Evanston---would you send your kids to ETHS? (Chicago, Leland: low income, house)

[chet everett]

Re: crumbsnatcher / dope / drinking -- I wonder if this was pre-MADD & DARE? My kids went to Hinsdale Central and they had classmates that did have some pretty severe consequences with regards to sports for not adhering to the policies for substance abuse. Among other parents of athletes there was pretty strong support for making sure that kids were both aware of these consequences and discouraged from behavior that would result in negative results. Personally going way back into the dark ages of my own high school experience I would say that despite the fact that me and my classmates often did travel LONG distances for various social events we were accutely aware of the dangers of not being sober for such trips -- early on a fatal accident stuck one of our group and it was much more common after that to just "sleep over" if one was too fatigued to head home...

Re: comments on greatschools -- as I have often warned there is no real effort on the part of the folks that run that site to verify comments of random people with an axe to grind or some equally unreliable Pollyanna -- the "grain of salt" needed to be taken with those sorts of comments is about the size of Mount Everest and that renders the site as zero value compare to sites that are 100% data based and far easier to rely upon like the Illinois Interactive Report Card site...

[nana053]

Originally Posted by chet everett

Re: crumbsnatcher / dope / drinking -- I wonder if this was pre-MADD & DARE? My kids went to Hinsdale Central and they had classmates that did have some pretty severe consequences with regards to sports for not adhering to the policies for substance abuse. Among other parents of athletes there was pretty strong support for making sure that kids were both aware of these consequences and discouraged from behavior that would result in negative results. Personally going way back into the dark ages of my own high school experience I would say that despite the fact that me and my classmates often did travel LONG distances for various social events we were accutely aware of the dangers of not being sober for such trips -- early on a fatal accident stuck one of our group and it was much more common after that to just "sleep over" if one was too fatigued to head home...

Re: comments on greatschools -- as I have often warned there is no real effort on the part of the folks that run that site to verify comments of random people with an axe to grind or some equally unreliable Pollyanna -- the "grain of salt" needed to be taken with those sorts of comments is about the size of Mount Everest and that renders the site as zero value compare to sites that are 100% data based and far easier to rely upon like the Illinois Interactive Report Card site...

Drugs and alcohol have been around for a long time. New Trier, btw, was far worse than ETHS when my kids were in school because New Trier had a tendency to sweep things under the rug. Still my dd in particular knew plenty of druggies at both schools. And, the year she graduated from ETHS was a traumatic one for her in terms of friends who ODed. She was in theater, not sports, so perhaps that was the difference in who she knew. While she did not drink or do drugs throughout HS, she had friends who did including one killed in a car accident while drinking and another who ODed on drugs.

I disagree that data based sites say anything much about schools except about the percentages of kids who pass tests.

Unfortunately, that is only part of the information one needs to evaluate a school when you are moving in. You need to know the atmosphere of the school. You need to know how teachers treat students and how students interact. And, if you have a child with special needs you have to be especially careful to see how kids who are *different* are treated.

[chitownperson]

Originally Posted by nana053

I disagree that data based sites say anything much about schools except about the percentages of kids who pass tests.

Unfortunately, that is only part of the information one needs to evaluate a school when you are moving in. You need to know the atmosphere of the school. You need to know how teachers treat students and how students interact. And, if you have a child with special needs you have to be especially careful to see how kids who are *different* are treated.

I completely agree with this.

[chet everett]

There is a lot of good info beyond just test scores -- funding levlels, demographics and mobility rates are extremely helpful in determine the stability of the schools. There is certainly lots of room for even more detailed objective data about how various groups perform and I know that many schools have reservations about releasing too narrowly defined data about special Ed as the small groups of students at many schools might violate the privacy of the students who are receiving such services.

Many schools have taken proactive steps to create an an environment that strongly supports all students. I beleive these sorts of programs grew out the awareness of the difficulty that some kids integrating into bigger schools after the violence at Columbine...

[nana053]

Originally Posted by chet everett

There is a lot of good info beyond just test scores -- funding levlels, demographics and mobility rates are extremely helpful in determine the stability of the schools. There is certainly lots of room for even more detailed objective data about how various groups perform and I know that many schools have reservations about releasing too narrowly defined data about special Ed as the small groups of students at many schools might violate the privacy of the students who are receiving such services.

Many schools have taken proactive steps to create an an environment that strongly supports all students. I beleive these sorts of programs grew out the awareness of the difficulty that some kids integrating into bigger schools after the violence at Columbine...

Once again, I disagree. The data on those sites is relevant, but you cannot tell what really happens from it. I prefer input from parents who actually have children in the school at the time since I know that administrations can *create* programs that actually are not well-implemented. Given how many schools have anti-bullying programs that mean nothing, I want first-hand information even if it is anecdotal. As an example, where I am now in the Houston area, the Katy schools are supposed to be great for special ed, but there have recently been several incidents of abuse of students who cannot verbally tell parents what happened. If it was not for teachers aides coming forward at risk of losing their jobs, we would not know what was going on. The Pearland schools where my grandson goes have worked well for him, but we have had children with other disabilities who had to fight to get simple accommodations and who eventually moved out of the district. Everything changes when you have a child with special needs. Of course, I can speak to my experience of the schools when my children attended, but that will not give anyone much information about those same schools today since they are now in their 40s.

[chet everett]

I certainly agree that first hand information from sources that are trustworthy is very valuable. No doubt the difficulty in getting that kind of information is a big reason why those sorts of questions do get asked here on city-data.com so often.

There is an enormous difficulty in seeing that initiatives in larger school districts are carried out in a uniform way, that is big part of why I recommend that parents try to seek out the smallest schools district they can when looking for the kinds of programs that are harder to implement. Special ed is especially difficult because of the legal requirements that go along with such programs.

There is just too much variability in any kind of anecdotal info to use that as more than a complement to more objective measures.

[kindrakindra]

Just wanted to point out for prosperity sake that GreatSchools is primarily data driven website. In addition to providing the Illinois School Report Card information in a user friendly format, it also allows parent reviews. One can rely on the data provided by that site without even reading the parent reviews.

[ChiNaan]

Originally Posted by kindrakindra

Just wanted to point out for prosperity sake that GreatSchools is primarily data driven website.

[kindrakindra]

Originally Posted by kindrakindra

Just wanted to point out for prosperity sake that GreatSchools is primarily data driven website. In addition to providing the Illinois School Report Card information in a user friendly format, it also allows parent reviews. One can rely on the data provided by that site without even reading the parent reviews.

You are right. I meant posterity.

[IAmEverywhere]

I agree that you have to be careful in interpreting comments on sites like GreatSchools. After all, they can't even verify whether a commenter is a student or a parent. A disgruntled, immature 15-year-old could claim to be a parent and bash their school for the fun of it.

However, when multiple commenters mention the same issue at a school, it's wise to pay attention.

Even some top-performing schools have issues which are potentially bad for anyone, such as above average amounts of drug use or bullying.