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Truthsayer - thanks, that video was totally awesome. I made it up to Hyperion a couple months ago myself and found the journey to be a wonderful experience - never would have found the tree without the GPS coordinates and solid directions from FR. I also visited several other trees listed on the FR website and found the directions to be spot on.
I took detailed photos and videos at Hyperion and compared them to ones taken by the FR photographer(s) a year earlier and found absolutely no wear and tear on the root structure or surrounding ground cover - so much for FR causing damage to Hyperion.
Your post very illustrates the potential error of limited amounts of time, knowledge, experience or scope of observation. Plus you made a comparison of mere months. Grove of Titans initially didn't show much wear the first months, but eventually became thousands of square meters. Hyperion is different, and concerns of others haven't been simply the one redwood itself, but vegetation throughout the entire area. Unlike omission from your post and the other's about damage by the video group or others, this more complete Hyperion page mentions the church group plus the damage their own video self-incriminated.
When I spoke to rangers at RNP a couple years ago, they said they didn't mind people exploring, as long as irreversible plant or soil damage didn't occur. You mentioned the video of the church group going there, but omitted the fact the video showed one of their group breaking a Rhododendron. That's only the damage shown in that one moment by one person. Common sense and probability let's any viewer realize the entire group damaged much more vegetation during the rest of their experiment. So what you wrote is pretty much hollow opinion since even others have self-documented their own damage. That's how bigger damaged happened at the GOT ... one plant at a time.
And the one thing I haven't seen at any time is leakers or whiners pointing out and showing real and specific damage of the long term or short term. It's pretty much fear on their part. A classic example was the old GOT trio of two guys and a woman. In all the years, they never posted an ounce of ongoing damage.
To any other readers:
Don't worry about seeing actual photos of Hyperion, unlike montclairion's invisible one-year shots. Given some appropriate time, I will almost certainly post some real side by side comparisons. And I have high-resolution photos that will provide a look back some years. I don't expect Hyperion to experience wear quite like the Grove of Titans. But I heard first hand from people who saw Hyperion from years ago, and they relayed some change that tells me montclairion's less-than-entry-level description here is not the way things really are.
I guess is that less square meters of damage will occur around Hyperion, also some damage will occur. The rest of the damage will be spread out through the route to the tree. People could argue over whether they think the soon to be en-route damage is acceptable - that's different from the damage itself.
Back in 2014, if anyone went to Hyperion, they would not be able to tell anybody had been around the trunk for 100 feet radius at least. If anyone visits now, and you can tell by looking that someone was there, that will tell you some change is in effect.
Truthsayer - thanks, that video was totally awesome.
I took detailed photos and videos at Hyperion and compared them to ones taken by the FR photographer(s) a year earlier and found absolutely no wear and tear on the root structure or surrounding ground cover - so much for FR causing damage to Hyperion.
Actually ... maybe "so much" for anyone getting duped. Following my last reply, which can be skipped-over now, someone emailed providing a late summer 2015 image showing obvious wear and tear at Hyperion from the get-go. When anybody says there's no wear and tear, when there is, that may bring to mind the old saying "lying through their teeth". What other conclusion should they reach amidst an antithesis? Real comparison showing wear can be found on the page provided, selecting small pics for enlargement. One at top, and one down near 12/2016 updates:
The side-by-side comparison shows how unreliable posts by anonymous users on forums can be. Whether or not people like the wear and tear, that's up to readers to decide. This just establishes the fact that change is happening. Readers need to ask themselves, why will someone claim there is no wear and tear, while images prove the opposite? It can't just be eye glasses need replacement.
Mario, I just watched the video twice again. I'd highly recommend it. Anyone who hasn't seen it should have a look. It's some kids making their way up to Hyperion and having a good time.
