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No, it's been ranked as the best in the area by many magazines, very small class sizes (graduating classes between 20-35). The cost is ridiculous compared to the private school I came from, which was no doubt better.
For my parents, choosing the school was about finding the best education, not about cost... my sister left after half a year to go to Williamsville North, and forwent her tuition because this school was such a joke. I'm not going to give it's name, because if I give it, it really wouldn't be hard to find out of my name.
Seriously, you all need to get outside of Buffalo, this area doesn't offer the best of anything, I would say it is "above average" in very few areas.
Schools - bad
Economy - bad
Taxes - bad
Population growth - bad
Food - bad (I have had far better wings outside of Buffalo)
Politicians - bad
Arts - good
Urban decay - bad
White collar jobs - bad
Suburbs - Mostly bad
Downtown development - bad
Crime - bad
Shopping - Mostly good
Traffic - generally good
Social policy - Terrible
I think that about sums up how bad Buffalo is. But if you lived outside of Buffalo to go to college, you really wouldn't understand.
Some people say I haven't lived in Buffalo long enough to enjoy it (read: give up on finding something better). I would say that they probably haven't lived outside of New York, except perhaps for college, so they wouldn't know what good is.
I'm sorry you feel that way. There are many current and former residents who violently disagree with you. Regarding how long you lived in Buffalo, as you are a recent graduate of a parochial school I can only assume that your confidence in your opinion greatly exceeds your experience and maturity. The grass is always greener elsewhere, which is exactly as I felt until I actually went elsewhere.
This is my last reply back on this thread, as I was only trying to be helpful to someone who asked a question.
When you mature, you will find out that there is no perfect place, and for every positive you find in an area an equal or greater number of negatives also apply. I have lived in other cities. I have relatives who live in other cities. I have personal experience with public and private school systems in WNY and in the South. I have no illusions about Buffalo's weaknesses, but the strengths and positives of the area should not be diminished or ignored. You have an opinion, but do not forget that it is only yours, and to apply it generally to an entire city or area is, as I said, an immature and disrespectful response.
So, respectfully, I will address your reply:
"Schools - bad" - compared to what? Every school in every district?
"Economy - bad" - unemployment is below national average, so it is doing better than at least 50% of the US, so maybe the answer is "average"
"Taxes - bad" - but you get more for your money, not a great answer so I will agree with the bad
"Population growth - bad" - slow or no growth is not good if the local economy depends on growth, but also growth drives speculation and inflation of property values leading to lots of vacancies - see how many vacant stores and homes there are in FL, TX, CO, let alone NC or AZ - also check out the unemployment rates in those states - but, Buffalo joins most of the rust belt and midwest US in declining population (along with most rural US and FL now)
"Food - bad (I have had far better wings outside of Buffalo)" - yeah, and Genny Cream tastes better in Texas, but that doesn't mean its really better (they do sell it there), food is a matter of opinion but Bflo isnt SF or NYC - maybe not the variety of other cities but bad? Other cities are loaded with chain restaurants, with the same bland food everywhere - at least Bflo has local food
"Politicians - bad" - yeah, they are angels everywhere but Buffalo
"Arts - good" - agree, it is so easy to take this for granted until you leave and see what passes for art in other cities - they may have more $ but you can't pay for the art culture in Bflo
"Urban decay - bad" - I will agree for the most part, but it is visible throughout the rust belt and in most older cities. I was really shocked, though, with the widespread poverty and decay in the booming city of Houston which is not limited to the city center but shows up even in the first ring suburbs - imagine an area comparable to Tonawanda (Ken-East) with burglar bars on every home that wasn't falling apart - and the inner loop where apartment complexes are burned and trashed adjacent to million dollar condos and blocks of empty lots. The infrastructure, aside from the massive freeways, is horrible by Buffalo standards with horrible streets and drainage ditches, massive street flooding, and trashed empty lots in even inner loop neighborhoods. At least Buffalo and its suburbs have preserved large areas of 1870 to 1970 homes, and not allowed them to decay while residents moved outward to newer subdivisions.
