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Old 06-05-2016, 06:40 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
26,883 posts, read 38,040,463 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by botticelli View Post
I find JT's accent fascinating. He is supposed to be fully bilingual, but somehow he seems to have a weird accent in both languages. I am saying this as something who doesn't either English or French as the native language.


His English accent is very soft, quite different from most English speaking Canadian I know here. He also talks very slowly and really articulated, maybe due to professional needs, but it sounds as if it is not his native language, like a language teacher. The difference is very subtle to me and you don't find it in Harper or Katherine Wynn, Ontario's premier, who talk like 100% Anglophone. Did he use to teach English as a foreign language?


His French on the other hand, sounds vastly different from typical Quebecois French. In one talk show, while I struggle with what the show host says, I can almost understand JT's French perfectly. He probably has only 20% of the Quebec accent, and in particularly doesn't show a lot of heavily nasal sound Quebecois tend to do. He also doesn't do the affricated [t] and [d] as much as regular Quebecois.


Not sure if my observation is true. Do you find a subtle accent in Justin Trudeau?
He has a lot more than 20% of the Quebec accent. More like in the 80% range IMO. In France people will identify him as a French Canadian within about 10 seconds.

But yes, to Québécois ears his accent in French does sound a little bit off. There are definitely some perceptible anglo intonations in there. He kind of sounds like a Montreal anglo with really awesome French.

As a young adult I pretty much had the same accent as him in both languages. But since then my accent has drifted more towards standard Québécois in French, and I've got a bit more of a French accent in English.
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Old 06-05-2016, 06:42 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
26,883 posts, read 38,040,463 times
Reputation: 11650
Interesting anecdotes about JT and language here:

https://www.city-data.com/forum/29361511-post67.html
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Old 10-05-2016, 03:52 PM
 
97 posts, read 90,309 times
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Quebec has at least 1 dozen Canadien accents; Montreal has at least 3 Canadien ones and 5 Canadian ones.

Toronto has the most fascinating Canadien one I've come across. Having had been some years ago in the company of about 2 dozen partygoers 1 night there, how would you yourselves describe their French? Being isolated Canadiens themselves, I was left with the impression that their French they were reared in was self-taught if you will. It was pleasant to listen to and sounded like a blend of a Canadian take on international French with Cajun(?) sounds. My recollection's hazy but their accent still mystifies me.
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Old 10-06-2016, 04:26 AM
 
35,309 posts, read 52,315,210 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dollarstorrrrey View Post
Anyway, Canadians don't actually say "aboot" but there is a difference in how they say it.
What are you comparing this so called difference to?
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Old 10-07-2016, 09:02 AM
 
14,316 posts, read 11,708,830 times
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Okay, getting technical with the International Phonetic Alphabet.

The "general American" pronounciation of "ou" in a word like about or house is written /aʊ/ : /abaʊt/ /haʊs/ .
If you break those two sounds down and say them very slowly they sound much like the "a" in "cat" followed by "oo."

The Canadian pronunciation that is imperfectly spelled aboot or aboat is /ʌʊ/ : /abʌʊt/ /hʌʊs/.
These two sounds, said slowly, are similar to the "u" in "but" followed by "oo."

The difference is slight, and if your ear is not attuned to it you may not even notice, but there is definitely a difference. If you google Canadian Raising, you can read more about this phenomenon.
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Old 09-28-2017, 08:47 AM
 
14,316 posts, read 11,708,830 times
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Mod cut: quoted post deleted.

It's common for people not to be able to hear slight peculiarities of their own dialects. It all sounds totally normal to them. I'll pick on myself if it suits you better. There is a phenomenon going on in California, where I live, called the California Vowel Shift. I've read about it, I've watched videos in which people supposedly use these vowels, and while everyone in other parts of the country is agreeing that Californians do weird things to certain vowels, I can't hear it. I can't hear it at all, and I have an MA in Linguistics.

The general accent in Toronto is slightly different from the general accent in California. Did you read about Canadian Raising? That you can't hear it doesn't make you stupid, but it also doesn't mean it isn't there.

This is a bit technical, but may help:

Quote:
To American ears, the Canadian pronunciation of about often sounds like aboot, but this is only an illusion. Because the more familiar pronunciation of /aw/ is articulated with the tongue in a low position, and because it raises to a mid position in Canadian English when the vowel precedes the voiceless obstruents listed above, speakers of other varieties of English will immediately detect the vowel raising, but will sometimes think that the vowel has raised farther than it actually does, all the way to /u/, which is a high vowel--hence the mishearing (and not-quite-right imitation) of this pronunciation as aboot.

Canadian raising is used by some citizens of Toronto, who also have a unique way of pronouncing the name of their city.
http://www.yorku.ca/twainweb/troberts/raising.html

Last edited by PJSaturn; 09-28-2017 at 03:13 PM..
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Old 09-28-2017, 11:10 AM
 
14,316 posts, read 11,708,830 times
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Also, of course not all people who live in a certain geographic area will display features of that area's dialect. This applies to some who are natives, as well as many or most who immigrate from another location. But there are enough "natives" of any given place who do share common linguistic features to allow researchers to identify a local dialect.
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Old 09-28-2017, 01:27 PM
 
Location: Montreal -> CT -> MA -> Montreal -> Ottawa
17,330 posts, read 33,036,872 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saibot View Post
Okay, getting technical with the International Phonetic Alphabet.

