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it's cool. I guess you are blessed with copious amounts of time and money to fight these injustices. Me? Not worth the $ to fight it. I'll save the fight for those times where I really feel"wronged" by "the man". Not being snarky, just different perspectives.
Yeah actually, he does! After all, he's the one traveling the country in an RV, living the life of Reilly. But then you might want to ask yourself, how did he get all that time and money anyway?
I used to do the 3 hour daily commute to work a job downtown Chicago, and didn't have the luxury of time or money either. Now I run my own business, mostly from home. How you think that happened?
First time I decided to take a ticket to court, didn't really think I was going to win, but I read the ordinance, and realized that ticket was just wrong. Still didn't think I really had a snowball's chance in hades, but kind of figured that if I had to pay the $100 anyway, might as well get a little bang for my buck, with a hands-on courtroom educational experience. So I did it, to see if I could, and surprise, surprise. Guess I could.
Questioning that officer in court, I realized that he either hadn't really read that ordinance, or didn't understand what it said. Even after I highlighted the section in the ordinance he had ticketed me for, and had him read out loud at the hearing, where it said that I was entitled to keep "no more than 1" junk vehicle, he still didn't seem to understand, and I could clearly see the administrative hearing officer rolling his eyes at the code officer's apparent lack of comprehension. Huh? A code officer who didn't seem to understand his own code? How could that even be possible? That experience was a real eye opener.
I don't take anyone's "say so" any more, and don't trust anyone's word. Anyone. I question everything, and everyone. Boy, the things I've learned by doing my own research, and digging deep.
Yes, I go for second opinions, because even a medical diagnosis, in reality, is an opinion, and even doctors dissent in their professional opinions. I've lost all trust in auto mechanics, because I've taken my vehicle to 3 diferent mechanics for estimates, and have been told 3 completely different items were in need of repair or replacement. That hasn't just happened once either. Recently had a driveway removed, and if I had taken the first estimate, I'd have paid $2,000, instead of $500 I did pay, for the exact same job.
You shouldn't take my word either. If you have the time, please do your own research. Or not, your choice. That's ok too, because if everyone did what I do now, I wouldn't make, or save, as much money.
At minimum, really hope you don't take the word of anyone who tells you anything on the internet. I mean, seriously now.
Really? You want to talk trustworthy? Tell me again how (s)he's an attorney. LOL!
And BTW, FYI Real attorneys are perfectly aware of the fact that other attorneys may, and probably, will interpret laws, codes, and other points of law differently, and draw a different conclusion. Their interpretation, conclusions, and decisions are professional opinions, period. In law school, the importance of wording is hammered into aspiring attorneys, and they know better than to express their professional opinions as if they were fact, especially when rendering an opinion in writing. The law is open to interpretation, and there are very few absolutes, but this wording is not optional. They are required by their professional code of ethics to make very clear that fact that the conclusions they are are opinions, and must do so using the actual wording, "In my opinion", or "In my professional opinion."
Even supreme court justices in rendering their decisions, use the wording, "In my professional opinion", always.
Again, that wording is not optional, it is required. Failure to use that wording is a dead giveaway, which could cost a genuine, licensed attorney their license.
I don't believe for one second that Dover is a licensed attorney, but if you persist then please provide his name and license number and I will be more than happy to send his or her posts for their review of potential ethics violation to the bar association, as well as the Illinois Department of Professional Regulation.
Last edited by sarabeth1111; 12-15-2011 at 12:32 PM..
So what are you saying, that we should check some city website every month or two to see if some new law was just created, as the city is not likely to disseminate the information to every household in the city. Some people don't read newspapers, they don't watch televised news, like myself, so it's our duty to find out ourselves? And if we don't find out ourselves, then you know how it goes:
Yes, that's the way it works in this country. If you live in a community, the burden's on you to know the laws. If you don't like the laws, you either move or work to change them. It's your responsibility as a citizen to know the laws of your community.
The city of Evanston offers email newsletters on a variety of topics. If you look at their news page, you'll notice that the very first item is about an extension of the vehicle sticker deadline (http://www.cityofevanston.org/news/2011/12/avoid-the-lines-get-vehicle-stickers-before-dec-16/ - broken link). Evanston also publishes a print magazine, Highlights, which includes notices of law and regulation changes. Highlights can be picked up in city buildings and community centers.
I mean, really. I found the above information in about 30 seconds by searching the Evanston web site and I'm not an Evanston resident ... and someone who doesn't have internet access could do so at a public library, or stop by City Hall to ask. If someone chooses not to read Highlights or subscribe to the city's email newsletters and read them, or read local papers or watch local newscasts well, I don't really have any sympathy if they get in trouble with the law.
Yeah actually, he does! After all, he's the one traveling the country in an RV, living the life of Reilly. But then you might want to ask yourself, how did he get all that time and money anyway?
I used to do the 3 hour daily commute to work a job downtown Chicago, and didn't have the luxury of time or money either. Now I run my own business, mostly from home. How you think that happened?
First time I decided to take a ticket to court, didn't really think I was going to win, but I read the ordinance, and realized that ticket was just wrong. Still didn't think I really had a snowball's chance in hades, but kind of figured that if I had to pay the $100 anyway, might as well get a little bang for my buck, with a hands-on courtroom educational experience. So I did it, to see if I could, and surprise, surprise. Guess I could.