"White collar jobs - bad" - is it bad, or is it just because of the size of the Buffalo area? This is where a non-growing population may be making a difference. Also, there truly is a lower pay scale in the Buffalo area
"Suburbs - Mostly bad" - I think suburbs in general are mostly bad, but there are older suburbs in Buffalo that at least have business districts. Places like the Galleria are common across the country, but I would call that bad as I really don't like that area.
"Downtown development - bad" - it's not booming, but it is moving forward, though very slowly.
"Crime - bad" - there are bad areas for sure, but I would say if you are not a drunken idiot out at 4am, or hang out with gang members on the E or W sides, then you are 90% immune to the crime in this area
"Shopping - Mostly good" - I disagree, there needs to be more retail in the city
"Traffic - generally good" - what traffic?
"Social policy - Terrible" - In Texas, a churchgoing Christian can kill someone who trespasses on his property to steal hubcaps. As a social policy, human life is worth less than property. There may be unfairness in distribution of services, but the value and dignity of human life is appreciated with more than lip service in Buffalo.
I honestly don't have time to respond to each of your critiques, however let me point out that you are deflecting Buffalo's problems by comparing them to the very worst city in a given category. (ie, you are holding Buffalo to a standard that if any city is worse than it, in a given category, it is not truly bad).
I will respond to a couple though, cause I have about 5 minutes.
Quote:
In Texas, a churchgoing Christian can kill someone who trespasses on his property to steal hubcap
Let me point something out about this absolutely bizarrely worded statement, what does defending your property have to do with being a churchgoing Christian? You know, in Texas the law is applied evenly, there isn't a set of rules for "churchgoing Christians" and one for everyone else. In Texas, regardless of your race or your religion, you actually have the right to use deadly force to defend your property and your life. New York's Castle Doctrine is so weak that it is a joke, but I will say that if anyone break into my house, they've made a big mistake, because Castle Doctrine or not, they are either going to lay on the ground and wait for the police, or if they decide to do something stupid (like attack me) they are going to have a bullet in them.
Do you honestly think that burglars, murderers, and rapists deserve the right to know that regardless of their crime, that they are above their unarmed victims? I don't.
Quote:
what traffic?
Transit can be very bad, and Maple Rd. during the school year isn't much fun.
Quote:
compared to what? Every school in every district?
Again, an impossible argument to win with you. Buffalo city schools, are graduating 51% of students, so far lower than even the worst state. Compare New York state, with supposedly dumb rednecks in Arkansas. New York graduates about 60% of students, Arkansas is edging up to 85%. Buffalo city schools are bad compared to MOST city schools.
Quote:
slow or no growth is not good if the local economy depends on growth, but also growth drives speculation and inflation of property values leading to lots of vacancies - see how many vacant stores and homes there are in FL, TX, CO, let alone NC or AZ - also check out the unemployment rates in those states - but, Buffalo joins most of the rust belt and midwest US in declining population (along with most rural US and FL now)
And in Buffalo your house will never ever gain value. No one wants to speculate on the price of crap. I'd rather live in a place where there are so many people moving in that people assume that housing prices will increase so much, that they are willing to put their money where their mouth is and buy a house there. Does it have some unintended consequences? Sometimes. Is is better than a place where people won't buy a house for $3000? Absolutely.
That's all I have time for now... Maybe I'll continue my reply a little later.
I'm sorry you feel that way. There are many current and former residents who violently disagree with you. Regarding how long you lived in Buffalo, as you are a recent graduate of a parochial school I can only assume that your confidence in your opinion greatly exceeds your experience and maturity. The grass is always greener elsewhere, which is exactly as I felt until I actually went elsewhere.
This is my last reply back on this thread, as I was only trying to be helpful to someone who asked a question.
When you mature, you will find out that there is no perfect place, and for every positive you find in an area an equal or greater number of negatives also apply. I have lived in other cities. I have relatives who live in other cities. I have personal experience with public and private school systems in WNY and in the South. I have no illusions about Buffalo's weaknesses, but the strengths and positives of the area should not be diminished or ignored. You have an opinion, but do not forget that it is only yours, and to apply it generally to an entire city or area is, as I said, an immature and disrespectful response.
So, respectfully, I will address your reply:
"Schools - bad" - compared to what? Every school in every district?
