Public employees are breaking Californias back (vehicle registration, school, DMV)

[steel7]

I regret not ever getting a city or county or state or even us govt job. If i knew then what i know now my life would be better. I never even used a computer until 11-2000.

[mysticaltyger]

Originally Posted by eureka1

I love how the anti-State worker crowd always uses the example of the 30-year retiree. Most State workers leave at well under 30 years because they can do better elsewhere. I'm leaving this Fall after ten years and if you think State employment is so great go ahead and apply for my job. You're welcome to it.

It's true, most people don't work the whole 30 years to collect the full pension. But let's face it, most people in private industry don't get pensions AT ALL. And the pension formula for public sector pensions is generous, usually 2% to 2.5% of salary x number of years worked (and often even more generous for cops/firemen). Private sector pensions are not that generous (for those who still get them).

[mysticaltyger]

Originally Posted by JohnG72

Not sure why people are getting on the cops. Yeah they have good retirement benefits. But do your really want to do their job? What about their life expectancy of 57 years or so(15 years less than the average male)...what about the fact that 50% of officers pass away within 5 years of retirement(hence the low life expectancy stat).

If you want the real problem with public sector employees.....its those that juice the system. There are many ways to do this....the biggest is with overtime. I know supervisors that purposely create schedules to accomodate employees working the most overtime possible. The grossest example I know of is a LAX(city of Los Angeles) clerical employee with a base pay of just over $40K a year who made over $105K in 2007 due to OT. And the thing was....it was totally unnecessary. But the supervisor stacked 4 employees in a 2 employee job so that this employee could work the 2 days a week that were not covered on both day and swing shift(so 16 hours of OT twice a week).

I will tell you why I get on the cops/firemen/prison guards. They have gotten outsize raises compared with the other public sector unions for more than a decade. I do not begrudge them good salaries with comfortable retirements. But enough is enough! Their salaries are out of line with reality. And, in the case of cops & firemen, they are the majority (around 80%) of any city's payroll. Their outsize salaries are crowding out cities' ability to provide other services.

I would like to see some proof of the life expectancy stats. I'm not saying they're not true, but I admit I'm skeptical.

As far as juicing the system with overtime, I know that is not possible in the large city (not Los Angeles) where I work. Pensions are based on "base salary" only. OT is not factored in. I'd add that in my city, very few non police/fire workers even have the option to work OT, and that has been true for at least the last 5 years. This is only my experience and may not be true everywhere.

[Ultrarunner]

Coming full circle... the fact for most cities is Police and Fire are the lion's share of the budget.

When forced to make cut-backs... they have to come from the area where the most money is spent.

It wasn't always this way...

[Huckleberry3911948]

you could contract it all out, but then you wont believe what happens next.
you you call 911 you guna get a min wage rent a cop w no gun.

[Curmudgeon]

Originally Posted by Huckleberry3911948

you could contract it all out, but then you wont believe what happens next.
you you call 911 you guna get a min wage rent a cop w no gun.

For this former cop, that is reminiscent of the old 60's and 70's mantra, "If you dislike the police, the next time you're in trouble, call a hippie!"

[JohnG72]

Originally Posted by mysticaltyger

.
I would like to see some proof of the life expectancy stats. I'm not saying they're not true, but I admit I'm skeptical.

The Police Policy Studies Council

http://911abc.com/copkiller.pdf

Originally Posted by mysticaltyger

.
As far as juicing the system with overtime, I know that is not possible in the large city (not Los Angeles) where I work. Pensions are based on "base salary" only. OT is not factored in. I'd add that in my city, very few non police/fire workers even have the option to work OT, and that has been true for at least the last 5 years. This is only my experience and may not be true everywhere.

OT does not count towards our retirement either(though shift bonus does), but some of the city employees here have made OT an art form.

My personal contact favorite was......

At a job I used to work, we were responsible for our own workload. If a project or work item was due on a day we were off, and we couldn't finish it before then or get one of our coworkers to handle it on the off day, then we had to come in for overtime. In general, it would take only 1-2 hours of work on the off day, usually to meet with a couple people for a half hour or so. Whenever a particular co-worker had this happen....and it happened a lot cause she was a crummy coworker and no one ever wanted to be handed her work which inevitably would not be done as much as it should have been.....she would come into work with a huge bag full of her coupons, bills, etc. So she would put in the one or two hours working on the item and then stay a total of ten hours clipping coupons and doing her bills and stuff and claim 10 hours OT on the day. Thing is, she only lived about 20 minute drive from work(8 miles away) and it did not inconvinience her to come into work for a few hours only. I actually made her cry one day because I kept ripping on her for her selfishness and then it got worse when I told her I didn't feel sorry for her at all and that she was piggish in her work habits. That did not go over well. Of course she and everyone like her does not see any moral wrong in taking advantage of the system. Whatever.

Anyway, it comes to a complete halt on June 21 for City of Los Angeles employees as there will be no more civilian overtime available except in rare operrational necessity cases.

[mysticaltyger]

Originally Posted by eagle7

I regret not ever getting a city or county or state or even us govt job. If i knew then what i know now my life would be better. I never even used a computer until 11-2000.

I wouldn't be too upset about not working for the gov't. in California. I wonder whether I will actually get my pension in 16 years at age 55 or if California (or the US for that matter) will have bankrupted itself by then.

[mysticaltyger]

Originally Posted by Ultrarunner

Coming full circle... the fact for most cities is Police and Fire are the lion's share of the budget.

When forced to make cut-backs... they have to come from the area where the most money is spent.

It wasn't always this way...

Bingo! My city has reached the point where they could close all the parks and libraries and it would still not even come close to making up for the red ink in the budget. I'm sure it's the same in other cities.

[mysticaltyger]

Originally Posted by JohnG72

The Police Policy Studies Council

http://911abc.com/copkiller.pdf



OT does not count towards our retirement either(though shift bonus does), but some of the city employees here have made OT an art form.

My personal contact favorite was......

At a job I used to work, we were responsible for our own workload. If a project or work item was due on a day we were off, and we couldn't finish it before then or get one of our coworkers to handle it on the off day, then we had to come in for overtime. In general, it would take only 1-2 hours of work on the off day, usually to meet with a couple people for a half hour or so. Whenever a particular co-worker had this happen....and it happened a lot cause she was a crummy coworker and no one ever wanted to be handed her work which inevitably would not be done as much as it should have been.....she would come into work with a huge bag full of her coupons, bills, etc. So she would put in the one or two hours working on the item and then stay a total of ten hours clipping coupons and doing her bills and stuff and claim 10 hours OT on the day. Thing is, she only lived about 20 minute drive from work(8 miles away) and it did not inconvinience her to come into work for a few hours only. I actually made her cry one day because I kept ripping on her for her selfishness and then it got worse when I told her I didn't feel sorry for her at all and that she was piggish in her work habits. That did not go over well. Of course she and everyone like her does not see any moral wrong in taking advantage of the system. Whatever.

Anyway, it comes to a complete halt on June 21 for City of Los Angeles employees as there will be no more civilian overtime available except in rare operrational necessity cases.

I will check out the stats you provided. I can tell you where I work, the kind of BS exhibited by your coworker did not fly, even during the boom times of the late 1990s. But it does sound like something that would happen somewhere like San Francisco, though.

I'm glad L.A. is clamping down on this BS. Unfortunately, it takes a horrible recesion like this before they take action.