Is Quebec Independence a Legitimate Movement? (firm, timetable, lobster)

[bigbubbles81]

Originally Posted by fusion2

Internationally speaking - you might want to be careful about that.. There isn't a lot of International support for the Catalonian situation in Spain.. They want to separate and Spain is basically giving them the big not happening and I don't see the 'International community' doing much to help their plight so the Clarity act - I think has more teeth than what you contend since the Clarity act part of the law of the land that will govern any matter of separation within Canada..

Catalonia also doesn't border America. America would look very, very, poorly on a Canada that ignores a popular vote for independence in Quebec.

Originally Posted by fusion2

As for the last part - I agree its a rather ugly situation but it really is a matter that is kind of forced on the R.O.C really having to put up with this situation if you think about it so I don't see it being anything but a back and forth sort of thing. In truth it won't be a nice and happy split. Most breakups are not exactly happy affairs if you think about it. Lets keep it real..

I agree, let's keep it real!

There are numerous splits that were engineered democratically and they have worked out well. Iceland peacefully split from us, and we are quite cordial. Norway and Sweden is another one. They are good friends. Not to mention the obvious one, your own country Canada and Great Britain. Is it an ugly situation between you two? Nope. Czechoslovakia as well, they have offered another model for how a peaceful diplomatic split can lead to more prosperity and better relations between two groups of people.

Since we are keeping it real, I can't think of many countries that split peacefully under a democratic vote and then became enemies - can you?

[Guytar1220]

Originally Posted by fusion2

Internationally speaking - you might want to be careful about that.. There isn't a lot of International support for the Catalonian situation in Spain.. They want to separate and Spain is basically giving them the big not happening and I don't see the ''International community doing much to help their plight so the Clarity act - I think has more teeth than what you contend since the Clarity act part of the law of the land that will govern any matter of separation within Canada..

As for the last part - I agree its a rather ugly situation but it really is a matter that is kind of forced on the R.O.C really having to put up with this situation if you think about it so I don't see it being anything but a back and forth sort of thing. In truth it won't be a nice and happy split. Most breakups are not exactly happy affairs if you think about it. Lets keep it real..

International community may have no weight probably, but some countries may support Quebec although there is no garanty. I wonder if Clarity act would pass the supreme court test

[ViveLeQuebecLibre]

Originally Posted by bigbubbles81

There are numerous splits that were engineered democratically and they have worked out well. Iceland peacefully split from us, and we are quite cordial. Norway and Sweden is another one. They are good friends. Not to mention the obvious one, your own country Canada and Great Britain. Is it an ugly situation between you two? Nope. Czechoslovakia as well, they have offered another model for how a peaceful diplomatic split can lead to more prosperity and better relations between two groups of people.

Since we are keeping it real, I can't think of many countries that split peacefully under a democratic vote and then became enemies - can you?

Especially when we look at countries similar to Canada, western democracies. I don't see any western democracries that split democratically under peaceful means and ended to become opponents.

[Guytar1220]

Originally Posted by bigbubbles81

Catalonia also doesn't border America. America would look very, very, poorly on a Canada that ignores a popular vote for independence in Quebec.



I agree, let's keep it real!

There are numerous splits that were engineered democratically and they have worked out well. Iceland peacefully split from us, and we are quite cordial. Norway and Sweden is another one. They are good friends. Not to mention the obvious one, your own country Canada and Great Britain. Is it an ugly situation between you two? Nope. Czechoslovakia as well, they have offered another model for how a peaceful diplomatic split can lead to more prosperity and better relations between two groups of people.

Since we are keeping it real, I can't think of many countries that split peacefully under a democratic vote and then became enemies - can you?

Thanks for saying it, Quebec would definately want a peaceful separation, considering its vulnerable position in this context, so the ball is in Canada's court afterall.

[ViveLeQuebecLibre]

Originally Posted by fusion2

You demand your own country.

No I'm sorry but I haven't demanded anything. I think a separate Québec is the only option because I don't believe in "demanding" anything. It is up to the people of Québec to agree with this, not for Canada to give.

I get a feeling that you are saying French Quebecer=making demands. I can see why some other posters can be called making demands, but I have no demands to ask for, my only demand is that Canada gives us the right to vote on the issue, so my only possible demand is already a fulfillment. I'm sorry if there has been any confusion!

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by barneyg

That hypothetical applies to me so I feel qualified to reply.

There is absolutely no doubt in my mind what I will do, and what the overwhelming majority of "Quebec francophone federalists" will do, in case of a YES vote. I will stay in Quebec.

I totally agree. There won't be any exodus of francophones of any significance from Quebec if ever independence happens. Home is home after all. And life in the rest of Canada after Quebec independence is full of uncertainties for francophones with a possible huge backlash and other nasty stuff.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by bigbubbles81

Catalonia also doesn't border America. America would look very, very, poorly on a Canada that ignores a popular vote for independence in Quebec.



I agree, let's keep it real!

There are numerous splits that were engineered democratically and they have worked out well. Iceland peacefully split from us, and we are quite cordial. Norway and Sweden is another one. They are good friends. Not to mention the obvious one, your own country Canada and Great Britain. Is it an ugly situation between you two? Nope. Czechoslovakia as well, they have offered another model for how a peaceful diplomatic split can lead to more prosperity and better relations between two groups of people.

Since we are keeping it real, I can't think of many countries that split peacefully under a democratic vote and then became enemies - can you?

Your examples are all good except for Canada from Great Britain. That wasn't really a ''separation". Canada was never part of the UK. It was part of the British Empire and it was more the British who ''pushed off'' Canada, Australia, etc. and gave them independence.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by ViveLeQuebecLibre

Especially when we look at countries similar to Canada, western democracies. I don't see any western democracries that split democratically under peaceful means and ended to become opponents.

There aren't many examples of separations involving western democraties in the last 50 or 100 years... I can't think of any. The Scandinavian countries were long ago and Czechoslovakia was not a western democracy. Neither was Kosovo, Croatia, Montenegro, East Timor, Slovenia, etc.

[bigbubbles81]

Originally Posted by Acajack

There aren't many examples of separations involving western democraties in the last 50 or 100 years... I can't think of any. The Scandinavian countries were long ago and Czechoslovakia was not a western democracy. Neither was Kosovo, Croatia, Montenegro, East Timor, Slovenia, etc.

Hey! Don't forget about Iceland and Denmark!

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by bigbubbles81

Hey! Don't forget about Iceland and Denmark!

Sure but it was still almost 100 years ago!