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Old 03-24-2015, 04:05 PM
 
4,152 posts, read 7,883,589 times
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Believe me many people are hoping the same thing. Keep in mind one thing, though your house is located in the far north east section of Berwyn and that are will be more diverse by the nature of its location. Also you might want to go to the website spot crime and sign up for alerts. I've done that and I am surprised at the little crime that comes across my alert. I'd say 98 pecent of the crime I have been alerted to is north of Roosevelt Rd and east of Austin. There are some threads on here about Oak Park, crime and policing....you might want to read those. I still don't quite understand how the suburbs keep crime down and you cross the street and its a different story.
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Old 03-24-2015, 11:51 PM
 
867 posts, read 1,365,106 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lifelongchicagoland View Post
I thought about what you said, and I appreciate that you saw my concerns as valid. You seemed to get the concern of a stable balanced area vs a changing for the worse one. Unfortunately, Chicagoland is a race focused region, and whether we like it or not, when an area becomes majority African American schools go downhill and business leave. It's a fact of life here, and I'm not willing to lose hard earned money and put my child through a bad school for the sake of "diversity". With that being said, Toria T's comments have really helped me put Berwyn in perspective again. I moved here for a beautiful home that was AFFORDABLE and CENTRALLY LOCATED. If I see signs of Berwyn losing ground, I'll be moving west to Lisle or Naperville, but hope that we can hold Berwyn together as a diverse, welcoming community where ALL races and ethnicities want to live, like Oak Park.
They become that way because whites flee which in turn leaves the door open for poor blacks to move in.

I swear it's like being too black is bad! A token amount makes you more comfortable?
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Old 03-25-2015, 11:54 AM
 
4,152 posts, read 7,883,589 times
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In fairness to the poster, lets face it the majority of black neighborhoods have crime problems and poor schools and services. Sad to say people are concerned but rightly so in many cases. But I would say wait to see what happens and what the neighbors are like. I met the lady that lived next door and she was black and was very nice. I haven't seen anything go down there that concerns me. I don't judge a book by its cover.
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Old 03-25-2015, 12:24 PM
 
62 posts, read 90,842 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Runuova View Post
They become that way because whites flee which in turn leaves the door open for poor blacks to move in.

I swear it's like being too black is bad! A token amount makes you more comfortable?
Is it irrational fear that drives whites to move away from blacks or is it legitimate concern for their family's safety based on a measurable pattern of black behavior? Its hard to argue with crime statistics and they point to the latter. Blacks make up about 33% of Chicago's population, yet in 2009 they committed 85% of the robberies, 68% of the aggravated assaults, 68% of the rapes, and 75% of the murders. Since I don't think one race is genetically inferior to another (there's no scientific evidence to back up this common racist claim), the problem has to be cultural. This is something that blacks as a whole need to seriously address or else they'll continue to be the fuel that feeds white flight and the ensuing blight that engulfs their own neighborhoods.
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Old 03-25-2015, 10:48 PM
 
867 posts, read 1,365,106 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OccidentExpress View Post
Is it irrational fear that drives whites to move away from blacks or is it legitimate concern for their family's safety based on a measurable pattern of black behavior? Its hard to argue with crime statistics and they point to the latter. Blacks make up about 33% of Chicago's population, yet in 2009 they committed 85% of the robberies, 68% of the aggravated assaults, 68% of the rapes, and 75% of the murders. Since I don't think one race is genetically inferior to another (there's no scientific evidence to back up this common racist claim), the problem has to be cultural. This is something that blacks as a whole need to seriously address or else they'll continue to be the fuel that feeds white flight and the ensuing blight that engulfs their own neighborhoods.
Yeah! I'll bring that up at our next meeting!
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Old 03-26-2015, 10:54 PM
 
Location: Near West Burbs
44 posts, read 133,693 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Runuova View Post
They become that way because whites flee which in turn leaves the door open for poor blacks to move in.

I swear its like being too black is bad! A token amount makes you more comfortable?
You're misconstruing my post. Let me break it down in simple terms.

1. There is a difference between CONSISTENT diversity (people of all races and ethnicities living side by side) versus one in which a COMPLETE RACE OR ETHNIC GROUP IS MOVING OUT and being replaced by another. Recent examples of this could include Lansing, South Holland, Matteson, and Richton Park.

2. I, as a homeowner and taxpayer, prefer to live in a DIVERSE area that includes many White families, as well as African-American, Hispanic, and Asian families.

3. Living here my entire life, I understand the negative trends a town experiences when a town trends more than 20-30% African American. It's not a matter of me wanting a "token amount", it's a matter of property values and general desirability of the community in question. A census is simply a momentary snapshot of what a community looks like, and 10 years can show a significant change in a town's make-up.

