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In 2008 Atlanta was ranked as the 16th most dangerous city to live in. It was 22nd in 2007. If you feel safe driving around "The Dirty South" you'll have no problems in Buffalo.
Not much can be done about Niagara Falls at the moment. The Canadian side developed tourism while the American side was more focused on industry. The industry left & the city became a depressed ghetto for the most part. Until someone decides they want to invest in the city that isn't going to change.
I agree that Atlanta has a crime problem, but it is indeed WAY more isolated than here. Decatur and North Atlanta are fine and very safe, but you go to the Southside, you are in trouble. I obviously don't have the experience in Atlanta that TLC does, but I spent about 6 weeks, I stayed in Stone Mountain, and it felt like a very safe city, but I had to go down to Clayton County a few times... and boy, it was bad, worse than here, but at least in Atlanta, if you are smart, you can stay away from the crime, in Buffalo it's pretty well spread out. From South Buffalo, to University Heights, then to Riverside, there is a pretty constant high crime rate across the city. I would prefer if the crime stayed in one area only, it might make new residents less afraid to buy a house.
I agree that Atlanta has a crime problem, but it is indeed WAY more isolated than here. Decatur and North Atlanta are fine and very safe, but you go to the Southside, you are in trouble. I obviously don't have the experience in Atlanta that TLC does, but I spent about 6 weeks, I stayed in Stone Mountain, and it felt like a very safe city, but I had to go down to Clayton County a few times... and boy, it was bad, worse than here, but at least in Atlanta, if you are smart, you can stay away from the crime, in Buffalo it's pretty well spread out. From South Buffalo, to University Heights, then to Riverside, there is a pretty constant high crime rate across the city. I would prefer if the crime stayed in one area only, it might make new residents less afraid to buy a house.
I thought most of the serious crime in the city of Buffalo was on the East and West sides of town? It seems like North Buffalo is fine and South Buffalo, while more gritty, isn't that bad either. I also thought the further away from Downtown on the West side the better it got.
Also, is the crime more about the lifestyle one leads versus just living in said neighborhoods? In Syracuse, it's pretty much if you aren't into drugs, gangs or have severe domestic problems, you are generally fine. That even goes for the rougher parts of town too.
Last edited by ckhthankgod; 07-05-2009 at 10:20 AM..
I agree that Atlanta has a crime problem, but it is indeed WAY more isolated than here. Decatur and North Atlanta are fine and very safe, but you go to the Southside, you are in trouble. I obviously don't have the experience in Atlanta that TLC does, but I spent about 6 weeks, I stayed in Stone Mountain, and it felt like a very safe city, but I had to go down to Clayton County a few times... and boy, it was bad, worse than here, but at least in Atlanta, if you are smart, you can stay away from the crime, in Buffalo it's pretty well spread out. From South Buffalo, to University Heights, then to Riverside, there is a pretty constant high crime rate across the city. I would prefer if the crime stayed in one area only, it might make new residents less afraid to buy a house.
Hey Rochester, I see your obviously on the side of the gangs. How old are you? threatening people with guns? Hmmm, lets see why the city can't get cleaned up. Because of people like you. Yeah I'm not scared. My Daddy taught me to shoot as a child. Duck, rabbit, deer, hog hunting. I guarentee I'm a better shot. I hunt, but if need be I shoot to kill to protect myself. You have no chance city boy.
to everyone else: My comments of the corrupt government has been ignored, wonder why? My comment on your old democratic and union ways have been ignored? My comment on why you people keep electing the same people into office have been ignored?
My point exactly. NO ONE there has any desire or motivation to clean your town up. Does anyone even go vote? Or do these people keep getting into office becaue of no shows at the polls?
Where is the money coming from to do all of these improvements? Again my comment on your corrupt government that is pocketing all that tax money has been ignored. There's your money to clean up the city. What are the salaries? What are they charging on their government paid credit cards? Believe me, when you are one of and almost the number one state with the highest taxes their is or should of been plenty of money to keep up with the declining city. City almost bankrupt???? There is no excuse for that! There was plenty of money and is still plenty of money coming in from the residents and tourists. But everyone will sit back and re-elect, and keep the unions, and not do a damn thing. All you do is sit there and defend, defend, threaten people that call your city out, and your NOT proactive is reclaiming your city.
