Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Woody, Columbus has solved their homeless problem by building housing. I didn't say you steal the motels. You follow the Columbus motel and buy them. It was done by government and private citizens putting in money and grant money.
I looked up 'Columbus solves homeless problem' and didn't see many good results...show me a link, please. BTW - I am all for helping those who actually want to be helped, esp if Govt and private monies can be used productively for once.....
And you will continue to dream up reasons why it is absolutely everyone else's fault except for the people living in poverty and therefore they can't be responsible for their current situation.
Labor contractors. LMAO. You mean coyotes? Do you have any idea even how dangerous that is?
I remember when I once had a family friend literally delivered to my door in the trunk of a car by coyotes. Or another time my dad got a call at about 2 AM in the morning and had to drive down to the port of Long Beach with cash in hand or the passenger would not be seeing the light of day. Or how about those 37 Vietnamese that just died in England last week.
Yeah it sure is easy for people to make that trip across the border. But yeah lets pretend that US citizens who speak English and are protected by US laws can't scrape together the $35 to get on a greyhound bus out of CA. That is certainly too much to ask.
Coyotes usually operate in the country these folks come from, once they get here contractors who are almost always US citizens break the law every day to bring illegals into this country and deliver them to employers who pay them for the service. Employers love it because they can't be held liable for the illegal actions of a labor contractor. Labor contractors love it because if the feds start to investigate them they close the business and reopen it under a new name and have a different person listed as the owner of the company.
I've seen this happen for decades, in the late 70's I worked for a large entertainment/restaurant business that overnight replaced all their kitchen helpers and landscape workers with illegal immigrants. The owner's cousin was the "labor contractor" he formed the company with the express purpose of locating and transporting illegal workers to their new place of employment, once that was accomplished the labor contractor shut down his business.
People need to move where they can afford to live. Period. Motels are private property, how are you going to force owners to donate them to the homeless?
That's not what I said Woody, no one is advocating the government seize motels. Some municipalities have made it a policy that they have the right of first refusal for buying or leasing motels/hotels. Many times these are run down and virtually abandoned properties which can be acquired for a relatively small amount of money and converted to affordable housing.
It's lovely that you can stomp your feet and insist that people need to move where they can afford to live but you are completely ignoring the fact that some low income and fixed income tenants have no money to move to a 'cheaper place', or they can't move very far because they depend on friends or family members for assistance or child care.
That's not what I said Woody, no one is advocating the government seize motels. Some municipalities have made it a policy that they have the right of first refusal for buying or leasing motels/hotels. Many times these are run down and virtually abandoned properties which can be acquired for a relatively small amount of money and converted to affordable housing.
It's lovely that you can stomp your feet and insist that people need to move where they can afford to live but you are completely ignoring the fact that some low income and fixed income tenants have no money to move to a 'cheaper place', or they can't move very far because they depend on friends or family members for assistance or child care.
True for far too many. However there is no realistic solution that will not cost a huge amount of money in taxes, thus forcing more people into a homeless condition and it would also require getting laws passed again to ship the addicted and mentally ill homeless to a location where they could be cured of their problem, or they live there for the rest of their lives. Letting them pollute the streets, steal, etc., is no solution.
I do not disagree with you on the need to help the homeless, I just see that no realistic solutions are being presented that could deal with the massive number of homeless and their problems.
True for far too many. However there is no realistic solution that will not cost a huge amount of money in taxes, thus forcing more people into a homeless condition and it would also require getting laws passed again to ship the addicted and mentally ill homeless to a location where they could be cured of their problem, or they live there for the rest of their lives. Letting them pollute the streets, steal, etc., is no solution.
I do not disagree with you on the need to help the homeless, I just see that no realistic solutions are being presented that could deal with the massive number of homeless and their problems.
I think government owned motels/hotels are a good option for the elderly/disabled and families with kids. Healthy younger people who are temporarily homeless could be put up in tents or allowed to stay overnight in safe parking lots. People who are not disabled, elderly, seriously mentally ill or caring for children but are chronically homeless should just be chased around by cops until they get tired of it and leave. At the most they could be offered a yoga mat in a warehouse, if they refuse then they either pack up their stuff and move on or go to jail
We can't house everyone but we need to find a way to keep the most vulnerable people off the streets and out of harms way.
I think government owned motels/hotels are a good option for the elderly/disabled and families with kids. Healthy younger people who are temporarily homeless could be put up in tents or allowed to stay overnight in safe parking lots. People who are not disabled, elderly, seriously mentally ill or caring for children but are chronically homeless should just be chased around by cops until they get tired of it and leave. At the most they could be offered a yoga mat in a warehouse, if they refuse then they either pack up their stuff and move on or go to jail
We can't house everyone but we need to find a way to keep the most vulnerable people off the streets and out of harms way.
I agree with you (for once...:-) But what do we do with the homeless who like it that way? A few instances in SoCal show that 90% of them prefer their Gypsy lifestyle and they refuse any help if it is accompanied with any rules.... should we just lock them all up? Or chase them all down the road....? I honestly don't know....
But I agree with you about protecting the most in harms way. This is a tough one that all of us must find an answer to.....