I guess my question to the public would be, why do whites flee? I know personally I WILL flee if I have to deal with constant graffiti, crime, rude people, and other general mayhem that has become a way of life a mile away from my house in Austin. I chose Berwyn because it seemed like it was improving, and I didn't know based on personal anecdotes and census data that there was a population increase in residents from Austin and Garfield Park. After the graffiti and children walking in the middle of the street and not moving, I was beginning to question my decision to move here.

I see I struck a nerve with some. In reality, I have honest concerns that other's may be too afraid to address for fear of being labeled "racist". I will continue to stand up for Berwyn, but I will not stay if these undesirable behaviors continue in my neighborhood. Life is too short and precious to deal with that.
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Old 03-26-2015, 10:55 PM
 
Location: Near West Burbs
44 posts, read 133,693 times
Reputation: 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by ToriaT View Post
In fairness to the poster, lets face it the majority of black neighborhoods have crime problems and poor schools and services. Sad to say people are concerned but rightly so in many cases. But I would say wait to see what happens and what the neighbors are like. I met the lady that lived next door and she was black and was very nice. I haven't seen anything go down there that concerns me. I don't judge a book by its cover.
Thanks, these were my concerns.
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Old 03-27-2015, 08:45 AM
 
867 posts, read 1,365,106 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lifelongchicagoland View Post
You're misconstruing my post. Let me break it down in simple terms.

1. There is a difference between CONSISTENT diversity (people of all races and ethnicities living side by side) versus one in which a COMPLETE RACE OR ETHNIC GROUP IS MOVING OUT and being replaced by another. Recent examples of this could include Lansing, South Holland, Matteson, and Richton Park.

2. I, as a homeowner and taxpayer, prefer to live in a DIVERSE area that includes many White families, as well as African-American, Hispanic, and Asian families.

3. Living here my entire life, I understand the negative trends a town experiences when a town trends more than 20-30% African American. It's not a matter of me wanting a "token amount", it's a matter of property values and general desirability of the community in question. A census is simply a momentary snapshot of what a community looks like, and 10 years can show a significant change in a town's make-up.

I guess my question to the public would be, why do whites flee? I know personally I WILL flee if I have to deal with constant graffiti, crime, rude people, and other general mayhem that has become a way of life a mile away from my house in Austin. I chose Berwyn because it seemed like it was improving, and I didn't know based on personal anecdotes and census data that there was a population increase in residents from Austin and Garfield Park. After the graffiti and children walking in the middle of the street and not moving, I was beginning to question my decision to move here.

I see I struck a nerve with some. In reality, I have honest concerns that other's may be too afraid to address for fear of being labeled "racist". I will continue to stand up for Berwyn, but I will not stay if these undesirable behaviors continue in my neighborhood. Life is too short and precious to deal with that.
Those towns go bad when people like you move out and allow the negative people to move in. I don't believe black people are inherently bad when more than 30% are grouped together. I believe any poor race of more than 30% can be a problem. Maybe I'm more sensitive to people using statistics to describe my race but you have to admit it's not an issue whites have to deal with.
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Old 03-27-2015, 09:21 AM
 
11,973 posts, read 31,657,538 times
Reputation: 4641
How should a black American respond to this type of thread? The idea that the mere presence of a certain number of black residents should cause alarm is really, really sad. Yet I am not naive enough to deny that this is exactly what happens.

The problem is that white Americans have little incentive to change things outside of the "goodness of their hearts", and plenty of incentive to continue "white flight" and de facto redlining as long as even a hint of negative attitudes towards black people remain. Let's pretend that a white person exists with no racial bias whatsoever, but lives in a community that is experiencing white flight (I don't believe this person exists, but play along for the sake of this argument). Other white Americans with greater racial bias begin to panic and move out, driving down real estate prices. So now, even the white person with NO racial bias is incentivized to move out before his largest asset, his home, drops in price to the point that it is a severe financial problem for his family. If he stays put for the "greater social good", he is penalized.

The key here is that white people and their attitudes are driving the "white flight" phenomenon, not black residents moving in. And unfortunately it's just one more way that America continues to punish "blackness" through subtle racism. It doesn't take much to create a negative attitude about a place, and Chicagoland is so large and offers so many alternate locations with similar amenities that there is little disincentive against moving.
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Old 03-27-2015, 10:13 AM
 
Location: Chicago, Tri-Taylor
5,014 posts, read 9,402,081 times
Reputation: 3987
It also occurs when Hispanics move in too. Don't kid yourself, whites moved from Berwyn and have declined to move to Berwyn because of this demographic group too. Ask anyone who lived there during the 1990s and 2000s.

The subterfuge, IMHO, is the schools. Whites can justify moving out or declining to move there because of the schools and not feel racist. They're doing it for their kids after all, right?

The only way to solve it is to get rid of that incentive, such as by creating borderless integrated school systems.
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