town of Tonawanda.


As for the second part, I think that this is a the case anywhere there is gentrification/revitalization. I posted a news segment from Buffalo that illustrates this point in another thread actually, but what may be a difference with Buffalo is that there are Black individuals that are in some of the high level positions. So, sometimes it may be a matter of where in a city or how one invests in a city.

Last edited by ckhthankgod; 10-13-2016 at 08:00 AM..
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Old 11-19-2016, 06:21 PM
 
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Breaking news: Grand Rapids still makes things!

Kind of interesting how this article addresses the question of this thread.
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Old 11-19-2016, 07:50 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Republic of Michigan View Post
Breaking news: Grand Rapids still makes things!

Kind of interesting how this article addresses the question of this thread.
Nice article and while manufacturing employment in the United States peaked in 1979, it is good to see that there are areas where it is expanding. An example of this in Upstate NY is the Plattsburgh area. What helps that area is it proximity and partnership with Montreal and other nearby areas of Quebec. In fact, many of the manufacturing companies in the Plattsburgh area are based in Quebec(Bombardier, Nova Bus, etc). It even markets itself as Montreal's U.S. suburb and it is still an affordable area.

To tie Buffalo into this, it is also an area within close proximity to a major Canadian metro area and not only that, it is adjacent to Canada's Golden Horseshoe. That is essentially Canada's version of the Bos-Wash corridor. Perhaps Buffalo and Niagara Falls individually or as a metro should follow Plattsburgh's example and form a partnership with Chambers of Commerce within the Golden Horseshoe(Hamilton, Toronto, etc.) and perhaps display pros to possible expansion into the Buffalo area. Doing so may actually be a little more affordable and it could help bridge the Buffalo metro area with the Golden Horseshoe economically.
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Old 11-20-2016, 05:25 AM
 
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Cancel any plans to move to Grand Rapids. They done just closed 2 K-marts there. Ain't no good economy there if they's closing up the one and only indicator of success, prosperousness, happiness, and goodness, K-mart.
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