Keep posting. Maybe people will get mad enough at me to complain to their neighbors about the horrible comments I'm making and maybe your younger residents will LISTEN and quit leaving as soon as their grown and take action. It's time for your government to retire!! Their thinking and reasoning does not work anymore. Although I don't think it ever worked or it wouldn't be where it is today.
good Day all.
Hey, Hi. You sound very angry, and scared. Moving can be very scary (as you know since you mentioned you once lived in Boston.) I don't think you're a troll because you came in and voiced your opinion. The Buffalo board is much more diverse and will allow you to voice opposition. Unlike some boards (like the Pittsburgh forum) where you will not only be called a troll, but also have your posts deleted and then your account canceled because you say you don't like something about an area. But this forum is a little more open to discussion. Please understand that you will hear disagreements with your opinion. That is okay too, don't you think?
Kenmore used to be one of the more stable areas to live in so I am a bit surprised to hear that one can only go a couple of streets over before hitting the bad areas. That's a shame. However, I would try to look in areas a little further out. Perhaps, Amherst, Williamsville (my father lives there as does a sister) or even Cheektowaga, Lancaster, or Clarence.
It's an unfortunate fact of life in the city of Buffalo area, that there are many areas in decline. Yet, recently much has been done to begin to clean up many parts. I doubt the downtown area will ever really pick back up as a residential area, but it will probably remain a nice business district. Hopefully the waterfront will continue to grow as it is beginning to do now.
I have lived in so many areas of the United States --a nd even in places like San Antonio, Texas or Scottsdale (a suburb of Phoenix) had its sketchy areas. It appears pretty typical almost everywhere. However, like in most other places, it is possible to move a couple of miles and live in an area that has virtually no crime.
It is wonderful you are so passionate that you feel people need to be more involved in fighting gang crime, voting out the 'same ole same ole' politicians and you seem interested in getting involved in helping the city move forward. EVERY city needs more people like you! I too, am active in my community. (I currently live in the suburbs of Pittsburgh but I grew up in Buffalo. It will always be home no matter where it falls.) I figure if I am going to complain about it, I should also be willing to DO something about it. I sit on many boards to allow me to voice my criticism. They are a great de-stressor for me.
One thing you will enjoy in Buffalo is being close to the great lakes. Since Atlanta is landlocked, you will really come to appreciate the beaches here. Also, the summer and fall are spectacular around the Buffalo area! Please try to enjoy some of the many festivals. Nobody does festivals better than Buffalo and the surrounding areas!
It's good to hear that you have found a place you seem satisfied with. It is also smart to not buy right away because you will need time to find just the right place that suits your needs. In time you will find an area that calls to you. I suggest not looking anywhere near the city or its borders. The areas I mentioned above will seem a bit closer to what you are used to. Atlanta is a beautiful city. I especially like Buckhead, Sandy Springs and Dunwoody. (Which are areas similar to those I mentioned above earlier in Buffalo.)
I have some very good friends who tell me that Boston is actually COLDER than Buffalo, but that Buffalo has a ton more snow. I would suggest that you invest in a good sled to enjoy the winters. Sledding is easy, fun and cheap.
It's unfortunate about Niagara Falls, but it's been like that since -- forever! That's why no one lives there anymore! "WE" the people know that the American side needs to be fixed up, but it's just one of those things..... *sorry*
I do hope you are able to relax and enjoy the summer and fall in Buffalo. Your children will come to love the area. But YOU need to be happy first. They will love whatever you love, you know how kids are. We have moved 6 times (different states) in the past 22 years of our children's lives. We have discovered along the way, that the kids take their cues from us. But I'm sure you already know that.
I am actually thinking about moving to Atlanta (Buckhead, Dunwoody or Sandy Springs) but I too am concerned about the crime there, like you are concerned about the crime in Buffalo! Moving to a new and different place is so intimidating. I am fortunate to be able to afford some of the nicest areas in Atlanta, but I keep hearing about all the random crime and gangs even in the most expensive areas! I'm not a rural kind of gal, country living is NOT for me, so moving to one of the suburbs there is a must for me. Like you, I am freaking out about safety! I guess us moms all think alike when it comes to our kids.
