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Old 06-08-2016, 04:58 PM
 
8,130 posts, read 4,482,884 times
Reputation: 9188

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Quote:
Originally Posted by suzy_q2010 View Post
"Live" like what?

People who have pre-cancerous polyps removed never get the cancer. They just live normal lives. Those with cancers caught early enough get treated and go on to live normal lives.

Go back and read photobuff's post again. It is about dying from cancer - what you say you would want to do.
Those of us who know you as a "medical professional" are well aware of your views. The bottom line is that for an ADULT individual it is THEIR choice, for whatever reasons they choice. NOTHING you can do about that. Keep preaching. Maybe you can pass laws taking away Adult choices also?

According you YOU, I should have been dead from Tetanus a month ago, if not YEARS ago.

Read others posts on this thread. I am not alone in this. It should be MOM'S choice and her's alone.
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Old 06-08-2016, 05:35 PM
 
8,130 posts, read 4,482,884 times
Reputation: 9188
Not to get OT with this, PLEASE those of us who are elderly seek an Attorney, make out your Living Will and make your wishes known before you reach the point where your children and medical professionals will make those decisions for you.
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Old 06-08-2016, 07:22 PM
 
Location: Georgia, USA
30,679 posts, read 33,019,682 times
Reputation: 37915
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jo48 View Post
Those of us who know you as a "medical professional" are well aware of your views. The bottom line is that for an ADULT individual it is THEIR choice, for whatever reasons they choice. NOTHING you can do about that. Keep preaching. Maybe you can pass laws taking away Adult choices also?

According you YOU, I should have been dead from Tetanus a month ago, if not YEARS ago.

Read others posts on this thread. I am not alone in this. It should be MOM'S choice and her's alone.
I never said you should be dead from tetanus.

I also never said it should not be mom's choice, only that her choice should be based on knowing what could happen if she has a pre-cancerous polyp or an early cancer now which could progress if not treated and cause her to die a very bad death.

It appears that some people here have never watched someone die from cancer. I have. My father in law, who died from renal cancer, summed it up nicely in three words: dying is hard. Dying from colon cancer is not easier than having a colonoscopy - at any age.
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Old 06-08-2016, 09:11 PM
 
4,948 posts, read 17,343,858 times
Reputation: 2886
Quote:
Originally Posted by suzy_q2010 View Post
I never said you should be dead from tetanus.

I also never said it should not be mom's choice, only that her choice should be based on knowing what could happen if she has a pre-cancerous polyp or an early cancer now which could progress if not treated and cause her to die a very bad death.

It appears that some people here have never watched someone die from cancer. I have. My father in law, who died from renal cancer, summed it up nicely in three words: dying is hard. Dying from colon cancer is not easier than having a colonoscopy - at any age.
Thus check it out and suffer one day with the prep and peace of mind. Choice 2 say not me and hope for the best.
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Old 06-08-2016, 09:17 PM
 
1,648 posts, read 959,901 times
Reputation: 5992
Quote:
Originally Posted by photobuff42 View Post
I would love to have some of those, "No test for me" posters come on down and help me take care of my mom for a day, just to see if they would rather die of cancer than be subjected to a medical test. Let's pick a day that the Hospice staff doesn't come out, just to get a good glimpse of what their kids might have to deal with someday.

They can comb through the pantry and refrigerator to find something to tempt her to eat. Hopefully they come after someone has been to the store, because it's really hard to leave the house for very long.

Then they can wake her up just so they can coax her to eat just enough to take her medicine. It's hard to wake her because she's just really tired these days.

They can count out those endless pills and go back to the bedroom to get her to take the bowl of pills that she needs to survive in our tenth year of cancer.

So many pills! She was taking 22 pills a day. Pills for inflammation, pills for nutritional deficiencies, pills to ward off seizures, pills for seizures, all taken to try to stave off the advancing march of the cancer. Pills for pain; long acting pills to keep it at bay, and short acting ones for when the pain attacks her knees or ribs or back or head because the cancer settled in her bones and brain through the magic of metastases. All this is so depressing that she gets medicine for that, too. Plus those for the anxiety that comes with thinking about it.

But since she takes all those pills, she's plagued with what one commercial calls, "constipation baggage." She needs pills for that, too. Pills and powders that either don't work very well, or work really well--so well that we get extra laundry to do.