"Economy - bad" - unemployment is below national average, so it is doing better than at least 50% of the US, so maybe the answer is "average"
"Taxes - bad" - but you get more for your money, not a great answer so I will agree with the bad
"Population growth - bad" - slow or no growth is not good if the local economy depends on growth, but also growth drives speculation and inflation of property values leading to lots of vacancies - see how many vacant stores and homes there are in FL, TX, CO, let alone NC or AZ - also check out the unemployment rates in those states - but, Buffalo joins most of the rust belt and midwest US in declining population (along with most rural US and FL now)
"Food - bad (I have had far better wings outside of Buffalo)" - yeah, and Genny Cream tastes better in Texas, but that doesn't mean its really better (they do sell it there), food is a matter of opinion but Bflo isnt SF or NYC - maybe not the variety of other cities but bad? Other cities are loaded with chain restaurants, with the same bland food everywhere - at least Bflo has local food
"Politicians - bad" - yeah, they are angels everywhere but Buffalo
"Arts - good" - agree, it is so easy to take this for granted until you leave and see what passes for art in other cities - they may have more $ but you can't pay for the art culture in Bflo
"Urban decay - bad" - I will agree for the most part, but it is visible throughout the rust belt and in most older cities. I was really shocked, though, with the widespread poverty and decay in the booming city of Houston which is not limited to the city center but shows up even in the first ring suburbs - imagine an area comparable to Tonawanda (Ken-East) with burglar bars on every home that wasn't falling apart - and the inner loop where apartment complexes are burned and trashed adjacent to million dollar condos and blocks of empty lots. The infrastructure, aside from the massive freeways, is horrible by Buffalo standards with horrible streets and drainage ditches, massive street flooding, and trashed empty lots in even inner loop neighborhoods. At least Buffalo and its suburbs have preserved large areas of 1870 to 1970 homes, and not allowed them to decay while residents moved outward to newer subdivisions.
"White collar jobs - bad" - is it bad, or is it just because of the size of the Buffalo area? This is where a non-growing population may be making a difference. Also, there truly is a lower pay scale in the Buffalo area
"Suburbs - Mostly bad" - I think suburbs in general are mostly bad, but there are older suburbs in Buffalo that at least have business districts. Places like the Galleria are common across the country, but I would call that bad as I really don't like that area.
"Downtown development - bad" - it's not booming, but it is moving forward, though very slowly.
"Crime - bad" - there are bad areas for sure, but I would say if you are not a drunken idiot out at 4am, or hang out with gang members on the E or W sides, then you are 90% immune to the crime in this area
"Shopping - Mostly good" - I disagree, there needs to be more retail in the city
"Traffic - generally good" - what traffic?
"Social policy - Terrible" - In Texas, a churchgoing Christian can kill someone who trespasses on his property to steal hubcaps. As a social policy, human life is worth less than property. There may be unfairness in distribution of services, but the value and dignity of human life is appreciated with more than lip service in Buffalo.
"Economy - bad" - unemployment is below national average, so it is doing better than at least 50% of the US, so maybe the answer is "average"
Don't you think that Buffalo's unemployment rate has been kept artificially low due to the fact that Buffalo has more government workers per capita than any other city in the nation? The public sector (to the detriment of the people they serve) simply doesn't make the necessary job cuts as is common in the private sector. The best they seem to do is institute a "hiring freeze," and I would question how strictly this is adhered to.
Also, don't you think that it's a bit silly to use an area's unemployment rate as the sole metric of its economy? By that logic, Bismark ND has the best economy in the US.
Quote:
"Social policy - Terrible" - In Texas, a churchgoing Christian can kill someone who trespasses on his property to steal hubcaps
Hubcaps!?! Is he trespassing into a museum or something!? Who has hubcaps anymore, and why would anyone want to steal them?
Hehe sorry, just giving you a hard time about that one, I understand your point
Finney closed last March (sometimes it doesn't pay to post link without checking them (just kidding)), too many students were delinquent in paying (well their parents were), and the school couldn't afford to stay open, a declining city couldn't support this school.
