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EXPERT OPINION: says Fault on both parties - We dont know where the 2nd car was whehn the 1st car started backing (op said there was a corner) so car 1 backs legally, with no one coming, then car 2 comes around? - More important, car 2 SAW car 1 backing, doesn't blow horn, that's the "last clear chance" to avoid....I'd go 50/50 on this one, maybe 60/40 adverse to the backer BUT - in NC if you put even 1% on the other party, both have to go through their own insurance...
You say you witnessed the accident. DID driver 2 stop to let driver 1 out of the spot? IF so, did driver 2 give the other vehicle enough room to safely get out of the spot? Or was he up his arse?
driver 2 stopped their attempt to enter vacant parking spot. They stopped because they were not going to have time to get in there at the same time, or before, car 1 was backing up. Driver 2 told the police that they "decided" to shift their tranny from drive to reverse, to back up, and allow room.
This "time to change gears" was not sufficient to prevent the accident.
My observation is the "horn" would have prevented it.
If you are stationary with a new car and someone else is headed toward you and they are clearly at fault, are you going to let them hit you just because they may be at fault? I'd think you'd use your horn to warn them.
Driver 2 was driving a car with a N.C. tag but he stated he was from N.J. so it seems it was not their car. I remember hearing "I'm in trouble" meaning they were involved in a minor accident with a relative's car.
EXPERT OPINION: says Fault on both parties - We dont know where the 2nd car was whehn the 1st car started backing (op said there was a corner) so car 1 backs legally, with no one coming, then car 2 comes around? - More important, car 2 SAW car 1 backing, doesn't blow horn, that's the "last clear chance" to avoid....I'd go 50/50 on this one, maybe 60/40 adverse to the backer BUT - in NC if you put even 1% on the other party, both have to go through their own insurance...
I agree with you.
There was a traffic island and car 2 was coming around the curve to get to the vacant parking spot.
I'm not sure the dimensions, the incident happened so fast.
However the vacant parking spot was not far after having made the curve around the end of the parking lot island.
I think this is why car 1 did not see car 2, started to back slowly and why car 2 did not even know car 1 was backing until they got on the curve.
Another warning was "back up lights", lights on when the car is in reverse.
Car 2 may or may not have seen these lights.
My only question is why not use the horn?
What else is the horn's purpose, other than to warn?
(car's, kids, pets, even dumb squirrels get some horn's blown at them)
I think if both at fault they'll each pay their own damage and car 1 was a mid 90's car so he probably does not have collision and comprehensive so he'd be out of luck on a repair.
update:
I got a call from the driver who was backing up. She has been cited by the police report and the statement of the other driver, to be at fault 100%.
I've used "they" in order to protect the identity of the persons as far as gender.
I gave her my moral support by stating that, the fact that the other driver was retired, and they decided to apply their brakes, change the transmission from drive to reverse, move their foot back to the accelerator to back up..........INSTEAD of using their horn.......makes me think the "time to change gears and back up, and not use their horn" caused the accident. Even if this lady was at fault for backing up, I think the other driver's horn was the way to prevent the accident.
Survey: when a car is about to hit you what do you do?
1. honk horn?
2. other?
The lady said if the damage to the other car is under $1800 it won't raise her insurance rates.
I think I'll start backing into parking spots, so I'm always coming OUT forward.
And I need to call the car makers and ask them the purpose of the horn.
So, this fender bender incident has come to a close, non horn blower was not even 1% at fault and we'll never know if he even looked or saw backup-reverse lights.
I feel sorry for the woman who is at fault. She said she looked everywhere and never saw the other car before starting to back up.
And the police, well, their report cites fault, though they did not look at the damage to either car and did not question either driver as to what happened, or me as the witness. So, how can they even justify their report.
It may be that the backing vehicle is always at fault, so that is how they came to their conclusion.
I'm going to started backing in, so I can be forward coming out, so this does not happen to me, and I suggest that as a good way to park if you can.