Questioning that officer in court, I realized that he either hadn't really read that ordinance, or didn't understand what it said. Even after I highlighted the section in the ordinance he had ticketed me for, and had him read out loud at the hearing, where it said that I was entitled to keep "no more than 1" junk vehicle, he still didn't seem to understand, and I could clearly see the administrative hearing officer rolling his eyes at the code officer's apparent lack of comprehension. Huh? A code officer who didn't seem to understand his own code? How could that even be possible? That experience was a real eye opener.
I don't take anyone's "say so" any more, and don't trust anyone's word. Anyone. I question everything, and everyone. Boy, the things I've learned by doing my own research, and digging deep.
Yes, I go for second opinions, because even a medical diagnosis, in reality, is an opinion, and even doctors dissent in their professional opinions. I've lost all trust in auto mechanics, because I've taken my vehicle to 3 diferent mechanics for estimates, and have been told 3 completely different items were in need of repair or replacement. That hasn't just happened once either. Recently had a driveway removed, and if I had taken the first estimate, I'd have paid $2,000, instead of $500 I did pay, for the exact same job.
You shouldn't take my word either. If you have the time, please do your own research. Or not, your choice. That's ok too, because if everyone did what I do now, I wouldn't make, or save, as much money.
At minimum, really hope you don't take the word of anyone who tells you anything on the internet. I mean, seriously now.
Sarahbeth, In the General Forums section there is a forum titled great Debates. I think you might like it and you may find it to be a better forum for the argument you are making here. I think the OP got his answer long time ago. He can go to court to fight the ticket, he has a slim chance of winning and many feel Op's time & energy is better spent elsewhere. Did I sum that up concisely?
Sarahbeth, In the General Forums section there is a forum titled great Debates. I think you might like it and you may find it to be a better forum for the argument you are making here. I think the OP got his answer long time ago. He can go to court to fight the ticket, he has a slim chance of winning and many feel Op's time & energy is better spent elsewhere. Did I sum that up concisely?
No, I'm not interested in any great debates and I really want to get back to work. But I'm on 3 different antibiotics, and my doctor screamed at me for ignoring this infection and letting it get this bad by continuing to work. So the doctor ordered me to bed rest, and my husband took all my work away. If I try sneaking it, he'll take away my computers next, and I don't think I can survive without my ipad. I'm playing Angry Birds and We Rule while typing this. It's rough.
If the OP was ticketed for a parking violation, his chances of winning in court are not slim. That one's a slam-dunk.
If he was ticketed for lack of a wheel tax sticker though? Well, you may think his chances are "slim", but I posted the professional opinion of an attorney, licensed in the state of Illinois, which was directly "on point", and his opinion does not agree with yours.
You can hold whatever opinion you so desire, but I'm really not sure what would make you, or anyone else here, feel that your opinion somehow holds more weight, or is somehow more authoritative, than the professional opinion of a licensed attorney.
I think I'll be taking the professional opinion of a licensed attorney, over anyone on this board, and by the way, I did check his credentials. Sorry, but I don't think I'm the one who's crazy here, or the one who's word isn't "trustworthy".
You don't have to agree. After all, it's still a free country, for now anyway.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vasily
Yes, that's the way it works in this country. If you live in a community, the burden's on you to know the laws. If you don't like the laws, you either move or work to change them. It's your responsibility as a citizen to know the laws of your community.
Yes, and one of the ways you work to effect change, is by not just paying tickets, but by taking the matter to court instead. That's what courts of law are for, and court decisions are actually one of the ways in which laws are established, and changed. It is the right of every citizen to utilize our court system, for that purpose. As well as for other purposes.
Last edited by sarabeth1111; 12-15-2011 at 12:48 PM..
I don't believe for one second that Dover is a licensed attorney, but if you persist then please provide his name and license number and I will be more than happy to send his or her posts for their review of potential ethics violation to the bar association, as well as the Illinois Department of Professional Regulation.
The Illinois State Bar Association does not handle attorney discipline, as it is a voluntary bar association. That is the role of the ARCC. Perhaps you are not as smart as you seem to think you are.
iDK, Sarahbeth, YOU seem to be the one with the need to 'be right". Are you always this tenaciously argumentative, or is being under the weather making you grumpy?
The Illinois State Bar Association does not handle attorney discipline, as it is a voluntary bar association. That is the role of the ARCC. Perhaps you are not as smart as you seem to think you are.
Gee, when did I profess to be "smart?". Funny, I don't remember that. do believe that what I said is that I'm going to take the professional opinion of a licensed attorney, over anyone on this board.
What I'm good at is research, and a single phone call to the Illinois Dept. Of regulation would be all I'd need to provide me with the contact information of the appropriate agency. Take me all of 2 minutes. Hardly an obstacle to reporting potential misconduct. Just haven't had to report an attorney yet.
Doesn't change the fact that attorneys aren't allowed to misrepresent their professional opinions as IF they were fact, and that I do not believe for a single second that this Dover is an actual attorney. Most attorneys know better, and claiming otherwise, well in my opinion, that would constitute fraud because it's ALL a matter of opinion.
The bar association does discipline their members, and Membership in the bar association in Illinois may be voluntary right now, but it's mandatory in other states, and Illinois has been moving towards mandatory membership for professionals as well, as well as mandatory peer reviews, which normally is conducted in most professionals by those voluntary associations.
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