The "general American" pronounciation of "ou" in a word like about or house is written /aʊ/ : /abaʊt/ /haʊs/ .
If you break those two sounds down and say them very slowly they sound much like the "a" in "cat" followed by "oo."

The Canadian pronunciation that is imperfectly spelled aboot or aboat is /ʌʊ/ : /abʌʊt/ /hʌʊs/.
These two sounds, said slowly, are similar to the "u" in "but" followed by "oo."

The difference is slight, and if your ear is not attuned to it you may not even notice, but there is definitely a difference. If you google Canadian Raising, you can read more about this phenomenon.
This is true.

I lived in the States for a long time, but have been back in Canada since 2013. A month ago, when I had someone in my house to discuss new kitchen flooring that I wanted to install, we weren't 10 minutes into the conversation when he asked me what part of the States I'm from. I told him that I'm Canadian. "No you're not," he said. "You talk American." I told him that I lived in CT and MA for a while, but I'm a born-and-bred Canadian.

However, "route" is now "rowte" instead of "root" and things like that. I never ended a sentence with "eh," even before I moved to the States but, apparently, my "American talk" is obvious.

Before I moved to the States, I worked for an American company, talked to Americans all day long, and my friends in Montreal (and keep in mind that I speak NO French, so don't guess that I sound French!) all said that I sounded American. But when I moved to the States, for the first year there, people asked where in Canada I'm from... they heard a "Canadian accent." (So, to a Canadian, I sounded American because I got used to hearing my customers talk. But to an American, I still sounded Canadian.) That Canadian accent was gone by the end of the first year in the States. I said "rowte" like the best American. However, I've been back in Canada for 4 years now and new people who I meet still say that I sound American... even without saying the word "rowte."

Also, when I moved back from the States, EVERYONE here -- in Montreal, Ottawa, on Canadian TV shows -- sounded TOTALLY Canadian. I can VERY easily tell a Canadian person from an American one. Remember that old show "Name That Tune"? Speak one sentence and I'll know if you're Canadian or American.
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Old 09-29-2017, 05:29 PM
 
Location: Manhattan Beach
108 posts, read 130,448 times
Reputation: 187
Quote:
Originally Posted by DawnMTL View Post
This is true.

I lived in the States for a long time, but have been back in Canada since 2013. A month ago, when I had someone in my house to discuss new kitchen flooring that I wanted to install, we weren't 10 minutes into the conversation when he asked me what part of the States I'm from. I told him that I'm Canadian. "No you're not," he said. "You talk American." I told him that I lived in CT and MA for a while, but I'm a born-and-bred Canadian.

However, "route" is now "rowte" instead of "root" and things like that. I never ended a sentence with "eh," even before I moved to the States but, apparently, my "American talk" is obvious.

Before I moved to the States, I worked for an American company, talked to Americans all day long, and my friends in Montreal (and keep in mind that I speak NO French, so don't guess that I sound French!) all said that I sounded American. But when I moved to the States, for the first year there, people asked where in Canada I'm from... they heard a "Canadian accent." (So, to a Canadian, I sounded American because I got used to hearing my customers talk. But to an American, I still sounded Canadian.) That Canadian accent was gone by the end of the first year in the States. I said "rowte" like the best American. However, I've been back in Canada for 4 years now and new people who I meet still say that I sound American... even without saying the word "rowte."

Also, when I moved back from the States, EVERYONE here -- in Montreal, Ottawa, on Canadian TV shows -- sounded TOTALLY Canadian. I can VERY easily tell a Canadian person from an American one. Remember that old show "Name That Tune"? Speak one sentence and I'll know if you're Canadian or American.
Wonderful post.

I'm 33, and born and raised in Toronto (with a few years living in Aussie). I now live in Los Angeles and to Canadians I sound more American now, and to Americans they say I sound Canadian. I was up in Toronto recently and someone actually pinpointed that I live in California. I guess I've adapted that accent much more than I had thought.
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Old 09-29-2017, 06:08 PM
 
Location: Montreal -> CT -> MA -> Montreal -> Ottawa
17,330 posts, read 33,036,872 times
Reputation: 28903
Quote:
Originally Posted by CalEhBrent View Post
Wonderful post.

I'm 33, and born and raised in Toronto (with a few years living in Aussie). I now live in Los Angeles and to Canadians I sound more American now, and to Americans they say I sound Canadian. I was up in Toronto recently and someone actually pinpointed that I live in California. I guess I've adapted that accent much more than I had thought.
That's amazing! I work with a lot of Californians and, yes, they/you have a certain way of speaking.

I don't pick up languages well -- I was born and raised in Montreal, but don't speak French. When I do, my accent is very poor. But I think that I'm prone to picking up inflections, tones, pronunciations in English. From working and living with Americans, yes, but also when I was in London when I was 21, on my second day there, I called my Dad to check in. A few minutes into the conversation, he said to me "Stop talking like that! They're going to think that you're making fun of them!" I had no idea -- I was talking with a British accent. It happened without noticing, same as from working and living with Americans.
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