How can Chicago keep residents long-term? (Winnetka, Paris: low income, crime, homes)

[emathias]

There are hundreds of thousands of affordable homes in the City.

What the city needs to get people to move to those homes is get gangs under control and provide realistic schooling options. People who want a $150,000 bungalow know they can't afford that in Naperville, either, so the schools don't have to be perfect or even significantly above average, they just need to be capable of providing a decent, safe education. Improving transportation into those areas would be good, too, for example adding some "L" service along existing non-passenger rail corridors

[Vlajos]

Originally Posted by emathias

There are hundreds of thousands of affordable homes in the City.

What the city needs to get people to move to those homes is get gangs under control and provide realistic schooling options. People who want a $150,000 bungalow know they can't afford that in Naperville, either, so the schools don't have to be perfect or even significantly above average, they just need to be capable of providing a decent, safe education.

This

[ParkerP]

Originally Posted by emathias

There are hundreds of thousands of affordable homes in the City.

What the city needs to get people to move to those homes is get gangs under control and provide realistic schooling options. People who want a $150,000 bungalow know they can't afford that in Naperville, either, so the schools don't have to be perfect or even significantly above average, they just need to be capable of providing a decent, safe education. Improving transportation into those areas would be good, too, for example adding some "L" service along existing non-passenger rail corridors

Exactly. They don't need to build more homes on the north side. There's plenty of single family housing on the south and west sides that don't and won't get considered until the city truly focuses on improving these areas.

[chet everett]

It is nuts to think that developers and even regular old home owners that routinely see buyers JUMPING OUT OF THEIR SKIN to buy places well above $300K but under about $700K would scale all the way down to $150... That sort of target price is really more likely to happen in parts of Chicago that are currentlu overrun with crime AND?OR so far from anything "happening" that they are completely off the radar...

I think the issue of affordability is certainly possible The era of HUGE sprawling lots way in the country is largely incompatable with the realities of long commutes and high fuel costs. The appeal of well designed homes of moderate size and just enough outdoor space for little kids to play in a protected area, families to enjoy summer cookouts and pet owners to let their dogs and cats sniff around the yard can be achieved for reasonable prices IF there is appropriate encouragement to keep things in scale and allow for some more modern building technologies. I think some of this is part of the MSI "green demonstration home" but that thing would likely push well past $500K Museum of Science and Industry | Smart Home: Green + Wired ...


As to schools there are two approaches that make a lot of sense. The book by Jacqueline Edelberg about what steps she and her neighbors followed to turn Nettlehorst from a pretty awful school into a model for parent and teacher cooperation is laid out in "How to Walk to School" -- How to Walk to School: Blueprint for a Neighborhood School Renaissance: Jacqueline Edelberg with Susan Kurland

But what happens when you don't have enough parents with college backgrounds / committed to getting crummmy school overhauled AND you have the CTU that really really really really really has shown just how stubborn they are when it comes to giving up control of teacher retention based on just years of seniority? Well the latest book by Dianne Ravitch lays out a pretty good analysis of why many efforts of reform do not work. She is a "radical centrist" -- earned a PhD not in education but in the History of Education, served BOTH Bill Clinton & George H.W. Bush. She offers a strong argumment that too many efforts to promote total "selective admissions" and "all stick, no carrot" type national standards have worsened conditions in many disadvantaged schools. Theese schools probably would benefit from a true "try whatever you can / just get the kids involved" approach that would hand over control of these "failing" schools to the charter schools so that kids in the most impoversed areas are not held hostage by dysfunctional organizaed labor policies and then work their successe back into the system -- The Death and Life of the Great American School System: How Testing and Choice Are Undermining Education: Diane Ravitch

[Vlajos]

Originally Posted by ParkerP

Exactly. They don't need to build more homes on the north side. There's plenty of single family housing on the south and west sides that don't and won't get considered until the city truly focuses on improving these areas.

Who is they?