I agree with you (for once...:-) But what do we do with the homeless who like it that way? A few instances in SoCal show that 90% of them prefer their Gypsy lifestyle and they refuse any help if it is accompanied with any rules.... should we just lock them all up? Or chase them all down the road....? I honestly don't know....
But I agree with you about protecting the most in harms way. This is a tough one that all of us must find an answer to.....
I know what you mean about the people on the street who have turned it into a sort of 24/7 party lifestyle and it bothers me too. The 9th circuit ruled that homelessness is not a crime, but if you delve into that decision you will see that the court said "if" a person is offered a safe place to sleep and they refuse it then you can order them to move off of the sidewalk /street and if they don't comply you can arrest them. An example - At a Police Dept in Northern California where I know several Officers, they have identified enough shelter space (with help from local churches) so that if a homeless person refuses the offer of a shelter bed the cops can order them off of the street. If they don't immediately comply, pack up their stuff and hit the road, they go to jail. While it's true that the jail will likely book and release them, they will be about 15 miles from 'home' and finding a way back on foot will be a struggle. Most homeless people don't test their luck with camping on the streets very much after they go through that once or twice.
That approach isn't perfect, but at least they don't have a bunch of half naked toothless 45 year old women flirting with toothless shirtless men of a similar age in the Walgreens or Safeway parking lot like we have in Sacramento. That's something that makes me wish I could mount a fire hose on my car and use it on them grrr... And honestly I don't care if these people abuse drugs or alcohol or not, if they are able bodied and not seriously mentally ill, they need to at least be respectful enough to keep their lifestyle out of public view because I don't want to see it and I don't want my grandkids seeing it and possibly 'normalizing it'.
Reno PD uses a different approach, they just stop the homeless and harass them all day, telling them they match a suspect they are looking for and making them go through field sobriety tests and warrant checks etc. You do that often enough and those people get very reluctant to draw attention to themselves in public.
The danger in both approaches is that a cop doesn't use good judgment they may end up harassing or arresting someone who is really ill or really needs help, not jail.
I don't think 90% refusal is accurate, at least not according to cops I have talked to, it's more like 10-20% and those are usually people who are mentally ill and exceptionally paranoid.
I agree with you (for once...:-) But what do we do with the homeless who like it that way? A few instances in SoCal show that 90% of them prefer their Gypsy lifestyle and they refuse any help if it is accompanied with any rules.... should we just lock them all up? Or chase them all down the road....? I honestly don't know....
But I agree with you about protecting the most in harms way. This is a tough one that all of us must find an answer to.....
2sleepy is right in this, but no city will do it to the degree it needs, as the costs will be too high, too many groups will institute law suits to stop the proper dealing with the addicted and ... a few will be helped. I would like to see the truly needy helped and the bums who want a lawless life taken away to a facility where they change or stay there for good. Cheaper and safer for everyone else too.
I know what you mean about the people on the street who have turned it into a sort of 24/7 party lifestyle and it bothers me too. The 9th circuit ruled that homelessness is not a crime, but if you delve into that decision you will see that the court said "if" a person is offered a safe place to sleep and they refuse it then you can order them to move off of the sidewalk /street and if they don't comply you can arrest them. An example - At a Police Dept in Northern California where I know several Officers, they have identified enough shelter space (with help from local churches) so that if a homeless person refuses the offer of a shelter bed the cops can order them off of the street. If they don't immediately comply, pack up their stuff and hit the road, they go to jail. While it's true that the jail will likely book and release them, they will be about 15 miles from 'home' and finding a way back on foot will be a struggle. Most homeless people don't test their luck with camping on the streets very much after they go through that once or twice.
That approach isn't perfect, but at least they don't have a bunch of half naked toothless 45 year old women flirting with toothless shirtless men of a similar age in the Walgreens or Safeway parking lot like we have in Sacramento. That's something that makes me wish I could mount a fire hose on my car and use it on them grrr... And honestly I don't care if these people abuse drugs or alcohol or not, if they are able bodied and not seriously mentally ill, they need to at least be respectful enough to keep their lifestyle out of public view because I don't want to see it and I don't want my grandkids seeing it and possibly 'normalizing it'.
Reno PD uses a different approach, they just stop the homeless and harass them all day, telling them they match a suspect they are looking for and making them go through field sobriety tests and warrant checks etc. You do that often enough and those people get very reluctant to draw attention to themselves in public.
The danger in both approaches is that a cop doesn't use good judgment they may end up harassing or arresting someone who is really ill or really needs help, not jail.
I don't think 90% refusal is accurate, at least not according to cops I have talked to, it's more like 10-20% and those are usually people who are mentally ill and exceptionally paranoid.
I am in Orlando FL a lot right now and they have a great arrangement. They have what they call Downtown Ambassadors who help the homeless with food and shelter, clothing and medication, etc. BUT they will NOT allow them to sleep on any city street or property. They do it, the get arrested and while being taken to jail any belongings are left behind and when they get out... they have just the clothes on their bask, no drugs, no alcohol, etc. The Ambassadors, paid city workers who walk the streets all day downtown, help the homeless and if they see them trying to sleep they simply tell them what will happen and give them directions as to where to go. I know many homeless there and am aware of others who I have not met. They obey and lead better lives than in LA.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
