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Old 10-24-2009, 08:05 PM
 
364 posts, read 610,943 times
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Everyone's says their local school is great, but the state ranks at the bottom year-after-year. And half of the kids graduating these "great" local schools will need remedial studies before they will be allowed into normal college courses. But everything is just peachy.
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Old 10-25-2009, 02:54 AM
 
Location: Escondido, CA
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California has the second highest percentage of English learners nationwide. (#1 is New Mexico, if I remember correctly.) That is the primary reason why the state consistently ranks near the bottom on such tests. It is difficult to score well on a math test, when you're taught math in English, and you haven't heard a word of English before the age of 6. Conversely, states near the top of the ranking are all pure-white: Montana, Minnesota, Vermont ...
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Old 10-25-2009, 02:31 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by esmith143 View Post
California has the second highest percentage of English learners nationwide. (#1 is New Mexico, if I remember correctly.) That is the primary reason why the state consistently ranks near the bottom on such tests. It is difficult to score well on a math test, when you're taught math in English, and you haven't heard a word of English before the age of 6. Conversely, states near the top of the ranking are all pure-white: Montana, Minnesota, Vermont ...
So why is Texas, arguably as bad as CA with the immigrants, on the way up and CA going down?

And Texas doesn't have nearly the institutional educational apparatus setup of California..
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Old 10-25-2009, 06:52 PM
 
Location: Escondido, CA
1,504 posts, read 6,149,881 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jb3851 View Post
So why is Texas, arguably as bad as CA with the immigrants, on the way up and CA going down?

And Texas doesn't have nearly the institutional educational apparatus setup of California..
Texas is an exception. It's basically one of the only two states with significant numbers of Latino immigrants whose nationwide rankings aren't too horrible (the other is New York). All other Latino states (Arizona, Nevada, New Mexico) are near the bottom.

Also, there are fewer immigrants in Texas than in California.

The percentage of people speaking "language other than English" at home, 2008 Census Bureau estimate:

California: 42%
Texas: 34%
Minnesota: 10%
Montana: 5%

And even that does not show the accurate picture, because CA whites tend to be older than Latinos (in the 70-80 bracket, whites outnumber latinos 5:1), and they have fewer children. By now latino children from non-English-speaking households constitute the majority of K-12 population of the state.

One other factor is that Texas manages to spend more per pupil than California, despite having lower cost of living - it does not have the stranglehold of prop 13 on local budgets, many cities in Texas have 2.5-3% property tax rates ...

Last edited by esmith143; 10-25-2009 at 07:03 PM..
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Old 10-25-2009, 07:19 PM
 
Location: Central Coast
2,014 posts, read 5,519,970 times
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No matter. What's important is their environmental awareness, non-judgemental values, self esteem and other PC rot. Besides even if they are too stupid to earn a decent job they can always live off the labor of someone else. It's the new California way. Keep voting for the same Sacramento leaders and you will get more of the same outcome. Thats logic 101, but it's not taught in shcools.
The PC stuff that is whined about is nothing more than manners, which I hope ya'll taught your kids at home.

Now, look at the test demographics, the type of kid that does well comes from parents that did well. Tough to say without sounding racist, but, the standard middle class white kids do well, and have always done well, The West, that is Europe and the US have the same problem, a large population of immigrants that do not hold to the same educational values as the West, China and Japan. You can predict American test scores by zipcode, middle to upper middle class Americans do as well as anyone, lower economic classes don't.

If you are the middleclass parent of a kid, and you provide the education that your kid needs during the 18 hours a day you have your kid, compared to the 6 hours a day the school has him, you don't have much to sweat over, if you think TV and video games are worth your kids while, you have wrecked his life.
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Old 10-27-2009, 07:51 PM
 
28,113 posts, read 63,642,682 times
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Originally Posted by esmith143 View Post
.

One other factor is that Texas manages to spend more per pupil than California, despite having lower cost of living - it does not have the stranglehold of prop 13 on local budgets, many cities in Texas have 2.5-3% property tax rates ...
Is money the answer?

If it is the students in Oakland should be stellar.

Divide the Oakland Public School Budget by the number of students and the cost per pupil is close to 15k... that's a lot of money to my way of thinking.
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Old 10-28-2009, 04:17 AM
 
Location: Escondido, CA
1,504 posts, read 6,149,881 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultrarunner View Post
Is money the answer?

If it is the students in Oakland should be stellar.

Divide the Oakland Public School Budget by the number of students and the cost per pupil is close to 15k... that's a lot of money to my way of thinking.
9.5k (445 mil. divided by 46,500 students). Not all that much. Burlington, VT spends 16k/pupil. White Plains, NY (bedroom suburb of New York City) spends 24k.

Money is not the answer, but, all else equal, money matters. If you compare Oakland High to a school with similar demographics in Alabama, Oakland High might be looking pretty good ... after all, it consistently sends 100-150 students/year to UC and CSU systems.

Last edited by esmith143; 10-28-2009 at 04:40 AM..
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Old 10-28-2009, 07:39 AM
 
364 posts, read 610,943 times
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People point to Mexicans as the reason CA test scores are low. But there is more to it than that. Are the Mexicans alone in school? Of course not. Our sons and daughters are in class with them. If the non-English speaker has trouble learning the material then the rate of learning slows down - not just for them, but for everyone. Everyone learns less including our kids who could otherwise progress much faster. So you can't simply say tough luck for the Mexicans. Our kids are suffering too.
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Old 10-29-2009, 12:50 PM
 
Location: So Ca
26,717 posts, read 26,776,017 times
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Originally Posted by sunshine7793 View Post
Everyone's says their local school is great, but the state ranks at the bottom year-after-year.
What I don't understand is why class size reduction (20 to 1, vs the former 33 or so to 1) implemented in the late 1990's in grades K-4 doesn't seem to have improved scores.

Quote:
half of the kids graduating these "great" local schools will need remedial studies before they will be allowed into normal college courses.
Hopefully since they now have to pass the CAHSEE to get a diploma, they won't end up in remedial classes in college. But you never know, since it's a multiple choice exam.
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Old 10-29-2009, 01:39 PM
 
Location: Central Coast
2,014 posts, read 5,519,970 times
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If the non-English speaker has trouble learning the material then the rate of learning slows down - not just for them, but for everyone. Everyone learns less including our kids who could otherwise progress much faster. So you can't simply say tough luck for the Mexicans. Our kids are suffering too.

Not many Mexican kids in AP classes holding back the class. I trust your kid is AP material, if not why not?

Test scores can be predicated by zip code, place of residence is dictated by economics, generally. Therefore, test scores are related to economic much more than by race. Low economics, low test scores, high economics high test scores.

A kid from a bad home life will do poorly, Mexican or Anglo.
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