Gee, breaking a rhododendron - God forbid. I think you're speaking about that clip when they're hiking along the fallen tree, which is one of the easier routes up the slope, and I tried several. The fact is that there's no way you're going to make it up the slope along that route without stepping on vegetation unless you're wearing gravity boots. That's just how it is. Just as when you walk across a meadow you step on grass. And I'll let you in on a secret - it grows back. I have to cut this stuff back every year with a chain saw just so I can walk around my house. And you know what, a year later we have to cut it back again. And we don't have anywhere near the amount of precipitation that dumps up in RNP.
As I stated earlier I took a number of pictures and videos and compared them to ones taken the previous season and could not see any additional wear and tear around Hyperion when comparing my images to ones taken by the FR people. In fact, it was clear that there was some new growth that had pushed its way out during the rains. Sorry, I don't buy your doom and gloom scenario. The vegetation up there grows rampantly during the winters. Also, I ventured much higher up the slope and paralleled Tom McDonald Creek for some ways and came across many other formidable trees and can say that the understory around Hyperion was no better or worse than trees that might never have been approached by humans. Not to mention that I spent an entire day up in the Tom McDonald Creek area during good weather in late summer and never came across another soul. So, this specific area is certainly not being overrun due to the publishing of FR.
I'd highly recommend that anyone who feels the need to see this country - just do it while you can. And don't worry about staying on the paths because there aren't any. But please use caution when stepping on stones and pebbles at the bottom of the creek. The last thing you would want to do would be to displace them from their original positions. Their configurations are sacred and should be preserved for future generations. The park rangers take the pebble configurations very seriously and the last thing you want to do is **** them off.
You are not the person I met on route to Grove of Titans are you? Several months ago - maybe March or April.
I have found a few tallest ones, but tend to like the fat and odd trunk ones the best, since they make for some interesting photographs.
Have you ever stood in the parking lot for Big Tree, and looked north to it's right among the tree tops?
I'm also going to get a photo of one called 'Fusion Giant' but can't post what grove it's in. It's previous 348.6' height and 22.4' diameter trunk indicate it's probably the mystery titan listed as 2nd largest on the Humboldt State Univ. redwood's photo webpage noted to be 348.8' tall.
Actually - I was amazed about 6 hours after I posted this. Someone who also tracks big trees, emailed me their entire file about clues for Hyperion, and it looks like they pin-pointed the right tributary.
I'm just planning to explore the confluence and get a general feel for the terrain and vegetation. I'd rather return next winter or spring with a 10 person group, to divide into 5 x two-person teams, with radios.
Mainly would like to get some nice photos of it. Not interesting in climbing. I'm not one of these "Ninja Climbers". If I was, I'd already have been up Iluvatar, as it looks like one of the better jungle-gyms.
Well, I'll be between Trinidad, Crescent City and Harris Beach State Park in Brookings for 6 days starting next Sunday afternoon. If you see a maroon 2008 Chev pickup pulling a royal blue cargo trailer with diamond plate accents - that will be me. I'll probably drop the trailer a lot of the time, but it does have a nice assortment of snacks inside.
Fusion Giant-- That is Melkor, isn't it?
Apparently it is located in tall trees grove, although I couldn't find it. I did find Hyperion though.
What makes you think that he is FR? Just because he brings up valid points to counter-argue you and to protect his side of thinking, you shouldn't cause someone. Sure, I do visit FR sometimes, and there is one trivial error there. It should post the location of the GROVE, not of the tree itself, so that people can have a chance to find the tree for themselves. Orion's cover is broken, and so is Hyperion's. Helios and Icarus continue to be safe, but that is only because even if you analyse The Wild Trees and be armed with the fire scar photograph of M.D. Vaden, miss out one piece of information and you can get way off course. I think I know where the area is, but I will not reveal it in order to protect the tree. If Hyperion receives a lot of visitors, it WILL collapse into the creek, and the same thing will happen to Helios if it's location is protected. I can see how easy it is to analyse different sources and clues for ages and then walk right past the tree itself. Probably people have passed by Helios without knowing it or taking a close look at the bark. I hope Helios, along with Icarus, which is even better hidden and Millennium, will be safe for a couple of years.
