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Old 01-21-2010, 10:07 PM
 
Location: Charlotte, NC
624 posts, read 2,100,865 times
Reputation: 563

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I've been a Verizon customer for years now. I was eligible for my new every 2 back in March '09, but was perfectly happy with my old flip phone that only really made calls and could send the occasional text using the non QWERTY keyboard.

Today my battery finally died. I went to the Verizon store, thought the EnV3 was neat and opted for it. Then the Rep slaps me with the new data plan requirement.

"Data package of $9.99 or higher required for 3G Multimedia Phones. All 3G Smartphones require a data feature of $29.99 or higher, or a data plan."

I don't use the internet on my phone. I have no interest of using the internet, getting emails or anything else on my phone. I don't want to listen to music. I just want a keyboard and a strong speaker phone.

Why do I have to get this stupid data plan?
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Old 01-22-2010, 12:13 AM
 
11,135 posts, read 14,151,425 times
Reputation: 3696
Firstly, you have a very valid point and one I suggest you contact Verizon about, as I know myself and others have.

As I gather, with Verizon's change from $99 dollar, all you can talk to the new $69 dollar all you can talk plans, they have played a shell game of sorts. In order to compete with other carriers better, many are attracted by the 69 all you can talk plan but now any phone using 3G network must have the data plan/package. They used to offer two keyboarded phones which didn't require a data plan but no longer. They caught grief from customers over this so I suspect this latest change will really invoke ire.

I would venture to guess this is the cell phone industries way of pushing people towards smart phones, PDA's, Black Berry, since you have to have this package, might as well spend a few bucks more and get a device that is better designed to use the features they are pushing instead of one that can "just use" them in the lightest sense.

Perhaps Verizon will realize that while attempting to be more like other carriers they are also removing some of the reasons people leave other carriers to sign on with Verizon in the first place.
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Old 01-22-2010, 07:11 AM
 
Location: Southwest Missouri
1,921 posts, read 6,406,124 times
Reputation: 927
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysteryMT View Post
Why do I have to get this stupid data plan?
Because Verizon is paying a lot of money to subsidize the phone that you want.

There are plenty of phones that will accomplish your basic needs and not require a data plan of any sort. You just happened to pick a more expensive phone with more advanced features. Verizon has to foot the bill for that phone, whether you choose to utilize the features or not. As a result, you're required to add a data plan to your cell phone package.
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Old 01-22-2010, 07:21 AM
 
Location: Southwest Missouri
1,921 posts, read 6,406,124 times
Reputation: 927
Quote:
Originally Posted by TnHilltopper View Post
Firstly, you have a very valid point and one I suggest you contact Verizon about, as I know myself and others have.
Why is there a valid complaint here? Verizon offers plenty of phones that are capable of sending text messages without requiring data plans. The OP chose a more expensive phone that is being largely subsidized by Verizon. For that reason, Verizon requires a data plan so that some/all of the subsidy can be recovered. Why do you feel that something is wrong with that?
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Old 01-22-2010, 09:00 AM
 
11,135 posts, read 14,151,425 times
Reputation: 3696
Quote:
Originally Posted by 8 SNAKE View Post
Why is there a valid complaint here? Verizon offers plenty of phones that are capable of sending text messages without requiring data plans. The OP chose a more expensive phone that is being largely subsidized by Verizon. For that reason, Verizon requires a data plan so that some/all of the subsidy can be recovered. Why do you feel that something is wrong with that?
Why is it a valid complaint, because many people don't wish to use the internet which they have to pay for on their phone.

I purchased an Envy Touch and just before they changed their pricing and packaging. Now, when I renew my contract, I'll have to pay for a package that I didn't agree to when the phone was purchased.

Just because a phone has a keyboard shouldn't necessitate having to purchase products a person will not use, namely internet. In fact, Verizon has several keyboard phones which they give away FREE with a 2 year contract, so it has nothing to do with the price of the phone.

Many of what is now listed as "3G multimedia" phones were phones that you could purchase varying levels of packages and services on, now it is simply required. The only phones listed on Verizon's website that you don't have to have a data package or internet with are the 16 basic phones of which only half you have to pay for with a contract.