Please keep writing and letting us know how you adventure is going. The good people on this board will be more than happy to try to steer you in the right direction. Best of luck to you!
Hey, Hi. You sound very angry, and scared. Moving can be very scary (as you know since you mentioned you once lived in Boston.) I don't think you're a troll because you came in and voiced your opinion. The Buffalo board is much more diverse and will allow you to voice opposition. Unlike some boards (like the Pittsburgh forum) where you will not only be called a troll, but also have your posts deleted and then your account canceled because you say you don't like something about an area. But this forum is a little more open to discussion. Please understand that you will hear disagreements with your opinion. That is okay too, don't you think?
Kenmore used to be one of the more stable areas to live in so I am a bit surprised to hear that one can only go a couple of streets over before hitting the bad areas. That's a shame. However, I would try to look in areas a little further out. Perhaps, Amherst, Williamsville (my father lives there as does a sister) or even Cheektowaga, Lancaster, or Clarence.
It's an unfortunate fact of life in the city of Buffalo area, that there are many areas in decline. Yet, recently much has been done to begin to clean up many parts. I doubt the downtown area will ever really pick back up as a residential area, but it will probably remain a nice business district. Hopefully the waterfront will continue to grow as it is beginning to do now.
I have lived in so many areas of the United States --a nd even in places like San Antonio, Texas or Scottsdale (a suburb of Phoenix) had its sketchy areas. It appears pretty typical almost everywhere. However, like in most other places, it is possible to move a couple of miles and live in an area that has virtually no crime.
It is wonderful you are so passionate that you feel people need to be more involved in fighting gang crime, voting out the 'same ole same ole' politicians and you seem interested in getting involved in helping the city move forward. EVERY city needs more people like you! I too, am active in my community. (I currently live in the suburbs of Pittsburgh but I grew up in Buffalo. It will always be home no matter where it falls.) I figure if I am going to complain about it, I should also be willing to DO something about it. I sit on many boards to allow me to voice my criticism. They are a great de-stressor for me.
One thing you will enjoy in Buffalo is being close to the great lakes. Since Atlanta is landlocked, you will really come to appreciate the beaches here. Also, the summer and fall are spectacular around the Buffalo area! Please try to enjoy some of the many festivals. Nobody does festivals better than Buffalo and the surrounding areas!
It's good to hear that you have found a place you seem satisfied with. It is also smart to not buy right away because you will need time to find just the right place that suits your needs. In time you will find an area that calls to you. I suggest not looking anywhere near the city or its borders. The areas I mentioned above will seem a bit closer to what you are used to. Atlanta is a beautiful city. I especially like Buckhead, Sandy Springs and Dunwoody. (Which are areas similar to those I mentioned above earlier in Buffalo.)
I have some very good friends who tell me that Boston is actually COLDER than Buffalo, but that Buffalo has a ton more snow. I would suggest that you invest in a good sled to enjoy the winters. Sledding is easy, fun and cheap.
It's unfortunate about Niagara Falls, but it's been like that since -- forever! That's why no one lives there anymore! "WE" the people know that the American side needs to be fixed up, but it's just one of those things..... *sorry*
I do hope you are able to relax and enjoy the summer and fall in Buffalo. Your children will come to love the area. But YOU need to be happy first. They will love whatever you love, you know how kids are. We have moved 6 times (different states) in the past 22 years of our children's lives. We have discovered along the way, that the kids take their cues from us. But I'm sure you already know that.
I am actually thinking about moving to Atlanta (Buckhead, Dunwoody or Sandy Springs) but I too am concerned about the crime there, like you are concerned about the crime in Buffalo! Moving to a new and different place is so intimidating. I am fortunate to be able to afford some of the nicest areas in Atlanta, but I keep hearing about all the random crime and gangs even in the most expensive areas! I'm not a rural kind of gal, country living is NOT for me, so moving to one of the suburbs there is a must for me. Like you, I am freaking out about safety! I guess us moms all think alike when it comes to our kids.