I would have thought it would have been both cars fault. Car no 2 should have been aware of their surroundings and should have seen the back up lights. In a parking lot you're not driving that fast, you have plenty of time to watch out for the other cars. And I do feel sorry for car 1, I've had this happen to me plenty of times. Thankfully I've never hit the other car, but I've had it happen numerous times where I'm pulling out of a spot and some idiot can't bother to notice and just swerves on past me. Is it that hard to stop or at least slow down so another car can finish backing up?!
I actually had a car almost hit me in the parking lot yesterday. I had backed out of my spot, and once out had a car in front of me. My car was about parallel to the spot I had just backed out of, but the car in front of me was wanting to back up into that space. So of course they just flip their car in reverse hoping they can get past my car and into the spot. There wasn't enough room, and with a car behind me I wasn't about to start backing up. I honked my horn to indicate that I was there and unable to move out of their way. They ignored me and continued to try to back around me, so I honked again. Thankfully they got the hint and moved on to look for another spot.
I would have thought it would have been both cars fault. Car no 2 should have been aware of their surroundings and should have seen the back up lights. In a parking lot you're not driving that fast, you have plenty of time to watch out for the other cars. And I do feel sorry for car 1, I've had this happen to me plenty of times. Thankfully I've never hit the other car, but I've had it happen numerous times where I'm pulling out of a spot and some idiot can't bother to notice and just swerves on past me. Is it that hard to stop or at least slow down so another car can finish backing up?!
I actually had a car almost hit me in the parking lot yesterday. I had backed out of my spot, and once out had a car in front of me. My car was about parallel to the spot I had just backed out of, but the car in front of me was wanting to back up into that space. So of course they just flip their car in reverse hoping they can get past my car and into the spot. There wasn't enough room, and with a car behind me I wasn't about to start backing up. I honked my horn to indicate that I was there and unable to move out of their way. They ignored me and continued to try to back around me, so I honked again. Thankfully they got the hint and moved on to look for another spot.
"and some idiot can't bother to notice"
You hit on a good word for some of them....IDIOTS
My feeling is, even if the backer upper was to be at fault, a honking of the horn could have prevented it.
Isn't that one reason they install horns in cars?
To warn people.
I've been in an accident like this. I was in a restaurant parking lot leaving and a kid put his car in reverse backed out of his space and hit me as I was driving out. The thing about using a horn is that it happens so fast and your brain takes so long to register there is actually a driver who is going to hit you, that it's over with before you can react. It's easy to stand on the side lines and make judgments, but the shock, I think slows reaction down.
When this happened, there were two other car loads of family with this kid who all proceeded to get out of their cars and start yelling at me for not blowing my horn. His mom was a particular word that rhymes with witch. I called the police, who showed up and after seeing what happened, issued a ticket to the kid for not paying proper attention while backing up.
In any case, as I found out, if a party is backing up, they yield 100% of the right of way and if they strike anything then it is 100% their fault, even in NC. The other party is never at fault for not stopping, not backing up and not blowing their horn. Lesson to be learned here is to pay attention when you do back up and do look out the rear window.
Interesting question. Every situation is different, but my instinct typically is to take evasive action (if possible) rather than honk horn, and taking evasive action usually precludes honking horn at the same time. ==>>
Quote:
The thing about using a horn is that it happens so fast and your brain takes so long to register there is actually a driver who is going to hit you, that it's over with before you can react.
40 years driving, no accidents, but I have avoided quite a few. And of course, have been very lucky.
I do know if you strike someone from behind, even if you were the proper distance behind and under the speed limit, you will be charged at fault. Such as sliding on ice or snow, the rear car is always at fault.
One of my most frustrating experiences was I was on the 4th floor of my college dorm and while I am looking out the window, an accident in the parking lot happened and I was found at fault. I thought the powers above caused the accident.
The parking lot was not totally level. It had snow and ice on it. I parked my car and I was as close to the middle of the parking space as I could get. I put on the emergency brake and headed up to my room. Later I look out and see that my car had slid on the ice and into the car next to me.
My fault and I was not even in the car.
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