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Old 09-15-2020, 02:09 PM
 
Location: all over the place (figuratively)
6,602 posts, read 4,816,232 times
Reputation: 3591

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Quote:
Originally Posted by jbgusa View Post
From what funds does "the state...help restaurants more with rent"? Santa Claus?
Newsom and state representatives will have to fight with the Federal government for it. As other states need less and less help or after the election, more money will be allocated to California. Also, the governor has the option of eventually opening indoor dining in a few counties with virtually no virus using extreme, zero-tolerance restrictions, including very little capacity and county residents only.

 
Old 09-15-2020, 02:24 PM
DKM
 
Location: California
6,767 posts, read 3,788,700 times
Reputation: 6690
Shut downs are not needed. We needed it in March/April because the modeling gave us good reasons to believe it would be worse than it turned out to be.

That said, full reopening (unrestricted gatherings) isn't going to happen because we don't want everyone to get this. Our economy can't afford to deal with 10's of millions of sick people needing expensive treatment for a long time.

The vaccine is the answer and we are going to likely see the Pfizer one begin to be rolled out by the New Year. It will take half a year to get most of America vaccinated so we can get back to normal. Assuming the Pfizer one works (I have strong reasons to believe it does)...otherwise the timeline will be a bit later than that.
 
Old 09-15-2020, 02:30 PM
 
Location: So Ca
26,592 posts, read 26,472,892 times
Reputation: 24536
Quote:
Originally Posted by DKM View Post
The vaccine is the answer and we are going to likely see the Pfizer one begin to be rolled out by the New Year.
Human trials consist of at least three phases: Phase 1 for safety, Phase 2 for efficacy and dosing, and Phase 3 for efficacy in a huge group of tens of thousands of people. At least six COVID-19 vaccines are in or about to enter Phase 3 trials, which will take several more months.

A Vaccine Reality Check:
https://www.theatlantic.com/health/a...-check/614566/
 
Old 09-15-2020, 03:08 PM
 
Location: On the water.
21,597 posts, read 16,091,646 times
Reputation: 19631
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbgusa View Post
Do you have any plan to end such a shutdown?
Lol. What good would it do if I did? Who would take my plan to action?

All this yammering and complaining and inexpert analyzing and proposing on forums and social media is just anxiety ridden emoting. I’m not a doctor, scientist, economist, policy-maker. I am a sporting logician. I see illogical, inexpert nonsense all around and rather randomly dissect for sport.

You come up with some fun targets. As I responded previously: your concern for a healthy economy ignored the requirement of healthy workforce and healthy consumers to support the economy.
 
Old 09-15-2020, 07:41 PM
 
Location: San Diego Native
4,433 posts, read 2,389,777 times
Reputation: 4801
Quote:
Originally Posted by tikkasf View Post
Until there is one or more vaccines that are safe & have a fairly high degree of effectiveness, I can't see full reopening in the cards.........unless the prediction put out months ago by one individual, that the virus will just "go away" turns out to be true....

If the questions of reinfection were settled, and there was more definitive data on the severity of such cases, it would sort of go away for anyone who's already survived it. Since we still don't even know how many asymptomatic carriers there were/are, it's hard to determine what will happen in the interim. Besides that, does everyone feel comfortable with a vaccine that may be rushed for no other reasons than politics? I'm a bit leery of that.
 
Old 09-15-2020, 08:01 PM
 
6,675 posts, read 4,236,644 times
Reputation: 8441
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tulemutt View Post
Lol. What good would it do if I did? Who would take my plan to action?

All this yammering and complaining and inexpert analyzing and proposing on forums and social media is just anxiety ridden emoting. I’m not a doctor, scientist, economist, policy-maker. I am a sporting logician. I see illogical, inexpert nonsense all around and rather randomly dissect for sport.

You come up with some fun targets. As I responded previously: your concern for a healthy economy ignored the requirement of healthy workforce and healthy consumers to support the economy.
The restrictions don’t seem to be making a huge difference, at least not in San Diego. We do good, restrictions are lifted and the cases go up. Then restrictions are reinstated. San Diego got into the red zone and now, because of a spike at SDSU, one more week of increased cases will send us back to the purple.