[ParkerP]

Originally Posted by Vlajos

Who is they?

I think op or somebody mentioned developers building more affordable housing on the north side. That's the they I'm referring to

[Vlajos]

Originally Posted by ParkerP

I think op or somebody mentioned developers building more affordable housing on the north side. That's the they I'm referring to

Ok, but developers are private parties and can buy and do as they please within zoning (or get it changed). They follow the demand (or as they perceive demand).

[Attrill]

There are plenty of affordable single family homes in safe neighborhoods. Avondale was brought up in the Logan Square thread that's currently going, and it's a perfect example of a neighborhood where you can find an affordable SFH with good transportation options. There are plenty of neighborhoods that offer the same along the Orange line as well. These aren't in areas with Lincoln Park or Wicker Park level nightlife, but there are plenty of entertainment options within the neighborhoods, with many more available via CTA or cab.

Anyways, for families nightlife is not on the top of the priority list. What is very high on a list of priorities is commute times. One of the toughest things for my wife and I is juggling our work schedules to pick our daughter up from school - and that's just 15 minutes from the Loop and our home (via CTA or car, 30 minutes on foot). If you have two parents working in the Loop who have to juggle getting kids to and from school the last thing you want to throw into that mix is a commute on the Eisenhower or Edens. Even Metra poses problems any time there's a thunder or snow storm.

Originally Posted by chet everett

But what happens when you don't have enough parents with college backgrounds / committed to getting crummmy school overhauled AND you have the CTU that really really really really really has shown just how stubborn they are when it comes to giving up control of teacher retention based on just years of seniority?

Right now the lack of committed parents is not an issue. Cluster magnets are a great solution that keeps the concept of a neighborhood school, but also allows schools to pull in committed parents from anywhere in the city (with a preference for students within 2 miles of the school). Nettlehorst is a great example, and is one that is being replicated at dozens of schools right now. While I think you're right that there aren't enough parents to solve CPS's larger performance issues as a whole, there are enough parents to create good CPS schools for gentrifying neighborhoods. Dozens of schools are at various stages of following the Nettlehorst example - i.e. Ravenswood, Drummond, Audubon, Burley, Pulaski, Burr, Goethe, Blaine, Hamilton, Prescott, Coonley, Stockton, Brentano....and plenty more.

I have no idea why you think CTU is doing anything to obstruct Nettlehorst-type changes in schools - what do you think they're doing that interferes with parents trying to improve schools? I've been working to help my daughter's schools for the last four years and I have never once encountered any problems with teachers or the CTU. In fact, teachers at her school helped me build furniture for the school over the summer and with the principal they lugged it all over to the school. I also belong to a number of email lists and discussion boards for parents who working on fixing up CPS elementary schools, and again, no complaints about CTU or teachers in general. The complaints that I see are about CPS administration and some LSCs. I've had a few problems with CPS administration, nothing horrendous, but they have some policies in place about facilities and fundraising that can be tough to navigate. Frequently the best work that gets done is when parents, teachers, and principals ignore CPS policies and CPS just looks the other way.

[Chi-town Native]

I no longer can take any opinions about CPS seriously from those who don't have kids in the system or who aren't teaching there.

I don't mean this as an insult to folks like Chet, I just think the entire system has dramatically changed in the past 10 years, at least on the North Side (*not saying it hasn't on the South, but I'm not there so I don't know). A lot of complaints which were legitimate 10 years ago just are no longer fair critiques.

[IAmEverywhere]

It's possible to buy a decent SFH in a suburban area with excellent schools, very low crime and Metra access to the city for less than $200K. The prices get even lower for families willing to consider townhomes, condos, apartments and/or areas with substantial but manageable crime.

Given that, why would a family put up with average schools just to be in the city?

And I actually don't agree that schools that are average (in the sense of being at roughly the 50th percentile) are adequate. The quality of education is so poor in the USA that schools which are average in a relative sense, are actually quite mediocre in an absolute sense.