U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Covid-19 Information Page
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Economics > Business
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 03-30-2019, 03:20 PM
 
Location: Aurora Denveralis
8,717 posts, read 4,067,203 times
Reputation: 13397

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tek_Freek View Post
And there is a large group that bash Tesla no matter what they do. They want them to fail so they can be proven correct. What a lousy attitude.
Well, you know, they don't make a truck that can haul a ton of gravel and a horse trailer 1,000 miles up the spine of the Rockies without a stop. So what good are they?

People who bash Tesla don't tend to invest in them. Moot point.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 03-30-2019, 04:32 PM
 
Location: Silicon Valley
5,275 posts, read 2,337,473 times
Reputation: 8474
Quote:
Originally Posted by vision33r View Post
GM is in so much debit, that a billion is nothing in terms of their pension requirements. They are like a state government, they've got so much liabilities that when the recession hits they were the 1st to go belly up when income drops.

During the recession how come Toyota, Honda did not go belly up?

The problem with today's economy is that companies are too leveraged and way too much outstanding liabilities that were deferred. Any ripple in the economy will require a bailout just to pay their bills.

I don't disagree at all with the statement on the ridiculous rise in Corporate debt overall. It's truly the byproduct of debt being so cheap for so long and I do worry a bit about how long deleveraging will take. Still, realize auto will always be tied to debt. It's the most expensive and complex mass production assembly, supply chain and manufacturing process aside from perhaps airplanes, and certainly for mass consumption. It's also an expensive purchase for the buyer. No automotive company is ever free of the credit markets.



More to point, Toyota is a great manufacturer. Their kan ban system is one of the best in the world if not the best....but look at their financial statements. Had the credit markets dried up for TM as they did for F, GM and Chrysler, they wouldn't be able to turn their debt either. No automaker can, that's why it's such a cyclical industry. You need to retain enough cash in the good times knowing full well that you're going to bleed out like crazy during the bad times. Its cycle is longer than what it is in other industries. Yet the industry itself is a massive contributor to a nation.



Automotive cannot exist without established credit markets.



For Elon Musk to get as far as he has with TSLA is mind blowing....but when doubters come to the forefront and say....where's the money, they aren't necessarily hating. He's changing a significant paradigm that's been tried before and never successfully completed. He's burning cash in the waning good days....everyone that's lived through a full cycle is scratching their heads, at least a little, and wondering how in the hell is he going to make winter? I hope he makes it. I really do. He's inspiring, the product is awesome and I'd love to see more excitement in American made vehicles.



But, if Americans would buy F, GM or TSLA vehicles and limit their shopping list there, the economy would be amazing. Too many turn to ready cliches and fall into divisions of blue vs white collar, blue vs red state etc.


If we'd just support Americans, we could all benefit. And when everyone's doing ok, some of this us or them starts to seem a little silly.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-30-2019, 04:46 PM
 
Location: Newburyport, MA
3,835 posts, read 1,560,016 times
Reputation: 4758
Quote:
Originally Posted by Electrician4you View Post
No not everyone is booing them. If they invested their money they have as much right to prosper as anyone who invests their money. I may not care for their product offerings, but I have nothing against them making money. Hell I bought GM stock when they were n the dumpster and made money off their eventual prosperity.
I also don't understand the hostility for GM. We're certainly better off with them operating, and yet some seem to want them to go under.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-30-2019, 05:30 PM
 
Location: Floribama
16,611 posts, read 34,248,996 times
Reputation: 15878
Quote:
Originally Posted by artillery77 View Post



But, if Americans would buy F, GM or TSLA vehicles and limit their shopping list there, the economy would be amazing. Too many turn to ready cliches and fall into divisions of blue vs white collar, blue vs red state etc.


If we'd just support Americans, we could all benefit. And when everyone's doing ok, some of this us or them starts to seem a little silly.

