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Well ya it has to do with preventing legal confusion considering other parts of the world also claim the word American. Do you know how much confusion can cost in when it comes courts? Plus there is no citation in the wikipedia link so its hard to prove that 1999 and 2004 editions have no such entry. And so what if there is no such entry?
That is not a surprise it is all about preventing legal confusion of the word american. It doesn't say that the US government considers the word American to refer to both North and South america.Plus its easier to spell out USA versus American.
That does not answer my question. Is japan wrong in saying europe and asia are one continent? Since you are so confident that US citizens are factually wrong in claiming north and south america as two seperate continents, are the japanese factually wrong in claiming europe and asia are one continents since latin america does not teach that they are one continent. The issue here is that people from the US and Canada consider the americas to be sperated into two continents, North and South America. People from latin america consider the Americas to be one continent called America as a result they take the term American to refer to everyone that lives in the Americas.
Ah yes but depending upon where you are from North and South America are two seperate continents and so the Demonym if you follow the 7 continent model would be North American and South American not American. If you follow the 6 continent model that has the Americas as one continent then you would refer to the people that live there as Americans.
So what is the problem with your european example. No one around the world considers eastern, western, south or north europe to be seperate continents. People around the world either consider it to be one continent called europe or to be gigantic continent with asia called eurasia. There are people around the world that consider North and South America to be seperate continents that right there is the key difference.
Again you have to remember there is no international standard for how many continents there is in the world, as a result a person from latin america can't say that a citizen of the US is wrong for calling themselves American and that no one else is american. A US citizen also can't say that american can only refer to US citizens. So when people say the americas are two seperate continents they are correct. When people say the americas are one continent they are correct.
Incorrect. you need to reread your source again particularily the part in blue.
It clearly states French, German, Italian, Japanese, Chinese, Hebrew, Arabic, and russian speakers all use the term American to refer to US citizens only. Not people from canada or latin america. However though French, Germans, and Italians will sometimes put US americans to prevent confusion with people who consider the americas to be one continent.
Interesting, the source for that quote that wikipedia has listed, it doesn't say it is commonly used it just says it is the only official alternative to refering to the people of the US.
International law uses "U.S. citizen" in defining a citizen of the United States, not American citizen, which is an informal, non-legal usage.
One more time...
A national of USA = U.S. Citizen or U.S. American
American = non-legal usage in defining a citizen of the United States.
Why is it non-legal?
Because an "American" is a citizen of one of the nations of the Americas.
Of course a U.S. Citizen or U.S. American is an "American" as well, and Canadians or Argentines are "Americans" as well.
Why the U.S. Passports do not use the word "American" under nationality?
Because it would be non-legal.
Does it say "American" under nationality????
NO
Why?
One more time...
Because it would be NON-legal.
Ohh my god I hope you understand ... My comments are supported by the international law and reliable sources and the U.S. Passport which is a document, issued by a national government (USA in this case), which certifies, for the purpose of international travel, the identity and nationality of its holder.
Now, that you finally understand that the world considers an "American" to be a person that is a citizen of one of the nations of the Americas (that could be a person born in USA or Canada or Argentina) and the world considers a "U.S. American" a person born in United States of America, (according to the international law and the U.S. Passport), I am going to explain you how the rest of the world labels a U.S. Citizen.....
The Spanish, French, Portuguese, German, and Italian languages use cognates of the word "American", in denoting "U.S. citizen".
In Spanish: Estadounidense
In Spanish, americano denotes geographic and cultural origin in the New World; the adjective and noun, denoting a U.S. national, estadounidense (United Statesman), derives from Estados Unidos de América (United States of America).
In Portuguese: Estadunidense
Portuguese, has americano, denoting a person or thing from the Americas, and for a U.S. national and things estadunidense (United Statesman), from Estados Unidos da América, norteamericano (North American), and ianque (Yankee).
In French: Etasunien (not the same as American)
In French, étasunien, from États-Unis d'Amérique, distinguishes U.S. things and persons from the adjective américain, which chiefly denotes persons and things from the United States but may also refer to the Americas;
In German: U.S. Amerikanisch and U.S. Amerikaner (U.S. American)
likewise, the German usages U.S.-amerikanisch and U.S.-Amerikaner observe said cultural distinction, solely denoting U.S. things and people.