But it would be unfair to let anyone think she's still taking 22 pills every day. Now she takes 10 because the other 12 don't work any more and the cancer is marching relentlessly through her body. You can really tell now, you can see her bones, and her skin sags everywhere. And her hair never really came back after all that chemo and radiation. She barely resembles the beautiful mom who sewed my wedding dress. I'll have to show them a picture so they can see how lovely she was.

If she's having a good day, they can follow her into the bathroom to make sure she doesn't fall. If it's a bad day they can help do the laundry we already mentioned.

Then they can help her bathe. Bed bath if she's really tired; shower if she feels up to it. You would think this would be easy since she's lost about 60 pounds, just down to skin and bones. But they will be exhausted because she's dead weight due to muscle atrophy. The anxiety will cause their muscles to tense up in fear of dropping her. As I mentioned, there's a pill for that, but it's for mom, not for us.

Then she will nap and they can help me finish the laundry. Which will be great for me, because it's really hard to fold a sheet by yourself.

Then they can help me do it all over again in the evening.

I will let them take over any of my daily tasks, or just watch if they are too squeamish or sad. Maybe after spending the day with us, they will see that cancer is a family disease. It attacks one member but it hits everyone. The physical pain and suffering may be reserved for the patient, but the fear, depression, anxiety, heartbreak and sacrifice is spread out to friends, children, parents and grandchildren.

If your family is prepared for that, you can feel good about skipping that test. Don't think you'll just die. You'll want to fight for life and you will but you have a huge price to pay for not finding the cancer earlier than you did.
What a moving post. Colon cancer runs in my family, and my dad started colonoscopies in the days before they put you under (or even in twilight) and did not have the flexible equipment they have now. He was not a complainer but said it was close to torture then (late 1969s/early 70s). Long story short his cancer was found early twice, safely removed and he lived to 95 in good shape, continuing with regular colonoscopies. If not for the procedure, we would have lost him 40 years earlier.

I find the prep very unpleasant but have the procedure every five years. It is 24 hours of misery but I have no choice with my history. I can see how it would really be difficult for someone who is frail, but if a blockage occurs it almost always involves surgery.

I don't see how you can "force" someone into the procedure, but it is a miserable death if not caught.
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Old 06-08-2016, 09:51 PM
 
6,419 posts, read 5,768,775 times
Reputation: 8670
Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon View Post
Are you serious?

The prep was an inconvenience for me, not some sort of nightmare worse than death. And I didn't even feel the actual test itself. You're exaggerating all this in your head for some reason. It's simply not that bad.
Yep. Thank you Kathryn. Let me pipe up one more time, maybe I'll save a couple of lives.

I had a positive phobia of colonoscopies, didn't get one for 30 years after having suspicious symptoms. I figured if it was cancer I would have been dead already. Then an emergency came up. I had a colonoscopy in December. IT WASN'T BAD AT ALL. The prep medication gives you a case of diarrhea. Do you think y'all can tolerate that? And you have to be on a liquid diet for about a day - beef bouillon, jello, and so forth. The case of diarrhea takes away your appetite so that is not much of a problem. Then you are anesthetized and you don't feel anything..at...all.. The first thing I remember is the doctor saying, "You don't have cancer, but we took out some polyps. You are just fine."
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Old 06-09-2016, 07:42 AM
 
3,813 posts, read 2,236,112 times
Reputation: 11055
I would not force the procedure. I would just state your opinion about it "I'd rather have you checked out so you have the information and the chance to treat it."

Honestly, the treatment for cancer is often harder on the body than the cancer itself (assuming the cancer would need to be treated as opposed to just removing polyps.) It's a different decision for someone of an advanced age in their twilight years as opposed to someone at age 50 who has kids to raise. That doesn't mean one life is more valuable than another, it just means that the pros and cons are weighed differently.
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Old 06-11-2016, 06:35 PM
 
1,262 posts, read 749,017 times
Reputation: 5688
Quote:
Originally Posted by photobuff42 View Post
I would love to have some of those, "No test for me" posters come on down and help me take care of my mom for a day, just to see if they would rather die of cancer than be subjected to a medical test. Let's pick a day that the Hospice staff doesn't come out, just to get a good glimpse of what their kids might have to deal with someday.

They can comb through the pantry and refrigerator to find something to tempt her to eat. Hopefully they come after someone has been to the store, because it's really hard to leave the house for very long.

Then they can wake her up just so they can coax her to eat just enough to take her medicine. It's hard to wake her because she's just really tired these days.

They can count out those endless pills and go back to the bedroom to get her to take the bowl of pills that she needs to survive in our tenth year of cancer.

