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Old 07-26-2015, 11:31 AM
 
394 posts, read 327,559 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by livinfairfax View Post
Exclusion is part of what we do and jobs, I get that. In accounting, we arbitrarily increase the number of credits needed to take CPA exams and lower the curve of CPA exams to make it hard to get into this industry. At the end of the day, fewer of us there are, better it is for the rest of us.

While race-based favoritism exists everywhere, the big4 firms are one of the worst offenders at it. If it let this go and let the next generation suffer the same level of discrimination, then I'm not doing what I'm supposed to do.
i mean, i didn't disagree/discredit you about that

But I wouldn't say it's as bad as you might make it out to be, not in my experience at least lol. The thing is, there IS progression which is UNDOUBTEDLY a GOOD thing
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Old 07-26-2015, 11:32 AM
 
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Originally Posted by livinfairfax View Post
Let's at least recognize that there are people specific to the origins that I mentioned above exist. That would be a first step. If what I saw was once or twice, I wouldn't do any of this. I expected this coming in anyway. (is it a surprise a higher up would groom someone of the same race and gender?)

But this is SYSTEMIC. I think that is where a lot of proliferators would argue that its not.
I believe there's a psychological article/book/entry somewhere out there that we are more inclined to hire someone who we are "similar" to in appearance/looks.

I mean, I won't lie, yes race is SOMEWHAT of a factor but I don't believe that it is as bad as you are making it out to be
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Old 07-26-2015, 11:47 AM
 
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Originally Posted by The_Man74 View Post
I believe there's a psychological article/book/entry somewhere out there that we are more inclined to hire someone who we are "similar" to in appearance/looks.

I mean, I won't lie, yes race is SOMEWHAT of a factor but I don't believe that it is as bad as you are making it out to be
If I can find some stats, I'll post them on here. But over 3 years, there's always a caveat when it comes to minority (namely asian) promotions at my firm.

- The boomerang manager left after 3 years, came back as a manager, and did not get promoted again after 3 years. (asian male)

- A manager was promoted last year with an average rating (I'm told it is very common to get above average or excellent) (asian male)

- A manager 2 years ago had to go down to Texas to make manager vs. a white female counterpart on the same team who got promoted here. (asian male)

That is it, those are 100% of the minority promotion to manager that I've seen at my firm personally. All other promotion to manager for white people were traditional, above average rating within our office with the exception of one who got sent on a secondment to London.

There was one promotion 2 years ago of a middle eastern woman to manager who actually got to stay in the area on the same client. But that client has a lot of middle eastern people from what I'm told which is also the case with the engagement team.
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Old 07-26-2015, 11:53 AM
 
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all right

I just noticed you're in VA which is somewhat similar, but also VERY different than TX

I understand you probably can't name the Big 4 on here which is fine but i will say that different Big4's are different, even the Big 4 are tiered

So unless you have data for all 4... Deloitte, KPMB, EnY, PwC... Then i cannot fully agree with you that race is as big of a factor as you mentioned
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Old 07-26-2015, 11:58 AM
 
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Originally Posted by The_Man74 View Post
all right

I just noticed you're in VA which is somewhat similar, but also VERY different than TX

I understand you probably can't name the Big 4 on here which is fine but i will say that different Big4's are different, even the Big 4 are tiered

So unless you have data for all 4... Deloitte, KPMB, EnY, PwC... Then i cannot fully agree with you that race is as big of a factor as you mentioned
I do think there is a difference in my firm than the rest of the big4. I've been at 2 of the big4s. This firm is particularly very bad. I say that with enough experience. The thing is, this firm prides in itself on being number 1 due to the racial cohesion. I think you probably know what firm I'm at.
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Old 07-26-2015, 12:20 PM
 
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Originally Posted by livinfairfax View Post
I do think there is a difference in my firm than the rest of the big4. I've been at 2 of the big4s. This firm is particularly very bad. I say that with enough experience. The thing is, this firm prides in itself on being number 1 due to the racial cohesion. I think you probably know what firm I'm at.
You think that a Big 4 firm claims to be #1 BECAUSE of racial cohesion? Seriously?
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Old 07-26-2015, 12:24 PM
 
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Originally Posted by TaxPhd View Post
You think that a Big 4 firm claims to be #1 BECAUSE of racial cohesion? Seriously?
I've been told by various people that that's why they joined to me in person, yes. Wreckless staff and soon to be seniors. Mgrs and above are much more careful.
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Old 07-26-2015, 12:31 PM
 
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Originally Posted by livinfairfax View Post
I've been told by various people that that's why they joined to me in person, yes.
I have no idea what this sentence means.

I would be very surprised if you could show me any promotional literature (print, web, etc.) where a Big 4 claims to be the #1 firm as a result of its racial cohesion.
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Old 07-26-2015, 12:36 PM
 
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Originally Posted by TaxPhd View Post
I have no idea what this sentence means.

I would be very surprised if you could show me any promotional literature (print, web, etc.) where a Big 4 claims to be the #1 firm as a result of its racial cohesion.
read the quote that i gave earlier from a managing director.

this never comes in a written package. typically, you see the quality reviews done by professional quality members of your office doubling or tripling the amount of "critical reviews" if the race of the mgr and the upper client management is not aligned.

as of the most recent departure of certain managers, i believe there is 100% alignment now in my office of the engagment mgrs to the majority race of the client's upper management. that should be a fact.
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Old 07-26-2015, 12:50 PM
 
397 posts, read 309,059 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TaxPhd View Post
I have no idea what this sentence means.

I would be very surprised if you could show me any promotional literature (print, web, etc.) where a Big 4 claims to be the #1 firm as a result of its racial cohesion.
for a phd, you seem very naive. or maybe not, if you know what i mean.
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