In Italian: Statunitense (not American)
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Now, if for some reason you still do not understand...
Just take a world map and locate Canada and I promise you that the country is located in America!
In case, you do not consider America as one continent.... Canada would be located in North America
So... a Canadian can be labeled...
1) Canadian
2) North American (A citizen of one of the nations of North America)
3) American (A citizen of one of the nations of the Americas)
an Argentine can be labeled ...
1) Argentine
2) South American (A citizen of one of the nations of South America)
3) American (A citizen of one of the nations of the Americas)
a citizen of USA can be labeled
1) U.S. American or U.S. National
2) North American (A citizen of one of the nations of North America)
3) American (A citizen of one of the nations of the Americas)
a citizen of Mexico
1) Mexican
2) North American (A citizen of one of the nations of North America)
3) American (A citizen of one of the nations of the Americas)
Last edited by Cornerguy1; 04-30-2009 at 03:14 PM..
Reason: do not post copyrighted images
"The issue here is that people from the US and Canada consider the Americas to be seperated into two continents, North and South America. People from latin america consider the Americas to be one continent called America as a result they take the term American to refer to everyone that lives in the Americas."
In this case, if America is separated into two continents...
"North America" and "South America"
"American" would be an incomplete/incorrect term to refer to everyone that lives in North America and also an incomplete term to refer to everyone that lives in South America.
Citizens of any nation of NORTH AMERICA would be called "North Americans" and the citizens of any nation of SOUTH AMERICA would be called "South Americans".
Therefore, you can`t say that
U.S. Americans are "Americans" and Argentines are "South Americans" (That would be incorrect, and that is why the U.S. passport does not label U.S. nationals as "Americans" because it is considered non-legal). There is not a continent labeled solely "America" according to the seven-continent model taught in Canada and USA (the continent-model that separates North and South America).
You would be contradicting your statements Noliving, because if there is no such continent called "America" people is either "North American" or "South American" and none of them can claim to be solely "American".
Well, according to Wikipedia an "American" is a citizen of any country of the Americas (North and South).
So.... no matter what continent-model you were taught in your school Continent - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
an "American" is citizen of any country of the Americas.
In case you were taught the seven-continent model that separates North and South America, and "American" would still be a citizen of any country of South or North America.
Last edited by Eduardo983; 04-30-2009 at 04:56 AM..
From Canada, people from the U.S.A. are referred to as being from "the states", not from "america". Yes, located in north america. Overseas they are known as being from "america" and called "americans" because there is no other name to call them from "the states" or "united states", so they have to be called americans. Even in canada if you're speaking of a person, when we refer to people from the states, they are known as American(s).
This is the most common usage I hear in the Northern part of the North American continent - "from the states".
I have also heard unconfirmed rumours that 'Muriekan' has replaced 'American' in the southern parts of the middle part of the North American continent.
International law uses "U.S. citizen" in defining a citizen of the United States, not American citizen, which is an informal, non-legal usage.
One more time...
A national of USA = U.S. Citizen or U.S. American
American = non-legal usage in defining a citizen of the United States.
Ok show me the source for the bolded part that it is non legal. Don't give me the wikipedia source, actually show me in the north american free trade agreement that it is non legal to use american to refer to US citizen.
Even the quote that wikipedia uses does not say it is non legal to use American to refer to US citizen "Only air carriers that are U.S. citizens are permitted to operate domestic air services or operate international air services as a "U.S." carrier; non-U.S. citizens may own and control foreign air carriers that operate between the U.S. and foreign points." No where does it say it is illegal to use American to refer to US citizen only, at most it would be just informal.
That is why every single US embassy on their websites use both terms US citizen or American citizen(US not canada, mexican or someone from brazil etc). You know why? Because it isn't illegal if it was the American embassy wouldn't use the term on their websites. Just because somone on wikipedia edits it and says its illegal with no link saying its illegal doesn't make it illegal.
Because an "American" is a citizen of one of the nations of the Americas.
Of course a U.S. Citizen or U.S. American is an "American" as well, and Canadians or Argentines are "Americans" as well.
Why the U.S. Passports do not use the word "American" under nationality?
Because it would be non-legal.