Please keep writing and letting us know how you adventure is going. The good people on this board will be more than happy to try to steer you in the right direction. Best of luck to you!
If you go to Atlanta, look at DeKalb County or North Atlanta, which has been mentioned before. Cobb County has some nice areas too.
Also, in Buffalo, I guess North Buffalo and the Elmwood area would be fine.
HotAtlanta2...If your looking in the Atlanta area there are many of places to look. Decatur, Vinings, Mid Town....all have been taken back by the people. Filled with young professionals and new condos, apts, houses, and businesses.
Even further out like Snellville, Loganville, Suwanee, etc have all been so built up so much you may as well call them Atlanta...we do.
There are bad areas, but that's just it there areas. There's probley one area in Decatur I wouldn't go to. Maybe one apt. complex in Stone Mountain I wouldn't live. There so isolated you don't even realize there in the city.
Buckhead, Dunwoody, Sandy Springs all great areas. Just ask the locals which apt complex not to live in. But in those areas I believe their all pretty much safe. The only areas that are pretty much in the news about gangs are Gabbage Town, Tucker, and Norcorss. Although they've begun to take back those areas as well. There are streets in Atlanta that I wouldn't live in but not too many people actually live in the City of Atlanta, they have an Atlanta address but really it's the outskurts of Atlanta. They commute. That's why the traffic is so bad. Very expensive to live in Atlanta. They do that on purpose and if you can afford an area, I would stay out.
Good luck to you. I think you'll love it here if you move. And if there's something you don't like, your welcomed to voice your opinion. That's how we've cleaned it up so far. People speak out and do something about it.
HotAtlanta2...If your looking in the Atlanta area there are many of places to look. Decatur, Vinings, Mid Town....all have been taken back by the people. Filled with young professionals and new condos, apts, houses, and businesses.
Even further out like Snellville, Loganville, Suwanee, etc have all been so built up so much you may as well call them Atlanta...we do.
There are bad areas, but that's just it there areas. There's probley one area in Decatur I wouldn't go to. Maybe one apt. complex in Stone Mountain I wouldn't live. There so isolated you don't even realize there in the city.
Buckhead, Dunwoody, Sandy Springs all great areas. Just ask the locals which apt complex not to live in. But in those areas I believe their all pretty much safe. The only areas that are pretty much in the news about gangs are Gabbage Town, Tucker, and Norcorss. Although they've begun to take back those areas as well. There are streets in Atlanta that I wouldn't live in but not too many people actually live in the City of Atlanta, they have an Atlanta address but really it's the outskurts of Atlanta. They commute. That's why the traffic is so bad. Very expensive to live in Atlanta. They do that on purpose and if you can afford an area, I would stay out.
Good luck to you. I think you'll love it here if you move. And if there's something you don't like, your welcomed to voice your opinion. That's how we've cleaned it up so far. People speak out and do something about it.
It's called gentrification and sprawl. That pretty much sums up the Atlanta area now.
TLC's comments on the unions and politics in Buffalo are spot on, IMHO, as Buffalo is "Exhibit A" when it comes to Upstate's decline and the hammerlock the unions have on NY.The media still cover the unions as if it's 1955, and often times the folks they interview are like a parody of themselves-angry, agitated, ignorant, misinformed, uneducated, etc. My hometown of Rochester never was much of a union town, yet some of the same attitude exists amongst some folks there, as well. NY is controlled by the unions and very powerful special interests, which sap the economy and confiscate wealth. Union people are a breed unto their own, to the point where many live in a parallel universe to that of reality.
I've been shouted down on the Rochester boards, before, due to my insight into that area, and my confidence in explaining the ins and outs of it (a few who have done this are not even from the area/are recent transplants). Some of us have a life outside that of the City-Data Forums, and, yes, when we do post something perceived as negative by the kool aid drinkers, it's most likely based on hard facts and reality.