So it is a legitimate complaint that their pricing and packaging changes are forcing once even free phones to include services that a lot of people do not need or want. Verizon is free to do whatever they like, but I know of a good number of people who left other carriers because Verizon at one time would tailor packages and services based upon specific need instead of forcing a "one sized shoe fits all" type of packaging.
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Old 01-22-2010, 11:05 AM
 
939 posts, read 3,378,838 times
Reputation: 620
You essentially have three options:

1. Cancel
2. Get a phone that doesn't require the plan
3. Or just simply pay for the plan

You can complain which might make a difference. They will bring in billions of $$ in extra revenue due to this increase. The reality is they don't care what you think of their data plan (unless you cancel of course).
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Old 01-22-2010, 12:57 PM
 
Location: Southwest Missouri
1,921 posts, read 6,406,124 times
Reputation: 927
Quote:
Originally Posted by TnHilltopper View Post
Why is it a valid complaint, because many people don't wish to use the internet which they have to pay for on their phone.
People have the choice of purchasing a phone and package. If someone doesn't want the internet, he/she can buy a phone that doesn't require a data package.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TnHilltopper View Post
I purchased an Envy Touch and just before they changed their pricing and packaging. Now, when I renew my contract, I'll have to pay for a package that I didn't agree to when the phone was purchased.
Why would you renew your contract just to keep the same phone? Doesn't make any sense to me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TnHilltopper View Post
Just because a phone has a keyboard shouldn't necessitate having to purchase products a person will not use, namely internet. In fact, Verizon has several keyboard phones which they give away FREE with a 2 year contract, so it has nothing to do with the price of the phone.
Huh? I never said anything about a keyboard necessitating the purchase of a product. I said that a more expensive phone with advanced features is going to be more heavily subsidized by Verizon. For that reason, Verizon requires customers to buy data packages when getting those phones for reduced prices.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TnHilltopper View Post
Many of what is now listed as "3G multimedia" phones were phones that you could purchase varying levels of packages and services on, now it is simply required. The only phones listed on Verizon's website that you don't have to have a data package or internet with are the 16 basic phones of which only half you have to pay for with a contract.
The cell phone industry is quickly expanding in multimedia/smart phones because that is what the market, in general, demands. There's a cost associated with building up the infrastructure and technology required to support that expansion. One consequence is that some people are going to be forced to buy data packages if they wish to buy multimedia/smart phones. There are still options if you don't want a data package, but I can forsee a day when all plans include data. It's simply the way that the market is moving and what the majority of customers demand.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TnHilltopper View Post
So it is a legitimate complaint that their pricing and packaging changes are forcing once even free phones to include services that a lot of people do not need or want. Verizon is free to do whatever they like, but I know of a good number of people who left other carriers because Verizon at one time would tailor packages and services based upon specific need instead of forcing a "one sized shoe fits all" type of packaging.
That argument still doesn't hold water with me. If you want a specific phone at a contract price, you have to accept the terms of that contract. If the complaint is about the data fees, there are phones that don't require them.
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Old 01-22-2010, 02:08 PM
 
11,135 posts, read 14,151,425 times
Reputation: 3696
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGlenn View Post
You essentially have three options:

1. Cancel
2. Get a phone that doesn't require the plan
3. Or just simply pay for the plan

You can complain which might make a difference. They will bring in billions of $$ in extra revenue due to this increase. The reality is they don't care what you think of their data plan (unless you cancel of course).
This is basically it in a nutshell. However, I do know that Verizon does respond at some level to customer complaints. In a local issue, we had a large segment of population that was 'fringe' and demanded the addition of a tower. The following years budget included this tower. While they may or may not capitulate to customer complaints on this issue, I suspect if enough people complain about any given issue it will be addressed in some manner. If not, what was lost?



Quote:
Originally Posted by 8 SNAKE View Post
People have the choice of purchasing a phone and package. If someone doesn't want the internet, he/she can buy a phone that doesn't require a data package.
This is like saying, If you want a Porsche with cloth seats, then buy a Hyundai instead.

