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Old 09-29-2009, 01:57 AM
 
Location: Tennessee/Michigan
28,956 posts, read 49,615,379 times
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(CNSNews.com) – A new study from the non-partisan Tax Foundation shows that New Jersey, New York, and California respectively are the states whose tax structure is the worst for business, a factor the foundation says drives businesses to other, more business-friendly states.

CNSNews.com - New Jersey, New York and California Have Worst Tax Climates for Business, Tax Foundation Says (http://cnsnews.com/news/article/54620 - broken link)
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Old 09-29-2009, 04:06 AM
 
Location: Conejo Valley, CA
12,476 posts, read 18,089,402 times
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Isn't it funny that New York and California also have some of the largest economies in the union? I guess its not driving away too much business.

These sorts of things are always short sighted. I've done business in PA and CA and I much prefer CA. Not only does the state supply much superior information, but I pay less taxes in CA. CA can be a rather nice place for a start-up taxed as a partnership as their tax system is highly progressive. On the other hand California is not so nice for a large established business. That is different states offer different advantages depending on the size and stage of your business.
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Old 09-30-2009, 10:59 PM
 
3,853 posts, read 11,973,089 times
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lmao user_Id, are you kidding me?

The only reason CA's economy is so large is because so many people live there and so many rich people live here. Many large industries like the movie business started there way back before all the regulation and high taxes came. The movie business these days is in free fall. You can make a movie anywhere in the entire world. Same thing for television.
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Old 09-30-2009, 11:23 PM
 
Location: Conejo Valley, CA
12,476 posts, read 18,089,402 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by killer2021 View Post
lmao user_Id, are you kidding me?
No, I'm not. These studies are short sighted, different sorts of businesses, different stages of business, etc all benefit from different sorts of tax policies.

And there is a certain irony in that the some of the "worst" states under this measure have the biggest economies. And not just in terms of total size, but also per capita. The real world simply does not correspond to what this particular group happens to think is important.
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Old 09-30-2009, 11:39 PM
 
Location: Heartland Florida
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High tax states develop the same way a parasite does. No parasite will grow large on a weak host. New York was a center of manufacturing and industry while NYC is a long time center of finance. That allowed government to grow huge. New Jersey is associated with that economy so it too became a mess. California had mining, energy, agriculture, timber, and eventually the movie industry. All developed before government grew to the life-sucking size it is now. This also happened in manufacturing centers like Michigan. The overwhelming fact is that taxes, regulations and corruption thrive best in areas that generate the most wealth. Eventually the parasite kills the host and the process will reverse. The deficits of government indicate that they have overwhelmed their hosts and in places like Detroit you can see government already falling apart.

Without new startups it is like a forest of only old growth. Eventually the insects and age will kill the trees and unless new ones start, will become a wasteland.
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Old 10-02-2009, 01:35 AM
 
Location: Conejo Valley, CA
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Once again the facts don't fit the dogma. California's taxes have been high for decades now, yet that did not stop Silicon Valley from forming which to this day is the biggest hot spot for Venture Capital.
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Old 10-07-2009, 07:50 AM
 
4,398 posts, read 9,550,083 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by killer2021 View Post
lmao user_Id, are you kidding me?

The only reason CA's economy is so large is because so many people live there and so many rich people live here. Many large industries like the movie business started there way back before all the regulation and high taxes came. The movie business these days is in free fall. You can make a movie anywhere in the entire world. Same thing for television.

So many rich people live there. How do you think they became rich? Work in Alabama and commute?
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Old 10-07-2009, 10:21 AM
f_m
 
2,289 posts, read 7,742,395 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by user_id View Post
Once again the facts don't fit the dogma. California's taxes have been high for decades now, yet that did not stop Silicon Valley from forming which to this day is the biggest hot spot for Venture Capital.
Silicon Valley doesn't generate any manufacturing jobs of significance, at least not in CA since most of it is done overseas. Although in the past more of it was in CA. There are more costs involved for factory workers in CA than other places. Which is why most factories are in the midwest and the south, and a reason why Toyota got out of the NUMMI car factory in Fremont when they got their chance.
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Old 10-07-2009, 08:53 PM
 
Location: Conejo Valley, CA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by f_m View Post
Silicon Valley doesn't generate any manufacturing jobs of significance,
And when did I mention manufacturing jobs in Silicon Valley? Its been a hot spot for venture capital. Most start-ups in Silicon Valley are obvious technology related.

Quote:
Originally Posted by f_m View Post
There are more costs involved for factory workers in CA than other places. Which is why most factories are in the midwest and the south,...
Here again the reality does not fit the dogma. The Los Angeles area has the largest manufacturing sector compared to any other US city. Manufacturing is everywhere, its pretty hard to miss unless you're in West LA.

Backwater cities in the South give companies like Toyota huge tax perks to move their factories, that is why these factories often leave. California really does not need to do this to attract businesses as it has a hot bed of start-up activity. Most electric car manufactures are in what state? Oh yeah....California. Most of the people that comment about businesses leaving California have never owned a business, California for a variety of reasons is an excellent place for start ups. Start-ups often pay next to no taxes in California. Now for more established businesses California's taxes become burdensome, but they are not dramatically higher than other states with similar amenities.
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Old 10-07-2009, 09:14 PM
f_m
 
2,289 posts, read 7,742,395 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by user_id View Post
And when did I mention manufacturing jobs in Silicon Valley? Its been a hot spot for venture capital. Most start-ups in Silicon Valley are obvious technology related.
And how many jobs in the country are actually tech related with high pay? Silicon Valley is good for people because all the top universities are in SF area, and LA and SD have desirable areas to live. Most people don't work in high tech, they work in service or manufacturing sectors.

Quote:
Originally Posted by user_id View Post
Here again the reality does not fit the dogma. The Los Angeles area has the largest manufacturing sector compared to any other US city. Manufacturing is everywhere, its pretty hard to miss unless you're in West LA.
I've been to various factories in the area, but the reality is people who work in manufacturing can't afford nearly the same kind of living they could get in the midwest and south, and many of the workers are immigrants taking low pay (some places only have immigrants). LA has a large population, so in raw numbers there may be many manufacturing jobs, but not enough to "live." Another reason it's not suitable for manufacturing, the employees will always want more money to be able to afford the cost of living.


Quote:
Originally Posted by user_id View Post
Backwater cities in the South give companies like Toyota huge tax perks to move their factories, that is why these factories often leave. California really does not need to do this to attract businesses as it has a hot bed of start-up activity. Most electric car manufactures are in what state? Oh yeah....California. Most of the people that comment about businesses leaving California have never owned a business, California for a variety of reasons is an excellent place for start ups. Start-ups often pay next to no taxes in California. Now for more established businesses California's taxes become burdensome, but they are not dramatically higher than other states with similar amenities.
If you have to refer to people as "backwater" I guess you don't have much respect for people looking to make a living. The truth is cost of living is a major issue if you have a large number of employees. That's a big issue as far as taxes are concerned, which is what the thread is about, since more costs are involved for manufacturing jobs than desk jobs. Nissan moved all their CA headquarters out to TN where their factory is located. Intel moves a lot to go to cheaper places. You talk about electric car manufacturer's, but CA offered many perks to Tesla, but electric cars are a tiny fraction of the general car industry and at the moment rely on people who specialize in certain technologies who would prefer to live in places like CA.

California offers tax break to keep Tesla in state | Technology | Reuters
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