Most folks in Rochester have never lived anywhere else, and I'm sure Buffalo is similar in that regard, so there's a bit of a "bubble", there (although Buffalo's college/university population is double that of Rochester's). I prefer to see a place with warts and all, and I would assume others do, too. To describe Upstate cities as if they're all puppies and ice cream would be a disservice to outsiders, many of whom are likely used to vibrant urban cores, cities with a certain amount of gentrification spread across multiple neighborhoods, etc. Such is not the case in Upstate, where the cities continue to decline, which runs counter to what has happened in many other places (most of which are outside the rust belt).
One member who shall go unmentioned (but who has thousands of posts in the forums, and is originally from Buffalo) went on a rant about his appraisal of my perceived education level, even to go so far as claim that it's only uneducated/unskilled people, and school teachers who couldn't find jobs in recent years there, whom have left the region (the member happens to be a school teacher). This shows the lengths to which the die hards will defend their town, despite the realities. I've received more positive e-mails re my posts than negative counter-posts, so, my observations must be in line with those of many in the region (and the hundreds of thousands who have moved away in the last 20 years). Yeah, Upstate is great if you can afford it. I guess if I were a teacher paying $5/week for health benefits I'd think NY is a great place, too.
I boosted Upstate, until reality set in and I started doing research on the stats re the region. Not to mention several of our friends had left the area (and this was after the exodus of the 90's), despite their having solid work histories and skilled/educated backgrounds. We're talking folks with technical degrees, certs, technical master's degrees, etc. Reality is reality is reality, and one can try and gloss over it, but the numbers don't lie. I'm not the only one who's noticed the "attitudes" amongst some in NY. Some are smug, many look down their noses at anyone not from there, etc. It's childish, really. Maybe they're comfortable and don't worry about job losses and whatnot like the rest of us. Who knows. The rest of us choose not to be a part of that rat race and are comfortable enough in our own skin.
Some folks in TLC's shoes look at locating to Upstate as time in purgatory due to job transfer, promotion within a corporation, spouse's transfer, etc., and I can't blame them. Pointing out both the positives and the negatives, in as much of an objective manner as one can muster, helps folks form a picture in their mind. I left for many reasons, but, there's much to love about Upstate, and if there ever was a diamond in the rough, it's Buffalo, NY. It's just that for many the negatives about Upstate now outweigh the positives. One fact many up there forget is that without University at Buffalo, that town would be a ghost town. NY state has been very generous with UB/SUNY at Buffalo in the last 35+ years. Without that massive public investment Buffalo would be much worse off.
With Paterson and his fellow travelers trying to get another million NYers on Medicaid (to 1/4 of the population), the money has to come from somewhere, and that burden continues to get heavier on the backs of the productive and for-profit companies. So, expect more population loss, with no real in-migration of folks into Upstate. The cost if living will go up, commensurately, and the already miserable types who make up an inordinate amount of the population, there, will continue to try to spread their misery to those around them (one of the other reasons why we left NY).
TLC's comments on the unions and politics in Buffalo are spot on, IMHO, as Buffalo is "Exhibit A" when it comes to Upstate's decline and the hammerlock the unions have on NY.The media still cover the unions as if it's 1955, and often times the folks they interview are like a parody of themselves-angry, agitated, ignorant, misinformed, uneducated, etc. My hometown of Rochester never was much of a union town, yet some of the same attitude exists amongst some folks there, as well. NY is controlled by the unions and very powerful special interests, which sap the economy and confiscate wealth. Union people are a breed unto their own, to the point where many live in a parallel universe to that of reality.
I've been shouted down on the Rochester boards, before, due to my insight into that area, and my confidence in explaining the ins and outs of it (a few who have done this are not even from the area/are recent transplants). Some of us have a life outside that of the City-Data Forums, and, yes, when we do post something perceived as negative by the kool aid drinkers, it's most likely based on hard facts and reality.
Most folks in Rochester have never lived anywhere else, and I'm sure Buffalo is similar in that regard, so there's a bit of a "bubble", there (although Buffalo's college/university population is double that of Rochester's). I prefer to see a place with warts and all, and I would assume others do, too. To describe Upstate cities as if they're all puppies and ice cream would be a disservice to outsiders, many of whom are likely used to vibrant urban cores, cities with a certain amount of gentrification spread across multiple neighborhoods, etc. Such is not the case in Upstate, where the cities continue to decline, which runs counter to what has happened in many other places (most of which are outside the rust belt).