To bankrupt small businesses and put so many people out of work is crazy. There’s got to be a better way. The big stores are open while the small businesses have to close.

You take people’s temperature at the door. I had to do that when I went for an eye exam and dental appointment. You make masks mandatory to go in and ENFORCE it. You have reduced capacity, but you don’t keep opening and closing.

Small businesses spend thousands of dollars to modify their business so they can reopen and then get told they have to close. You can’t keep places closed indefinitely and end up with massive unemployment and business failures.

It seems like it’s going to take some lawsuits ala Pennsylvania to get Newsom to loosen his grip.
 
Old 09-15-2020, 08:26 PM
DKM
 
Location: California
6,767 posts, read 3,788,700 times
Reputation: 6690
Quote:
Originally Posted by CA4Now View Post
Human trials consist of at least three phases: Phase 1 for safety, Phase 2 for efficacy and dosing, and Phase 3 for efficacy in a huge group of tens of thousands of people. At least six COVID-19 vaccines are in or about to enter Phase 3 trials, which will take several more months.

A Vaccine Reality Check:
https://www.theatlantic.com/health/a...-check/614566/
LOL are you even aware that Pfizer has been in phase 3 for two months already? They just expanded it from 30 to 44 thousand people, and it will be expanded further starting next month as they are going to try it in 12 years old and up.


Quote:
Originally Posted by joosoon View Post
If the questions of reinfection were settled, and there was more definitive data on the severity of such cases, it would sort of go away for anyone who's already survived it. Since we still don't even know how many asymptomatic carriers there were/are, it's hard to determine what will happen in the interim. Besides that, does everyone feel comfortable with a vaccine that may be rushed for no other reasons than politics? I'm a bit leery of that.
You really think vaccine development are given unlimited resources to finish "for no other reasons than politics"?
 
Old 09-15-2020, 08:53 PM
 
Location: On the water.
21,597 posts, read 16,091,646 times
Reputation: 19631
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike930 View Post
... To bankrupt small businesses and put so many people out of work is crazy. There’s got to be a better way. The big stores are open while the small businesses have to close.


... You can’t keep places closed indefinitely and end up with massive unemployment and business failures.
It’s also crazy to let a pandemic run free ... which will put so many out of work and worse soon enough on its own.

Places don’t have to be closed indefinitely - IF public health protocols would be adopted and followed cooperatively en-masse. What has kept this shut down fumbling and extending, and what threatens to continue the dismal failure, is simply a lack of cooperative effort on the part of everybody ... without protesting “muh freedoms”!!!

That’s your “better way” ... full stop.
 
Old 09-15-2020, 09:03 PM
 
Location: So Ca
26,592 posts, read 26,472,892 times
Reputation: 24536
Quote:
Originally Posted by DKM View Post
LOL are you even aware that Pfizer has been in phase 3 for two months already? They just expanded it from 30 to 44 thousand people, and...
"LOL." Yes. Do you know how long that takes?

Most Americans Won’t Be Able to Get a Coronavirus Vaccine Until Well Into 2021
The first doses will likely be reserved for health workers and others at high risk:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...well-into-2021

General Public Won't Receive COVID-19 Vaccine Until Mid To Late 2021, Doctor Predicts:
https://www.wbur.org/hereandnow/2020...e-distribution
 
Old 09-15-2020, 09:20 PM
 
6,675 posts, read 4,236,644 times
Reputation: 8441
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tulemutt View Post
It’s also crazy to let a pandemic run free ... which will put so many out of work and worse soon enough on its own.

Places don’t have to be closed indefinitely - IF public health protocols would be adopted and followed cooperatively en-masse. What has kept this shut down fumbling and extending, and what threatens to continue the dismal failure, is simply a lack of cooperative effort on the part of everybody ... without protesting “muh freedoms”!!!

That’s your “better way” ... full stop.
Depending on the study you read, 40%-80% of people that test positive are asymptomatic. People act like this has a 95% mortality rate and it’s simply not so.

A month ago or so, we were a hot spot along with Arizona and Florida. California has some of the tightest restrictions in the country, yet we were up there with two states that were much more open. Those restrictions didn’t seem to help very much.

There’s a number of businesses that have said they’re going to ignore the state if they tell them they have to close for the third time. I’ll be supporting those businesses.
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