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This post does bring to surface the legal basis of a vote for Quebec Separation by the people of Quebec. Is that enough? Is it a vote that all Canadians can partake in or is just the people of Quebec. If they (The people of Quebec) do vote for independence, I think that it would only be the beginning of a huge legal battle back and forth. Does this mean other Provinces can also hold their own votes for secession based on Provincial laws giving them the legal right as well. At what point is Canada a part of this whole thing.. last I looked it involves us too.
It's complicated and I don't know the ins and outs of legal separation. This was brought to the supreme court in the past but I'm not sure it's still totally clear. Maybe some other posters know. I would think if Quebec voted to separate in a referendum, I can't imagine it would be legal unless the federal government approves it somehow with the province. Even practically, Quebec can't separate without Canada agreeing, they share our border, use our currency, and are highly intertwined economically. It's needs to be agreed by both parties both legally and practically.
Regardless of the legal aspect, if Quebec decides to separate, then I think the Canadian federal government will have no choice but to negotiate a separation. Imagine having a hockey player who doesn't want to play for your team. He doesn't get along with the other team mates and is not playing up to his potential, sure you can keep him on the team, but it makes better sense to trade him.
I also don't think other provinces will want to leave Canada if Quebec left. There's no reason for them to. They may posture for more federal funding and provincial rights but there's no reason to leave the country. They would be too small as independent nations and would not be a good fit for the US. I think the best scenario is that Quebec wants to happily be a part of Canada and we move forward as one nation. But if Quebec ever wanted to separate (and last time I checked, the separatists are still not the majority), the ROC will survive just fine.
It's complicated and I don't know the ins and outs of legal separation. This was brought to the supreme court in the past but I'm not sure it's still totally clear. Maybe some other posters know
It did go to the Supreme Court of Canada (SCC). It's been some years since I read the SCC's decision (Reference Re Quebec Secession, if memory serves), but if I recall correctly, it boiled down to this:
Q: Can Quebec secede from Canada under the Canadian constitution?
A: No.
Q: Can Quebec secede from Canada under international law?
A: No.
Q: Can Quebec make a unilateral decision to secede in any event? (That is, regardless of what Canada, the provinces, or Canadian voters as a whole think?)
A: No.
On the last of the above questions, though, the SCC allowed a little common sense: if Quebecers really wanted to secede, and a "clear majority" indicated such, then Canada would have little choice but to enter into negotiations with Quebec that would eventually lead to Quebec's secession. The SCC was intentionally vague in spots; it did not define what a "clear majority" was, nor did it touch on the question to be put to the electorate. Parliament took care of the latter with the Clarity Act.
In any event, the secession of any province would require a constitutional amendment. As it stands, the constitution does not allow for the secession of any province, so an amendment would be required; and I believe that it would likely be one of those that require the consent of Canada and all ten provinces (i.e. not the 7/50 formula).
What all this means is that Quebecers would not wake up to a newly-independent Quebec the day after a successful Yes vote. They would wake up to business as usual. All that would happen is that the two sides would enter into negotiations (undoubtedly, what would happen to federal infrastructure in the province, debt negotiations, etc.), which would someday culminate in Quebec being independent.
How long would this process take? Who knows? I think it would take years, as both sides will be treading on constitutional ground not yet broken, so both sides would be proceeding carefully. Plus, there is the challenge of getting all provinces on board with whatever is negotiated.
You are quite correct, Johnathan, when you say, "it's complicated."
I think the best scenario is that Quebec wants to happily be a part of Canada and we move forward as one nation. .
I agree that would be great alas thats not the way its heading as after 50+ years of the separatists the prevaing PQ government still aspires to its dream of separation Canada be damned , as a consequence we are are about to have a provincial election that will probably install the separatists as the majority government in Quebec and i presume another referendum on separation will be forthcoming,we hear the never ending call for more and more language rules and regulations and now the prospect of legislated intolerance toward the religious communities,.
The supporters of the separatist govrnment dont identify themselves as Canadians and view themselves as an oppressed minority by the evil Anglo dominators, Separatists bring nothing to the enhancement of the Canadian mosaic and continually express their dislike of Canada and Canadians..
I keep asking myself what is the point of Quebec remaining in Canada? todate i have no answer to that question..
I agree that would be great alas thats not the way its heading as after 50+ years of the separatists the prevaing PQ government still aspires to its dream of separation Canada be damned , as a consequence we are are about to have a provincial election that will probably install the separatists as the majority government in Quebec and i presume another referendum on separation will be forthcoming,we hear the never ending call for more and more language rules and regulations and now the prospect of legislated intolerance toward the religious communities,.
The supporters of the separatist govrnment dont identify themselves as Canadians and view themselves as an oppressed minority by the evil Anglo dominators, Separatists bring nothing to the enhancement of the Canadian mosaic and continually express their dislike of Canada and Canadians..
I keep asking myself what is the point of Quebec remaining in Canada? todate i have no answer to that question..
You know, you keep saying that "probably install the separatists as the majority government in Quebec"
but the polls indicate anything but that and are leaning more towards the liberalists.
Regardless of the legal aspect, if Quebec decides to separate, then I think the Canadian federal government will have no choice but to negotiate a separation. Imagine having a hockey player who doesn't want to play for your team. He doesn't get along with the other team mates and is not playing up to his potential, sure you can keep him on the team, but it makes better sense to trade him.
.
Well I also doubt other Canadian Provinces would opt for separation but it does create a precedent that they could. Where will it end?
As for the paragraph above... As much as I respect the fact that the people of Quebec have a different language and culture, there are also many shared cultural values and history with the rest of Canada.. I don't think Canada is Canada without Quebec. We are so intertwined that it is almost unthinkable to me that this would actually happen. I think people are underestimating how important unification is to our country and to the national psyche.
As for your hockey analogy - imagine if Abraham Lincoln felt the same way about the U.S south back in 1860? He was considered the greatest President in U.S history because he called for unification and not dissolution - in essence he said no to the trade. Call me a nationalist, but I do think that a country is more than a Province. I'm not advocating for a Civil War, but I do think that the Quebec situation is far more complicated than trading a hockey player who doesn't want to be on the team.
Libs need to do better than neck and neck to win, but the good news is the polls (and that site's model) underestimated them by a lot in 2012.
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