My best bet is because its cheaper considering its not illegal and they don't use United States of America under nationality, it would also be non legal/formal then to say canadians, mexicans, and the rest of latin america are americans then too. To you canadians or argentines are "americans", but to US citizens only US citizens are americans. There is no right or wrong answer here. That is the point I'm trying to make here, it isn't considered by the world legally that the word american refers to everyone that lives in the americas or just people that live in the US because the word is in dispute primarily between US and latin america.
It isn't illegal.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eduardo983
Does it say "American" under nationality????
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eduardo983
NO
Why?
One more time...
Because it would be NON-legal.
To prevent legal confusion because there is a dispute over what the word means. It wouldn't be illegal for any nation for them to use the word America to only refer to the USA on any legal document.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eduardo983
Ohh my god I hope you understand ... My comments are supported by the international law and reliable sources and the U.S. Passport which is a document, issued by a national government (USA in this case), which certifies, for the purpose of international travel, the identity and nationality of its holder.
Now, that you finally understand that the world considers an "American" to be a person that is a citizen of one of the nations of the Americas (that could be a person born in USA or Canada or Argentina) and the world considers a "U.S. American" a person born in United States of America, (according to the international law and the U.S. Passport), I am going to explain you how the rest of the world labels a U.S. Citizen.....
Yes to prevent legal confusion because the word is in dispute. The whole world doesn't consider the term "American to be a citizen of one of the nations of the Americas. Your own wikipedia showed that English, French, German, Italian, Japanese, Chinese, Hebrew, Arabic, popular Portuguese and Russian speakers may use American to refer to US citizen not Canada, or latin america.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eduardo983
The Spanish, French, Portuguese, German, and Italian languages use cognates of the word "American", in denoting "U.S. citizen".
But they also use the term american to refer to US citizen only. Your missing that part.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eduardo983
In Spanish: Estadounidense
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eduardo983
In Spanish, americano denotes geographic and cultural origin in the New World; the adjective and noun, denoting a U.S. national, estadounidense (United Statesman), derives from Estados Unidos de América (United States of America).
In Portuguese: Estadunidense
Portuguese, has americano, denoting a person or thing from the Americas, and for a U.S. national and things estadunidense (United Statesman), from Estados Unidos da América, norteamericano (North American), and ianque (Yankee).
You've edited your own wikpedia source for example portuguese:
Portuguese, estado-unidense(or estadunidense) is the recommended form by language regulators but today it is less frequently used than americano and norte-americano.
You neglected to mention the most commonly used word is americano and that it is used for US citizens only, it doesn't say a person or thing from the americas.
Why are you editing your own sources? Is it because its wikipedia?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eduardo983
In French: Etasunien (not the same as American)
In French, étasunien, from États-Unis d'Amérique, distinguishes U.S. things and persons from the adjective américain, which chiefly denotes persons and things from the United States but may also refer tothe Americas;
Says you in the bolded, that doesn't exist in your source, you added that. Again you and editing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eduardo983
In German: U.S. Amerikanisch and U.S. Amerikaner (U.S. American)
likewise, the German usages U.S.-amerikanisch and U.S.-Amerikaner observe said cultural distinction, solely denoting U.S. things and people
In Italian: Statunitense (not American)
.
Very good but your own source also shows that the germans and italians also used the word American to only refer to US citizens and that those words you listed are just other forms, not primarily used, to denote the US. Just like how english speaking americans(US) use other forms to denote the United States of America.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eduardo983
Now, if for some reason you still do not understand...
Just take a world map and locate Canada and I promise you that the country is located in America!
In case, you do not consider America as one continent.... Canada would be located in North America
Depends upon your education.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eduardo983
So... a Canadian can be labeled...
1) Canadian
2) North American (A citizen of one of the nations of North America)
3) American (A citizen of one of the nations of the Americas)
an Argentine can be labeled ...