So many pills! She was taking 22 pills a day. Pills for inflammation, pills for nutritional deficiencies, pills to ward off seizures, pills for seizures, all taken to try to stave off the advancing march of the cancer. Pills for pain; long acting pills to keep it at bay, and short acting ones for when the pain attacks her knees or ribs or back or head because the cancer settled in her bones and brain through the magic of metastases. All this is so depressing that she gets medicine for that, too. Plus those for the anxiety that comes with thinking about it.

But since she takes all those pills, she's plagued with what one commercial calls, "constipation baggage." She needs pills for that, too. Pills and powders that either don't work very well, or work really well--so well that we get extra laundry to do.

But it would be unfair to let anyone think she's still taking 22 pills every day. Now she takes 10 because the other 12 don't work any more and the cancer is marching relentlessly through her body. You can really tell now, you can see her bones, and her skin sags everywhere. And her hair never really came back after all that chemo and radiation. She barely resembles the beautiful mom who sewed my wedding dress. I'll have to show them a picture so they can see how lovely she was.

If she's having a good day, they can follow her into the bathroom to make sure she doesn't fall. If it's a bad day they can help do the laundry we already mentioned.

Then they can help her bathe. Bed bath if she's really tired; shower if she feels up to it. You would think this would be easy since she's lost about 60 pounds, just down to skin and bones. But they will be exhausted because she's dead weight due to muscle atrophy. The anxiety will cause their muscles to tense up in fear of dropping her. As I mentioned, there's a pill for that, but it's for mom, not for us.

Then she will nap and they can help me finish the laundry. Which will be great for me, because it's really hard to fold a sheet by yourself.

Then they can help me do it all over again in the evening.

I will let them take over any of my daily tasks, or just watch if they are too squeamish or sad. Maybe after spending the day with us, they will see that cancer is a family disease. It attacks one member but it hits everyone. The physical pain and suffering may be reserved for the patient, but the fear, depression, anxiety, heartbreak and sacrifice is spread out to friends, children, parents and grandchildren.

If your family is prepared for that, you can feel good about skipping that test. Don't think you'll just die. You'll want to fight for life and you will but you have a huge price to pay for not finding the cancer earlier than you did.
The OP started with "my mother has declined mentally and physically within the last year" so it's not like a perfectly-healthy person declining a test. My mother passed away from dementia/Alzheimers and we went through her having bowel problems and it was so frustrating how many wanted to push those tests. Our thought was if she was diagnosed were we really going to subject her to chemo and treatment? My mother already required a lot of care and her quality of life was diminished as it was. Having her endure the pain to maybe extend her already-diminished life seemed wrong. Again it's different if some treatment can bring a person back to good health.
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Old 06-11-2016, 06:48 PM
 
Location: Georgia, USA
30,679 posts, read 33,019,682 times
Reputation: 37915
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coloradomom22 View Post
The OP started with "my mother has declined mentally and physically within the last year" so it's not like a perfectly-healthy person declining a test. My mother passed away from dementia/Alzheimers and we went through her having bowel problems and it was so frustrating how many wanted to push those tests. Our thought was if she was diagnosed were we really going to subject her to chemo and treatment? My mother already required a lot of care and her quality of life was diminished as it was. Having her endure the pain to maybe extend her already-diminished life seemed wrong. Again it's different if some treatment can bring a person back to good health.
What appears to be lost in the discussion here is an understanding of what colon cancer does. It's not just that it may spread and cause pain that could be treated with palliative measures and narcotics. It ultimately blocks the colon so that fecal material cannot be eliminated. At that point, either the patient has a much more invasive surgical procedure, even if it is just a colostomy to divert feces before getting to the obstruction, or the patient dies an agonizing death.

It's not like the patient just goes to sleep and does not wake up.

Again, we are not talking about a screening procedure. The colonoscopy for the lady in the OP is diagnostic and potentially could be therapeutic.
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Old 06-11-2016, 07:39 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles>Little Rock>Houston>Little Rock
6,488 posts, read 7,607,392 times
Reputation: 17417
My Grandmother and FIL died of colon cancer. Neither one of them ever had a colonoscopy. I had my first maybe 4 years ago along with an EGD because I was having some abdominal pain. I was found to have two polyps (benign) and an ulcer. I am supposed to go back next year.

The worst part for me was all the gas I had to pass afterwords.

On the brighter side, I was allowed ice cream during the prep stage and I got to see pics of my bright shiny colon.
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