Quote:
Why would you renew your contract just to keep the same phone? Doesn't make any sense to me.
I wouldn't. If Verizon requires me to add services that I didn't agree to when I purchased the phone, I'll opt for another carrier who is willing to offer me a package I find acceptable.

Quote:
Huh? I never said anything about a keyboard necessitating the purchase of a product. I said that a more expensive phone with advanced features is going to be more heavily subsidized by Verizon. For that reason, Verizon requires customers to buy data packages when getting those phones for reduced prices.
Verizon doesn't make phones, they purchase them from manufactures and resell them. I pointed out that Verizon offers free keyboard phones, so it has nothing to do with the cost of the phone. Verizon makes the bulk of their profit from the sales of services they offer, ie voice, data, internet. The greater the amount of services, the more they make.

As I pointed out earlier, since Verizon lowered the price of its unlimited talk from 99 to 69, is it just a coincidence that this is the same time in which data and internet packages were forced onto phones that didn't previously require these packages?

Quote:
The cell phone industry is quickly expanding in multimedia/smart phones because that is what the market, in general, demands. There's a cost associated with building up the infrastructure and technology required to support that expansion. One consequence is that some people are going to be forced to buy data packages if they wish to buy multimedia/smart phones. There are still options if you don't want a data package, but I can forsee a day when all plans include data. It's simply the way that the market is moving and what the majority of customers demand.
Obviously there is a market for people wanting a keyboarded phone and text package as I know of at least several people who have complained of this very issue and feel Verizon is shoving these unwanted packages upon them.

So we can ignore the demands by one segment of customers who wish for packages tailored to their needs in favor of "if you want anything beyond our cheapest phone, you must buy additional services packages"

Thats fine, and I suspect those customers who previously left other carriers because Verizon would tailor packages will now consider returning or looking for a carrier that will.

Quote:
That argument still doesn't hold water with me. If you want a specific phone at a contract price, you have to accept the terms of that contract. If the complaint is about the data fees, there are phones that don't require them.
Yes and I purchased a phone and signed a contract in which Verizon and I agreed that I could use my envy Touch for a given price for a given time. When it is time to renew my original contract, Verizon will say if you want to continue using your phone we sold you with our being your carrier then you must also purchase this additional service package. At which point, I'll take my phone and opt for another carrier who will allow me to use my phone for voice and text without having to pay for data and internet packages that I do not use.

In any event, I can complain to Verizon all I wish, just because it doesn't hold water with you doesn't mean I can't assert my discontent with my carrier. I'm part of that market share that is complaining, just as the OP of this thread is and just like many others. Verizon can choose to address this or not.
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Old 01-22-2010, 03:46 PM
 
Location: Southwest Missouri
1,921 posts, read 6,406,124 times
Reputation: 927
Quote:
Originally Posted by TnHilltopper View Post
This is like saying, If you want a Porsche with cloth seats, then buy a Hyundai instead.
Oh boy. [beats head against desk]

And you're saying that you want to have a Porsche for Hyundai prices, but you promise not to use the performance. Doesn't make any sense, does it?



Quote:
Originally Posted by TnHilltopper View Post
I wouldn't. If Verizon requires me to add services that I didn't agree to when I purchased the phone, I'll opt for another carrier who is willing to offer me a package I find acceptable.
When your current contract expires, just keep using your phone and current package. You don't actually have to change anything once your contract runs out.


Quote:
Originally Posted by TnHilltopper View Post
Verizon doesn't make phones, they purchase them from manufactures and resell them. I pointed out that Verizon offers free keyboard phones, so it has nothing to do with the cost of the phone. Verizon makes the bulk of their profit from the sales of services they offer, ie voice, data, internet. The greater the amount of services, the more they make.
Yes, I know that Verizon doesn't make any phones. However, Verizon DOES subsidize the phones. If you don't think that Verizon is trying to capture back that money by requiring data plans on certain phones, you are mistaken.

