Chicago Reaches 500 Homicides (Lee, Detroit: construction, safety, education)

[ChiNaan]

Originally Posted by Chicago South Sider

Still, Chicago has the most murders of any city in this country and that's a pretty dubious destinction.

Agreed. It's not something to be proud of, and it would be nice if our murder rate could be more like New York's or L.A.'s, though short of national reform that would probably need to involve massive gentrification that pushes more of the poor into the suburbs, as in NYC. (I'm not sure about LA.) That's probably not going to happen anytime soon, nor does it really solve the larger problem when it does happen, unless you're a "NIMBY" type.

It would be even nicer if we had the rates of Honolulu, Seattle, or San Diego.

It would be worse if we had the rates of New Orleans, Detroit, Baltimore, or St. Louis.

Instead, we have a rate about like Houston, Memphis, Tulsa, Miami, Atlanta, and Pittsburgh. Not the best, not the worst, but pretty middle-of-the-road by the standards of cities in our gun-obsessed nation. It's that larger problem that needs to be addressed much more than any local one, but as I recall you're not a fan of addressing the gun problem, so I guess you'll have to tolerate high murder rates in U.S. cities.

[ChiNaan]

By the way, not that it really matters, but for the sake of factual accuracy, Chicago is much smaller than Hong Kong and approximately the same size as Toronto, according to the most recent census figures from Wikipedia.

Hong Kong 7.06 mil (2010)
Chicago 2.69 mil (2010)
Toronto 2.62 mil (2011)

[jonnynonos]

I'm really not sure how you're going to stop warring gangs over the multi-billion dollar drug trade.

The idea of getting weapons out of their hands is preposterous. With so much money at stake it is just not realistic to think you are going to keep semi-automatic and automatic weapons out of the hands of career criminals. Even if you somehow managed to purge the rest of the population of these weapons, people like this could and would find them.

The breakdown of the traditional family structure and religion has been disastrous in impoverished communities.

People used to be ashamed to be divorced. Now they are not ashamed of anything.

[Chicago South Sider]

Originally Posted by ChiNaan

By the way, not that it really matters, but for the sake of factual accuracy, Chicago is much smaller than Hong Kong and approximately the same size as Toronto, according to the most recent census figures from Wikipedia.

Hong Kong 7.06 mil (2010)
Chicago 2.69 mil (2010)
Toronto 2.62 mil (2011)

Hong Kong is a bit different. The city and metro are pretty much one and the same. It's also super-dense and very small geographically. And Tornoto IS smaller even if not by much.

[ChiNaan]

Originally Posted by jonnynonos

The breakdown of the traditional family structure and religion has been disastrous in impoverished communities.

You must be kidding. The U.S. is one of the most religiously-obsessed nations in the world. We're the top of that ladder in the First World, except possibly for Ireland, unless you want to count the wealthier Middle Eastern theocracies as "first world." If decline in religion caused murder, the rates in Western Europe would be off the charts.

[ChiNaan]

Originally Posted by Chicago South Sider

Hong Kong is a bit different. The city and metro are pretty much one and the same. It's also super-dense and very small geographically. And Tornoto IS smaller even if not by much.

Metro area populations:

Hong Kong 15.8 mil
Chicago 9.5 mil
Toronto 5.8 mil

I still don't see what this has to do with anything, though. It's murder rate that matters. That's what determines how dangerous an area is (or, specifically, how likely you are to be murdered there, all things equal). That applies regardless of the population of any city or area. In murder rate, U.S. cities are nearly all horrible, and Chicago's is bad but not one of the worst. We have a national problem, and Chicago is a small part of it.

[Chicago South Sider]

Originally Posted by ChiNaan

Instead, we have a rate about like Houston, Memphis, Tulsa, Miami, Atlanta, and Pittsburgh. Not the best, not the worst, but pretty middle-of-the-road by the standards of cities in our gun-obsessed nation. It's that larger problem that needs to be addressed much more than any local one, but as I recall you're not a fan of addressing the gun problem, so I guess you'll have to tolerate high murder rates in U.S. cities.

I support the Second Amendment and the right to bear arms. IMO, it's really too late to do anything about guns in this country. In this country money is everything and there are already more than 300 million in circulation. If you ban guns then all that does is create a much larger black market for them, driving up prices. I guess you think that the so-called 'War on Drugs' has been a success, huh?

The problem isn't really guns, it's people. This country has a strong culture of sex and violence that isn't going anywhere. Plus, people are extremely weak-minded around here. So, whether, you like it or not, nothing will really change even if guns are banned. Just the mention of banning guns has caused a spike in purchases. It is what it is. Keep up the hope though. lol

[Chicago South Sider]

Originally Posted by ChiNaan

Metro area populations:

Hong Kong 15.8 mil
Chicago 9.5 mil
Toronto 5.8 mil

Still don't see what this has to do with anything, though. It's murder rate that matters. That's what determines how dangerous an area is (or, specifically, how likely you are to be murdered there, all things equal). That applies regardless of the population of any city or area.

Where did you get that 15.8 milion population for Hong Kong? That must be including Shenzen which is an entirely different metro. Plus, Toronto is a little larger than 5.8 million. Even the urbanzed area has a little over 6 million.

[Just1Fan]

Originally Posted by nana053

too many good law-abiding black people are afraid of both the police and the gangs.

You are correct. And, I think many of us understand why they would be afraid of gangs - but, afraid of police? It has always been my belief that most people, who live in the ghetto, feel the police are unreliable. Elderly blacks can still remember being beaten by policeman, attacked by police dogs, and sprayed with fire hoses, simply for taking a stand against racial discrimination. And, even as we speak, blacks continue to be victims of racial profiling. So, given those circumstances, I'm not surprised by the fact some people would rather take matters into their own hands, then call a potentially crooked officer, whose main objective isn't to help, but to lock them up and abuse them. All a cop needs is a warrant for someones arrest, an obstruction of justice, or someone resisting an officer, and out comes the silver bracelets. Blacks have had it with calling 911, only to see the victim, the complainant, or potential witnesses go to jail, while the suspects walk.

[ChiNaan]

Originally Posted by Chicago South Sider

Where did you get that 15.8 milion population fro Hong Kong? That must be including Shenzen which is an entirely different metro.

I suggest you start a separate thread in City-Data Hong Kong if you want to debate the boundaries of their metro area. I couldn't care less, because it has nothing to do with this topic, but numerous sources identify Shenzen as part of it. Feel free to Google.

Originally Posted by Chicago South Sider

Plus, Toronto is a little larger than 5.8 million.

We're both wrong. It was 5.6 in their 2011 census. (I mistyped.) Speaking of Googling:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...reas_in_Canada