Reading through Mr. Vaden's Hyperion page tonight and a number of intriguing updates there. Some great info about why Hyperion could be considered 386 feet tall. Also nice link to donate to the reward fund. Donate, donate, donate, peeps!
Also saw Mr. Hall finally got around to posting an update. He mocks the fact that FR can't find Helios. I mock him too. I'm going to be laughing my butt off for years to come since FR can't find Helios.
Been doing some soul searching and asking around. It is widely been realized that either -1- FR obtained their information by hacking or theft by hacking into Mr. Vaden, Mr. Sillett, Mr. Taylor, or the Humboldt State computers OR -2- someone on the inside is behind FR. Perhaps "y" is the person is what I'm being told.
They'll find it... eventually. There are so much clues scattered all over the internet, on the large side in The Wild Trees, and on the small side in Mr. Hall's blog. If they analyse these, they will find it, although the likelihood of a mistake is really high. Icarus is even more hidden, as there are far less clues for it. Where does "A darning needle of a redwood with a dead, sun-bleached top" get you? Practically nowhere unless you find Helios. Helios is 700ft into one valley and 60ft up a creek. They have The Wild Trees, which when put together gives you a powerful conclusion. They have Mr. Hall's blog. They have many other sources. So when they do find Helios, and they will, and Icarus will follow since it is in the same area, what are you going to do? I seriously hope that Icarus doesn't get found though. I think it is a very beautiful tree. I can see how people can walk right past these giants.
What proof do you have of that, Mr. Graham? To me he appears to be someone who is just pretending to be interested in the debate and both sides, but when it comes down to it, he truly only supports one side of the argument... that of FR.
People have different thoughts on this topic. You think that it is terrible to disclose locations. It think you should not disclose locations BUT you should publish photos. Or it is FR's instructions leading to trees. Your problem is that you do not listen to the end and instead accuse a random person of what he does that isn't remotely related to FR just because he thinks alike me and alike totallyawesometruthsayer. Do not accuse someone because you want to get the search wrapped up. And if that website is shut down, I will take over. I have enough clues to find Helios myself. And please do not say rude comments. You are like a person who believes in what he thinks is right and flushes the thoughts of others down the toilet. So stop accusing people.
No they don't. You can't find Orion. You can't find Helios. lol
And can you? Can you find Helios? Did you find Orion? Show us the megalodon tooth mark. Or you are just a person who hates another person because of the way he thinks.
It's successful if your only interest is in "avoiding damage" and "keeping the groves pristine," but the approach is a complete failure at increasing the public enjoyment of noteworthy specimens. If you think that natural features are somehow entitled to avoid any and all impact from human enjoyment, you're a crazy person. Just because you surround yourself with other crazy people doesn't keep you guys from being utterly nutzo.
Scientology is a crazy UFO cult, and also attempt to keep lots of things secret from outsiders. You know what happened when they tried to silence leakers on the internet? Anonymous happened. They're never going to recover from that. And if you think the tall tree community is immune from the weaponized autism of nihilistic nerds being unleashed upon it because you are a small target with a righteous cause, then you should better google the word "lolcow" and the phrase "Streisand effect" and reflect upon the definitions in light of your reactions.
Intentional vandalism and burl hunting are bad things and those who do it should be prosecuted, but trampled vegetation in the forest is just a consequence of it being an interesting thing among all the other self interested and mobile things on earth.
I cannot agree more, TATS. Scientism is egoistic, keeping all the great finds to themselves and never letting anyone find anything. And imagine how upset they will be when someone posts a selfie next to the trunk of Icarus on instagram? However, they also make a fair point: these trees will be damaged if you do not act carefully, and I respect that. It think that these trees should keep hidden, but one website to give away the creek at least. It is a big if if they can find the tree. Trampled vegetation is a minuscule problem, but redwood thunder is not.
Some people think alike others. What would you do if you find Helios again? I know you know the location, but what would you do in this case? In my case, it would be printed out, and posted over the internet, but NOT with any coordinates attached.
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