How social conservatives survive in California (San Diego, Berkeley: catholic schools, university, living)

[Bulldogdad]

Originally Posted by WesternPilgrim

That isn't possible. By refusing to "mix" religion with your business, your business is by definition atheistic.

I don't believe that is correct.

It is secular. Neither for or against just separate.

[WesternPilgrim]

Originally Posted by Bulldogdad

I don't believe that is correct.

It is secular. Neither for or against just separate.

In actual practice, though, to be "secular" is to deliberately exclude God.

[Bulldogdad]

Originally Posted by WesternPilgrim

In actual practice, though, to be "secular" is to deliberately exclude God.

Only if your actions of running the business are dictated by your beliefs that there is no God.

[WesternPilgrim]

Originally Posted by Bulldogdad

Only if your actions of running the business are dictated by your beliefs that there is no God.

How is that different, in practice, from running your business as if God doesn't exist, or doesn't matter?

[jeffredo]

"Socons" as you call it survive the workplace like anyone else does. By doing their jobs and minding their own business. I don't slam or deride anyone's religious preference or politics in the workplace and I expect no one to try to impose their beliefs on me while I'm doing the job I'm paid to do. In our office there are gay people (myself included) and conservative Christian Republicans (and Atheists, Jews, Hindus, etc..). We get along quite well because we leave our personal lives at the door. This is a big varied state and everyone has to give a little. Just by working with in a heterogeneous society and having to interact with people who's sexuality, religion, politics or lifestyle you may not personally approve of does not mean you are being discriminated against. The O.P. would do well to remember that.

[Bulldogdad]

Originally Posted by WesternPilgrim

How is that different, in practice, from running your business as if God doesn't exist, or doesn't matter?

It dosen't if your of the mind set and conviction that everything you do has to display your beliefs on your sleeve. Either for or against.

That would be the either/or fallacy, false dilemma etc...

I am saying those are not the only two options.

[Malloric]

Originally Posted by WesternPilgrim

In actual practice, though, to be "secular" is to deliberately exclude God.

Hardly. The United States was founded as a secular nation. The majority of its inhabitants had no desire to exclude God, they merely had a desire to exclude the Church's undue influence.

[Malloric]

Originally Posted by WesternPilgrim

Non-sequitor.

1. The post was written in the context of a theistic worldview;

2. One internet post is not the same as running a business;

3. A theist can operate a business without "proselytizing" or even evangelizing.

Having a crucifix on the wall is not the same as preaching a sermon. Dealing honestly is not the same as preaching a sermon. Working conscientiously is not the same as preaching a sermon. Forbidding blasphemous language is not the same as preaching a sermon. Refusing to do business with pornographers is not the same as preaching a sermon. Etc.

If you run your business as though God did not exist- as though God has nothing to say about your conduct in business, your business relationships, etc. - your business is functionally atheistic and that's that.

1) In no way did it portray that worldview, and hence it is an atheistic post.

2) City Data is business. It is not a theistic business on its face, therefore must be atheistic according to your logic.

3). Yes, a theist can operate a non-theist business. That doesn't make them an atheist or their business atheistic.

[allenk893]

Well, since I'm moving to California in as little as 2 months, I can definitely tell you my plan to survive. I will mind my business, keep my beliefs to myself, keep my nose in my Bible and church, make my money, and keep on stepping. That's what you gotta do in the land of fruits and nuts. I know liberals and how they think. They will try to take your money and keep you from jobs based off your allegiance to Christ. I'm not having it. I'm going to do my thing, mind my business, and make money off of them and then buy my house in San Diego and retire my family there just like I planned. While still making money in LA. I'm never going to hide the fact that I'm a Christian. However it's not like I'm going to put that down on my resume. These people will discriminate against you for it. I'm not stupid. I'm going to play them before they can play me.

[WesternPilgrim]

Originally Posted by jeffredo

"Socons" as you call it survive the workplace like anyone else does. By doing their jobs and minding their own business. I don't slam or deride anyone's religious preference or politics in the workplace and I expect no one to try to impose their beliefs on me while I'm doing the job I'm paid to do. In our office there are gay people (myself included) and conservative Christian Republicans (and Atheists, Jews, Hindus, etc..). We get along quite well because we leave our personal lives at the door. This is a big varied state and everyone has to give a little. Just by working with in a heterogeneous society and having to interact with people who's sexuality, religion, politics or lifestyle you may not personally approved of does not mean you are be discriminated against. The O.P. would do well to remember that.

But this only goes so far, Jeffredo. For example: I have had several jobs over the years where my employer required me to lie. I can't just "do my job and mind my own business" in that case without reference to my religious beliefs. The lies were "white lies" and probably not illegal, but they were lies just the same. I refused, and paid the price. Religion matters, and it matters on the job.

I owned a print shop once and had to turn down multiple jobs for various reasons. I wouldn't print anything pornographic or even semi-pornographic, nor would I print for certain organizations that openly promoted other kinds of immorality. One of these organizations launched a campaign of intimidation against me - dozens of harassing phone calls, letters, e-mails, even vandalism (which I suspect but can't prove). They called my franchise headquarters and tried to get my franchise pulled. My lead graphic designer was so angry she threatened to quit. I lost a supplier and probably a couple of accounts.

The point is that the workplace is not "religiously neutral": someone's values have to predominate, and other value systems will be suppressed.