1) Argentine
2) South American (A citizen of one of the nations of South America)
3) American (A citizen of one of the nations of the Americas)
a citizen of USA can be labeled
1) U.S. American or U.S. National
2) North American (A citizen of one of the nations of North America)
3) American (A citizen of one of the nations of the Americas)
a citizen of Mexico
1) Mexican
2) North American (A citizen of one of the nations of North America)
3) American (A citizen of one of the nations of the Americas)
Yes it can mean all of those. Again it can also mean that it only refers to US citizens. A US citizen isn't wrong to claim that American can only refer to a US citizen. Again there is no world wide standard for how many continents there are and there is no world wide standard for what or who the word American means. Again in North America(exlcuding mexico) almost all of europe and asia along with the arabic speaking world the word American means someone from the US and only the US, the US wants them to use US on legal documents to prevent legal confusion. A canadians or a mexican would not be considered an american.
Again if you were to fill out a legal document you would have to use US to prevent legal confusion because latin america would throw a fit.
Do you get it now that both sides views are correct. American can only mean someone from the US and no other country that resides in the Americas, American can mean anyone from the Americas, both are correct. There is no one side that is correct.
In this case, if America is separated into two continents...
"North America" and "South America"
"American" would be an incomplete/incorrect term to refer to everyone that lives in North America and also an incomplete term to refer to everyone that lives in South America.
Citizens of any nation of NORTH AMERICA would be called "North Americans" and the citizens of any nation of SOUTH AMERICA would be called "South Americans".
Therefore, you can`t say that
U.S. Americans are "Americans" and Argentines are "South Americans" (That would be incorrect, and that is why the U.S. passport does not label U.S. nationals as "Americans" because it is considered non-legal). There is not a continent labeled solely "America" according to the seven-continent model taught in Canada and USA (the continent-model that separates North and South America).
But they do say that and you can say that. American is used by the US as their Demonym for their nationality, they also use US, USA, United States, United States of America. The US passport says USA or United States of America under nationality, you could put mexico instead of mexican for nationality, you could put canada instead of canadian for nationality, they don't but you can. It's all to prevent legal confusion with latin america because they also claim the word.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eduardo983
You would be contradicting your statements Noliving, because if there is no such continent called "America" people is either "North American" or "South American" and none of them can claim to be solely "American".
People that live in the US do.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eduardo983
Well, according to Wikipedia an "American" is a citizen of any country of the Americas (North and South).
So.... no matter what continent-model you were taught in your school Continent - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
an "American" is citizen of any country of the Americas.
In case you were taught the seven-continent model that separates North and South America, and "American" would still be a citizen of any country of South or North America.
Lol, so Wikipedia is the final say? Ya ok. Your own wikipedia source also shows that the word American is also used extensively in europe, and asia to refer to the US only. Your wikipedia source is being non biased by presenting both sides of the argument. If your taught the seven continent model or six contitnent model that has americas as two continents then american does not refer to people that reside in both north and south.
In my experience, almost exclusively when talking to Canadians we are afraid to offend.
We each have our individual experience, but yours is not mine. When talking to Canadians such as: my mother, aunts, uncles, cousins, their neighbors, friends and business acquantainces I have never felt more aware of offending them than anyone else. Frankly, I don't find Canadians to be different than US tacians from sensitive to hardened and everything in between.
Having played several hockey tournaments with Canadian teams included I would throw an elbow at a Canadian (and not care if he's offended) as quick as I would to anyone else!
We each have our individual experience, but yours is not mine. When talking to Canadians such as: my mother, aunts, uncles, cousins, their neighbors, friends and business acquantainces I have never felt more aware of offending them than anyone else. Frankly, I don't find Canadians to be different than US tacians from sensitive to hardened and everything in between.
Having played several hockey tournaments with Canadian teams included I would throw an elbow at a Canadian (and not care if he's offended) as quick as I would to anyone else!
I think you missed the thrust of what I was saying. I wasn't suggesting that Canadians are easily offended in general. I was saying that most US nationals who refrain from calling themselves 'Americans' to Canadians are generally doing so because they're among the small minority that even realize that some Canadians have a problem with that, and that care enough to modify their reference.
You were better off to have left it alone. You said 'it was your experience', but now your speaking for 'most US national who refrain from calling themselves Americans to Canadians'.
Can you really be a spokesperson for that group?
You were better off to have left it alone. You said 'it was your experience', but now your speaking for 'most US national who refrain from calling themselves Americans to Canadians'.
Can you really be a spokesperson for that group?
I can offer my opinion as to their likely motivations, and have done so. If you're going to try and twist what I say, I won't engage you.
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