Opinion Piece: The Golden State isn't worth it (Los Angeles, Orange: bankrupt, living in)

[AnUnidentifiedMale]

Originally Posted by mysticaltyger

To the OP, what'd I tell 'ya???? It's always the Repbulicans' fault no matter how much proof you provide./sarc.

Funny. Reading your posts, my impression is that you believe that Democrats are to blame for all or most of the country's problems.

The shoe fits both feet.

[sav858]

Originally Posted by AnUnidentifiedMale

Subways? Light rail? I know there are many enthusiasts of those things, but I'm not one of them - at least not much of one. I do think that inner-city subways are a good idea, but freeways are at least as important for regional transportation. Unfortunately, L.A. County long ago decided that public transportation would somehow be their savior. It's almost like a sick joke: Look at the difference as you travel on Interstate-5 between L.A. County and Orange County. One county (L.A.) continues to waste millions/billions on public transportation as freeway traffic gets worse every year, while the other (Orange) has wisely invested in freeway expansion, while also maintaining its public transportation infrastructure. The difference between the two counties is stark.

Yet freeway traffic gets worse and worse every year in Orange County too. But the difference is that LA has some alternatives and will have more in the future. LA is a great example of how you can never build enough freeways to solve congestion, it never has happened and never will. Orange County, along with many other metro areas, are repeating the same mistakes LA did and they're going to end up with the same results and pretty much already have. Focusing on just one mode of transportation is shortsighted and stupid imo.

[Clarks]

Funny. Reading your posts, my impression is that you believe that Democrats are to blame for all or most of the country's problems.

The shoe fits both feet.

Just an innocent question here, what have Republicans ever done for the good of California, or the US of A?

[Ultrarunner]

Originally Posted by Clarks

Just an innocent question here, what have Republicans ever done for the good of California, or the US of A?

That's easy... Abraham Lincoln

[Ultrarunner]

Originally Posted by Alexus

Yes, we have already been through this have we not? You better believe that I lay the blame on Bush and his inept administration. No one you knew was out of work, yet we were swiftly headed for a sure Depression, so a few people weren't doing as well. Quite a few people were only 30 cents from a quarter.

Bush and Republicans created an environment that facilitated failure and that's what happened not only in this state but nationally. Economic, wall street, housing, medical care, illegal immigration, education, crime, infrastructure, you name it, he failed. As Obama has repeatedly said, recovering will take patience and time. Already, it has taken him 9 months to lift the country out of recession. His work continues.

Better times are expected all around, but you're nuts if you think that digging this country from under the mess that Bush built is going to be remedied in a matter of months. It is happening however, but it's clear now that Republicans flat out stink.

I know you're sensitive to that, despite "never being a Republican", but that's reality.

Yes... I thought so, but it is a recurring theme.

President Bush was out of control on spending and candidate Obama rightly called him on it...

President Obama makes Bushes spending look like a weekend binge in comparison... I just don't see how record deficit spending benefits anyone

[Clarks]

I am glad you wrote Abraham Lincoln, as all of us know, The Republicans of 1860 were the leftists and the Democratic party of 1860 were the conservatives. The more accurate phrasing of my question is What have Conservatives done for the good of this state or nation. I used the term Republican as a narrowed response to the post above.

Although, regarding Mr. Lincoln, I think the events of this past summer show that perhaps he should have let the Confederacy
go.

President Obama makes Bushes spending look like a weekend binge in comparison... I just don't see how record deficit spending benefits anyone

I think the deficit is around 12-13 trillion right now? Bush gave us 7 trillion of that, which means Obama gave us 5 or 6 trillion, and as all of us educated people know, government deficit spending is the only way to cure a recession/depression, and it worked, Kudos to Obama.

[Ultrarunner]

Originally Posted by Clarks

I am glad you wrote Abraham Lincoln, as all of us know, The Republicans of 1860 were the leftists and the Democratic party of 1860 were the conservatives. The more accurate phrasing of my question is What have Conservatives done for the good of this state or nation. I used the term Republican as a narrowed response to the post above.

Although, regarding Mr. Lincoln, I think the events of this past summer show that perhaps he should have let the Confederacy
go.


I think the deficit is around 12-13 trillion right now? Bush gave us 7 trillion of that, which means Obama gave us 5 or 6 trillion, and as all of us educated people know, government deficit spending is the only way to cure a recession/depression, and it worked, Kudos to Obama.

If you equate devaluing the currency as curing a recession/depression...

Using your numbers, President Obama has continued on Bush's theme... only President Obama has done it in 9 months instead of Bush's 8 years

Funny thing... if I try to cure my own recession/depression by spending beyond my means... it's called reckless and often ends in Bankruptcy...

As an Educated person with my degree in Engineering... I can attest that deficit spending only kicks the can down the road and saddles the next generation with debt... at the end of the day nature doesn't tolerate deficits...

[mysticaltyger]

Originally Posted by AnUnidentifiedMale

Yes. What did that have to do with voting corruption out of office?

Ventura ended his one term about as popular as Bush was at the end of his second term. In other words, most people were happy to see him leave.

Ok, I'll have to concede this one to you. Maybe MN politics looks better from afar than it does up close. As far as I know, their state's financial situation is better than what we have in CA, although that's true for almost all states.

On the transportation issue.....The more freeways you build, the more people drive, and the further they live from work. It's a never ending vicious cycle. It's also unsafe. People worry about violent crime, but more than 2x the number of people die in traffic accidents than are murdered.

[mysticaltyger]

Originally Posted by AnUnidentifiedMale

Funny. Reading your posts, my impression is that you believe that Democrats are to blame for all or most of the country's problems.

The shoe fits both feet.

Most, but not all. I've admitted many a time that Republicans are merely the lesser evil.

I'd vote for Democrats every time if they held the line on spending and were liberal on social issues. But that's almost never what they do.

[mysticaltyger]

Originally Posted by CrownVic95

Are you saying this with a straight face? You think the American auto industry became what it is/was (sadly) because of brainwashing? You couldn't be more mistaken.

Americans' love for the automobile and a little elbow room around their living space grew simply out of recognition of their benefits. The brainwashing attempts come from those motivated by fringe ideology who are trying to take it away from them.

That's BS. The real reason is people were effectively forced into suburban living. The auto and oil companies conspired as early as the 1930s to create suburban sprawl development so that people would be dependent on cars and gasoline. They even ripped out the trolley system in Los Angeles. That's right...they ripped it out. It's well documented.

I'm not saying people didn't like living in suburbs. They did and still do. But the downside of suburban living was not apparent at the time (and still isn't to many people). But people just keep wanting what they are used to and what they grew up with even when it's not working because they don't know any different.

I mean, how many cities in America can you live in that offer an urban lifestyle? Not many, even if you want to. And the ones that do offer the possibility of a "car-lite" or "car free" lifestyle are super expensive. And you're going to tell me that we haven't effectively had suburbia forced down our throats whether we wanted it or not? I don't think so.