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Old 06-07-2013, 10:04 AM
 
Location: Somewhere flat in Mississippi
10,060 posts, read 12,813,278 times
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The Church That Just Won't Die:

Immigration fuels growth in Toronto's Catholic Church
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Old 06-07-2013, 10:33 AM
 
291 posts, read 476,570 times
Reputation: 270
Quote:
Originally Posted by iNviNciBL3 View Post
A fetus is just one stage of human life.
Fetus
Baby
Toddler
Teenager
Adult
Elder
A fetus may just be a cell but it is a human cell.
Our brains are not fully develop until age 25 so why cant we legally kill people who are younger than 25?
No, a fetus is not just one stage of human life since it needs to reside inside another human being for its livelihood. It's like a parasitic growth inside a woman, a cancer, not a human being.
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Old 06-07-2013, 10:51 AM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
26,883 posts, read 38,040,463 times
Reputation: 11650
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paparappa View Post
No, a fetus is not just one stage of human life since it needs to reside inside another human being for its livelihood. It's like a parasitic growth inside a woman, a cancer, not a human being.
The foetus is certainly totally dependent on the host woman for survival, but I am not sure parasite or cancer are the right comparative terms since in the case of a parasite its existence is to the detriment of the host, and of cancer it basically exists to kill the host.
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Old 06-07-2013, 10:53 AM
 
Location: M I N N E S O T A
14,773 posts, read 21,504,427 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paparappa View Post
No, a fetus is not just one stage of human life since it needs to reside inside another human being for its livelihood. It's like a parasitic growth inside a woman, a cancer, not a human being.
It has it's own blood, brain and beating heart..
It's a human.
A baby and a toddler need another human for their livelihood, and they are still humans.
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Old 06-07-2013, 11:16 AM
 
291 posts, read 476,570 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
The foetus is certainly totally dependent on the host woman for survival, but I am not sure parasite or cancer are the right comparative terms since in the case of a parasite its existence is to the detriment of the host, and of cancer it basically exists to kill the host.
A fetus is practically like a parasite. Remember the woman has to eat for the fetus as well. And there's a whole bunch of side effects that aren't exactly pleasant.

Quote:
Originally Posted by iNviNciBL3 View Post
It has it's own blood, brain and beating heart..
It's a human.
No. It's an organism that has to live inside a human for survival.
Quote:
A baby and a toddler need another human for their livelihood, and they are still humans.
False equivalence. There's a difference between a literal parasite and a metaphorical parasite. A tapeworm is different than a dog.
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Old 06-07-2013, 01:04 PM
 
Location: Canada
4,865 posts, read 10,528,229 times
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A woman has to eat to make milk for her newborn baby to, that doesn't mean it's anything bad, in fact it's sacred.
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Old 06-07-2013, 01:22 PM
 
291 posts, read 476,570 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BIMBAM View Post
A woman has to eat to make milk for her newborn baby to, that doesn't mean it's anything bad, in fact it's sacred.
Semantics does not trump biology.
And nothing is "sacred."
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Old 06-07-2013, 01:27 PM
 
Location: Hougary, Texberta
9,019 posts, read 14,293,297 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mouldy Old Schmo View Post
Just like a cancer, right?
No, it's a cellular growth with the potential to eventually be a viable human being.
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Old 06-07-2013, 01:29 PM
 
Location: Hougary, Texberta
9,019 posts, read 14,293,297 times
Reputation: 11032
Quote:
Originally Posted by pdw View Post
Okay, you want to play the generalise and everything someone does who happens to be christian is because they are christian game, I'll play that game. Pol Pot and Mao Tse-tung were atheists who killed millions of people, therefore all atheists are murderers. Don't give me that "well, atheism doesn't have a book that we follow", either. Christians come in as many different shapes and sizes that atheists do.
Stalin is standing in the corner feeling left out and neglected.
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Old 06-07-2013, 01:33 PM
 
Location: Canada
7,309 posts, read 9,328,351 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NorthYorkEd View Post
Interesting article.

"By "neo-atheism", I mean a tripartite belief system founded on the conviction that science provides the only road to truth and that all religions are deluded, irrational and destructive."

I don't think science provides the ONLY path, just the best one we currently have, and one that is much better than faith.

Becoming even more confused, Dawkins exclaimed in his response: "Oh, God!"
“Immediately he was out of control, he said, 'Oh, God!'" Warsi recalls, "so even the most self-confessed secular fundamentalist at this moment of need needed to turn to the Almighty. It kind of defeats his own argument that only people who go to church have a faith."

This is just silly. Unable to separate an expression of faith from a commonly used expression of frustration (and at other times, profound sensual pleasure)? It seems this person does not have any sense of context.
I never intentionally post and run and now is a busy time for me. I had been hoping to return to this thread earlier. Yes, I agree that that the writer's interpretation of Dawkin's comment is silly, but that is entirely different from it being a silly article.

As this thread has shown, there is a militancy, a fundamentalism to some atheists that tolerates no other point of view, that is alien to my understanding of intelligence and very different from the atheists I know. It is very similar to extreme forms of Islam and Christianity and exhibits the very characteristics of evangelical fundamentalist American Christianity that I most dislike. It's a form of atheism that has been tried before - in the Soviet Union where they turned churches into granaries and punished the families of believers.

God has been repeatedly compared to Santa Claus in this thread but I have never seen an outpouring of venom directed at Santa Claus so it would appear to be a false equivalency. And the venom between what they call leftists and right-wingers in the States used religion as one of its matches. And I would think to myself, thank god(ness) we don't have that here. That extremity of views takes into account neither history, nor philosophy, nor psychology.

Somewhere (perhaps not on this exact thread), someone made the comment that religion has no place in civilisation. In fact, the most recent research suggests that religion is the reason for civilisation, rather than a side effect of it. Göbekli Tepe - Pictures, More From National Geographic Magazine

What studies have also shown is that most people have a genetic predisposition to believe in God or a higher power, whatever that may be. That could mean that most people are stupid or "not really intelligent" or it could mean that atheists are lacking something. In any event, atheists would be a minority. But since believers in some kind of religion are the majority, any civilisation that seeks to erase all traces of religion within itself is doomed to failure.

And the irony of it is that without understanding - reading- the Bible, it is not possible to understand western civilisation or the best of western literature, as Professor Northrup Frye noted in The Great Code, where he lamented the lack of Biblical literacy among the average person. The Bible has had such an influence on western thinking that no less a man than Christopher Hitchens praised the King James Version and read from the Bible at his father's funeral. That would to me be the real underlying meaning behind the "Oh God" cited in the article.

So I disagree with the idea that absolutely no religious anything should be displayed publicly. It is too Talibanish for me, to seek to destroy old remnants of our culture.

What I do not like and would not like in Canada is publicly elected figures talking about their religion. I don't care what the Prime Minister believes, nor do I care what my mechanic believes in their personal lives.

But as this thread has now degenerated to abortion, I think I am out of it for good. I have too much polar bear farming to do anyway.

ETA: This post isn't directed at you specifically, NorthYorkEd - I had to pick a starting point.
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