I have very good firsthand knowledge with the school, I was an intern there, and worked as a tutor for 2 years. It is tragic, and just one of thousands of stories of people seeing what they loved in WNY pulled out from under them.
This is another reason I can't stand this place, you find something you enjoy or love, and you question how long it is before it closes due to terrible fiscal policy and terrible economic conditions in the city.
Finney closed last March (sometimes it doesn't pay to post link without checking them (just kidding)), too many students were delinquent in paying (well their parents were), and the school couldn't afford to stay open, a declining city couldn't support this school.
I have very good firsthand knowledge with the school, I was an intern there, and worked as a tutor for 2 years. It is tragic, and just one of thousands of stories of people seeing what they loved in WNY pulled out from under them.
This is another reason I can't stand this place, you find something you enjoy or love, and you question how long it is before it closes due to terrible fiscal policy and terrible economic conditions in the city.
Sounds like what happened to Turner-Carroll. That is a shame.
I honestly don't have time to respond to each of your critiques, however let me point out that you are deflecting Buffalo's problems by comparing them to the very worst city in a given category. (ie, you are holding Buffalo to a standard that if any city is worse than it, in a given category, it is not truly bad).
I will respond to a couple though, cause I have about 5 minutes.
Let me point something out about this absolutely bizarrely worded statement, what does defending your property have to do with being a churchgoing Christian? You know, in Texas the law is applied evenly, there isn't a set of rules for "churchgoing Christians" and one for everyone else. In Texas, regardless of your race or your religion, you actually have the right to use deadly force to defend your property and your life. New York's Castle Doctrine is so weak that it is a joke, but I will say that if anyone break into my house, they've made a big mistake, because Castle Doctrine or not, they are either going to lay on the ground and wait for the police, or if they decide to do something stupid (like attack me) they are going to have a bullet in them.
Do you honestly think that burglars, murderers, and rapists deserve the right to know that regardless of their crime, that they are above their unarmed victims? I don't.
Transit can be very bad, and Maple Rd. during the school year isn't much fun.
Again, an impossible argument to win with you. Buffalo city schools, are graduating 51% of students, so far lower than even the worst state. Compare New York state, with supposedly dumb rednecks in Arkansas. New York graduates about 60% of students, Arkansas is edging up to 85%. Buffalo city schools are bad compared to MOST city schools.
And in Buffalo your house will never ever gain value. No one wants to speculate on the price of crap. I'd rather live in a place where there are so many people moving in that people assume that housing prices will increase so much, that they are willing to put their money where their mouth is and buy a house there. Does it have some unintended consequences? Sometimes. Is is better than a place where people won't buy a house for $3000? Absolutely.
That's all I have time for now... Maybe I'll continue my reply a little later.
You also have to keep educational standards in mind and the fact that private schools aren't counted in those numbers, something a state like Arkansas doesn't have too many of. Then, you have the variance in NYC public schools too.
What's also deceptive about the graduation percentages is the fact that NY is a state known for having quite a few immigrants and refugees. So, it might take some an extra year to graduate, while they adjust to the curriculum here. So, it's not as simple as people might think.
NY is also a state where the teachers are required to have a graduate degree in education to teach(generally), whereas many other state don't require that.
You also have to keep educational standards in mind and the fact that private schools aren't counted in those numbers, something a state like Arkansas doesn't have too many of. Then, you have the variance in NYC public schools too.
NYC's graduation rate is 1% higher than Buffalo, I really don't get your point, NYC brings the average down, but not as badly as Buffalo.
And since private schools aren't counted, wouldn't that suggest that the public education system in Arkansas is far better than NY's?
I have nothing for Arkansas, I've been once and would probably not go back, wasn't my favorite place, but I am making an example. It is very clear that pretty much no matter where you go, the education system, the economy, the population growth, and the taxation scheme almost universally better than Buffalo's.
Chance of student success
New York - B
Arkansas - C-
The Education Week study evaluated school systems on several criteria, including accountability standards, college readiness of high school graduates, spending and equity.
The Best & Worst Public School Systems in the U.S. - WalletPop (http://www.walletpop.com/specials/best-and-worst-public-school-systems-in-us?photo=2 - broken link)
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