One member who shall go unmentioned (but who has thousands of posts in the forums, and is originally from Buffalo) went on a rant about his appraisal of my perceived education level, even to go so far as claim that it's only uneducated/unskilled people, and school teachers who couldn't find jobs in recent years there, whom have left the region (the member happens to be a school teacher). This shows the lengths to which the die hards will defend their town, despite the realities. I've received more positive e-mails re my posts than negative counter-posts, so, my observations must be in line with those of many in the region (and the hundreds of thousands who have moved away in the last 20 years). Yeah, Upstate is great if you can afford it. I guess if I were a teacher paying $5/week for health benefits I'd think NY is a great place, too.
I boosted Upstate, until reality set in and I started doing research on the stats re the region. Not to mention several of our friends had left the area (and this was after the exodus of the 90's), despite their having solid work histories and skilled/educated backgrounds. We're talking folks with technical degrees, certs, technical master's degrees, etc. Reality is reality is reality, and one can try and gloss over it, but the numbers don't lie. I'm not the only one who's noticed the "attitudes" amongst some in NY. Some are smug, many look down their noses at anyone not from there, etc. It's childish, really. Maybe they're comfortable and don't worry about job losses and whatnot like the rest of us. Who knows. The rest of us choose not to be a part of that rat race and are comfortable enough in our own skin.
Some folks in TLC's shoes look at locating to Upstate as time in purgatory due to job transfer, promotion within a corporation, spouse's transfer, etc., and I can't blame them. Pointing out both the positives and the negatives, in as much of an objective manner as one can muster, helps folks form a picture in their mind. I left for many reasons, but, there's much to love about Upstate, and if there ever was a diamond in the rough, it's Buffalo, NY. It's just that for many the negatives about Upstate now outweigh the positives. One fact many up there forget is that without University at Buffalo, that town would be a ghost town. NY state has been very generous with UB/SUNY at Buffalo in the last 35+ years. Without that massive public investment Buffalo would be much worse off.
With Paterson and his fellow travelers trying to get another million NYers on Medicaid (to 1/4 of the population), the money has to come from somewhere, and that burden continues to get heavier on the backs of the productive and for-profit companies. So, expect more population loss, with no real in-migration of folks into Upstate. The cost if living will go up, commensurately, and the already miserable types who make up an inordinate amount of the population, there, will continue to try to spread their misery to those around them (one of the other reasons why we left NY).
I think things just have to be put into perspective. What I like about Syracuse lately is that there is more private investment into the area. A lot of it is coming from Syracuse University and some people that actually want to run a company here. Hopefully, this will continue as the area is in a state of transition from being a manufacturing center to one that is more involved in health care, education and some high tech jobs.
As a person with parents from SC and Mississippi, there are some things about the South that could be better too. If you don't live in a major city in some of the states in the South, it is tough, in many cases in terms of employment and education for example. As the South grows, they are going to deal with issues like taxes, which is actually already happening to some degree, sprawl and crime.
I just think that this is all cyclical and it is just a matter of time that the people here start to make some changes in order to grow again. There is still a lot of potential, but there definitely needs to be some adjustments made too.
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You sound very angry, and scared. Moving can be very scary (as you know since you mentioned you once lived in Boston.) I don't think you're a troll because you came in and voiced your opinion. The Buffalo board is much more diverse and will allow you to voice opposition. Unlike some boards (like the Pittsburgh forum) where you will not only be called a troll, but also have your posts deleted and then your account canceled because you say you don't like something about an area. But this forum is a little more open to discussion. Please understand that you will hear disagreements with your opinion. That is okay too, don't you think? 
However, I would try to look in areas a little further out. Perhaps, Amherst, Williamsville (my father lives there as does a sister) or even Cheektowaga, Lancaster, or Clarence. 
Hopefully the waterfront will continue to grow as it is beginning to do now. 
They are a great de-stressor for me. 