A phone having a keyboard and a being multimedia/smart phone are two entirely different things. I'm not sure why you keep mentioning a keyboard when that is not the issue.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TnHilltopper View Post
As I pointed out earlier, since Verizon lowered the price of its unlimited talk from 99 to 69, is it just a coincidence that this is the same time in which data and internet packages were forced onto phones that didn't previously require these packages?
No clue, but it still doesn't matter. You either opt for a phone with a data plan and pay the monthly fee or you buy a phone that doesn't require a data package. For your argument to hold water, Verizon would require a data plan in order to take advantage of the new prices on unlimited talk/text packages. That is not the case.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TnHilltopper View Post
Obviously there is a market for people wanting a keyboarded phone and text package as I know of at least several people who have complained of this very issue and feel Verizon is shoving these unwanted packages upon them.
I'm not sure why this point continues to elude you, so I will repeat it again.

THERE ARE PACKAGES AVAILABLE FOR TALK/TEXT WITHOUT DATA PLANS. THERE ARE PHONES AVAILABLE THAT DO NOT REQUIRE YOU TO BUY A DATA PACKAGE.

If you don't like the phone options available without data, that is a completely different argument. Saying that Verizon is shoving unwanted packages upon people is simply not accurate, no matter how many times you repeat it. People are simply choosing phones that require data packages.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TnHilltopper View Post
So we can ignore the demands by one segment of customers who wish for packages tailored to their needs in favor of "if you want anything beyond our cheapest phone, you must buy additional services packages"

Thats fine, and I suspect those customers who previously left other carriers because Verizon would tailor packages will now consider returning or looking for a carrier that will.
I'm not sure why you think Verizon is the only carrier doing this? Every cell phone company in America is expanding its smart phone segment.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TnHilltopper View Post
Yes and I purchased a phone and signed a contract in which Verizon and I agreed that I could use my envy Touch for a given price for a given time. When it is time to renew my original contract, Verizon will say if you want to continue using your phone we sold you with our being your carrier then you must also purchase this additional service package. At which point, I'll take my phone and opt for another carrier who will allow me to use my phone for voice and text without having to pay for data and internet packages that I do not use.
When your contract runs out, you should be able to continue using your current phone under your current plan. Nothing will change until you decide to do something different. I don't see the issue here?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TnHilltopper View Post
In any event, I can complain to Verizon all I wish, just because it doesn't hold water with you doesn't mean I can't assert my discontent with my carrier. I'm part of that market share that is complaining, just as the OP of this thread is and just like many others. Verizon can choose to address this or not.
Easy, trigger. I'm not telling you what to do and couldn't care less if you complain to Verizon or not. I'm simply explaining why I disagree with many of your issues here.
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Old 01-22-2010, 07:17 PM
 
11,135 posts, read 14,151,425 times
Reputation: 3696
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysteryMT View Post
I've been a Verizon customer for years now. I was eligible for my new every 2 back in March '09, but was perfectly happy with my old flip phone that only really made calls and could send the occasional text using the non QWERTY keyboard.

Today my battery finally died. I went to the Verizon store, thought the EnV3 was neat and opted for it. Then the Rep slaps me with the new data plan requirement.

"Data package of $9.99 or higher required for 3G Multimedia Phones. All 3G Smartphones require a data feature of $29.99 or higher, or a data plan."

I don't use the internet on my phone. I have no interest of using the internet, getting emails or anything else on my phone. I don't want to listen to music. I just want a keyboard and a strong speaker phone.

Why do I have to get this stupid data plan?

Ok, after these exchanges I decided to call my local Verizon store and ask them for more details so I could hear it from the horses mouth.

Since you want a qwerty keyboard for texting but don't wish to have to pay for a data package or online services, the online store has two "basic" phones which meet this criteria.

The first is the Samsung Intensity which has a slide out keyboard, the other is the Verizon "Razzle". They both have removable memory cards, 1.3 megapix cameras, and are bluetooth capable. However at my local store, and according to the sales person, they only carry the Samsung Intensity.

So this is your only choice of phone with a keyboard without a data package. Was kind of funny as they sure do push PDA's and smart phones like a crack dealer and if you let them, they'll never let up. Feel like you are in a used car lot with a guy named Earl in a checker sports coat.
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