But if you look at this on a local level, companies like Hyundai, Mercedes, and Honda provide jobs for my state. I don’t believe GM or Ford have ever provided many jobs here. Sure, they provide jobs for folks in Michigan or Ohio, but what good does that do Alabama?
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-30-2019, 05:45 PM
 
Location: Riverside Ca
21,708 posts, read 24,137,821 times
Reputation: 34041
Quote:
Originally Posted by artillery77 View Post
Are you an American that believes in supporting America? We've got more than just GM.


Assembling a bunch of Japanese/German parts in the US is hardly a replacement.

Sure. If the American product is better I’ll buy it. If it is not I won’t. It’s realy that simple. I mean do you expect me to spend my hard earned money on a product that isn’t as good simply because it was made here? How does that make any sense?


Quote:
Originally Posted by OutdoorLover View Post
I also don't understand the hostility for GM. We're certainly better off with them operating, and yet some seem to want them to go under.
I bought their products before. Some good some bad. Overall I had better luck with imports than with domestics. GM may make the best vehicles on the planet. I personally don’t think they do. Is it my opinion yes along with a lot of car reviews. When they will and I feel like they do then I’ll revisit my policy. It’s really not just GM. There are simply other vehicles I rather own before most domestics. I don’t care what others buy
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-30-2019, 06:09 PM
 
Location: Metro Detroit Michigan
5,725 posts, read 2,088,498 times
Reputation: 4904
Quote:
Originally Posted by southernnaturelover View Post
But if you look at this on a local level, companies like Hyundai, Mercedes, and Honda provide jobs for my state. I don’t believe GM or Ford have ever provided many jobs here. Sure, they provide jobs for folks in Michigan or Ohio, but what good does that do Alabama?
GM does do business in Alabama and really all over the country ever here of automotive suppliers this automotive supplier is in Auburn Alabama. You have no idea how big GM supplier network is. So yes GM is in the southern states as well as the rest of the country. And jobs are created by GM buying automotive parts from Alabama suppliers.

https://www.al.com/business/2019/03/...expansion.html
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-30-2019, 06:25 PM
 
Location: Floribama
16,611 posts, read 34,248,996 times
Reputation: 15878
Quote:
Originally Posted by easy62 View Post
GM does do business in Alabama and really all over the country ever here of automotive suppliers this automotive supplier is in Auburn Alabama. You have no idea how big GM supplier network is. So yes GM is in the southern states as well as the rest of the country. And jobs are created by GM buying automotive parts from Alabama suppliers.

https://www.al.com/business/2019/03/...expansion.html
GM isn’t why those suppliers are here, they are here because of the companies I mentioned.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-30-2019, 06:28 PM
 
Location: Houston, TX 77082
243 posts, read 131,093 times
Reputation: 251
Quote:
Originally Posted by easy62 View Post
GM made a billion dollars from their stake in lyft today on their shares of lyft stock. This article was from yesterday but today it happened.


https://www.freep.com/story/money/ca...po/3235364002/
Yet they still produce junk cars
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-30-2019, 07:30 PM
 
Location: Murrica
4,128 posts, read 2,451,570 times
Reputation: 3446
Many foreign car makers build here in the USofA. They provide much to the local economies where they build. Ask all the folks who work for Hyundai in West Point, Ga. Or BMW in upstate SC. In addition to those big factories, that hire Americans, you have to count all the suppliers that build close.

https://www.autonews.com/article/201...conomic-engine

Saying we should buy US labeled cars, while those US corporations ship jobs overseas and south of the border, is just silly. Don't forget, car companies were big proponents of NAFTA.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-30-2019, 08:09 PM
 
2,854 posts, read 1,297,688 times
Reputation: 5315
Quote:
Originally Posted by artillery77 View Post
Are you an American that believes in supporting America? We've got more than just GM.


Assembling a bunch of Japanese/German parts in the US is hardly a replacement.
I support myself and my family. If I could buy a US made vehicle that's as good as my Toyota 4Runner, I would consider it. However, there isn't a comparable vehicle available from a US manufacturer. Jeeps are not comparable, so don't go there.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Economics > Business
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2020, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top