Chicago Turning into a Tale of Two Cities (Washington, Atlanta: find a job, minimum wage)

[emathias]

Originally Posted by TheBigGeo08

Chicago is just Detroit trying to cover itself up by constructing a bunch of towers in the Loop and north side.

Another way to put that statement is this:

Chicago is just Detroit except with a lot of economic activity and very strong growth in the center.

Except that's pretty much the opposite of Detroit - Detroit may have some growth in the middle, but it's nowhere near as strong as Chicago's.

[dlong1991]

Originally Posted by Link N. Parker

I definitely agree with legalization of marijuana and I support that as a solution 100%.

Haven't participated in this forum much...but what's with all the libertarian hate? Although I did enjoy the joke about Libertarians being conservatives that want to smoke pot and get laid. True, but I think some people are missing the point.

Gangs are fueled by drug sales. Take away their trade, and the gangs will disappear. Some folks say they are doing it because economy this, jobs that, blah blah blah. Bottom line is, it's quick and easy money, and that's all they saw growing up. We are only human, and we all give into temptation. Why wouldn't you behave that way if you were raised around it?

If drugs were legal, and some guy robbed me who I was going to buy some pot from, I could just call the cops on the guy...after all I know everything about his business. But since drugs are currently illegal, and no one can go to the authorities to report these things like getting robbed or ripped off...I am going to employ street justice!

Plus, if we didn't have such a bad drug/gang problem...we would be able to retain the transplants and millenial kids who are moving into the city on there own. Most of them flee back to the suburbs when they settle down with a wife and kids...this city could be full of affordable single family houses for young professionals on a modest budget, paying taxes, and helping the city out.

[oakparkdude]

Originally Posted by dlong1991

Gangs are fueled by drug sales. Take away their trade, and the gangs will disappear. Some folks say they are doing it because economy this, jobs that, blah blah blah. Bottom line is, it's quick and easy money, and that's all they saw growing up. We are only human, and we all give into temptation. Why wouldn't you behave that way if you were raised around it?

If drugs were legalized, gangs wouldn't completely disappear, but you'd probably remove 95% of their profit. Historically gangs in Chicago relied on prostitution, extortion, gambling, etc, but largely abandoned those enterprises for the vastly more lucrative drug trade. Without the hyper-profits of the drug trade, they'd be less incentive to be in a gang and less money to purchase firearms. It wouldn't completely turn around the bad neighborhoods. They'd still be poor and lacking in jobs and services, but at least the level of violence would be decreased, which, of course, is a necessary precursor for other positive developments.

Actually, now that gambling is legal and widely available that's one lessavenue of business they could engage in. What's left, prostitution? Auto theft?

[Chi-town Native]

Originally Posted by oakparkdude

If drugs were legalized, gangs wouldn't completely disappear, but you'd probably remove 95% of their profit. Historically gangs in Chicago relied on prostitution, extortion, gambling, etc, but largely abandoned those enterprises for the vastly more lucrative drug trade. Without the hyper-profits of the drug trade, they'd be less incentive to be in a gang and less money to purchase firearms.

Actually, now that gambling is legal and widely available that's one lessavenue of business they could engage in. What's left, prostitution? Auto theft?

Graft/corruption related to fixing and padding government contracts are incredibly profitable, and that's where the Outfit went after Prohibition ended.

I don't think anyone believes that some mid-level Gangsteer Disciple suddenly decides to pursue a law degree if drugs are legalized, but it does immediately remove the incentive to stand around all day slinging on a street corner, which is what has the unintended side effects to society of people feeling trapped in their homes, kids not being able to walk safely to school, drive-by shootings, etc.

You gotta go after the low-hanging fruit. In the case of street gangs and what keeps them thriving, it's the drug trade. It's those profits that enable the hiring of loads of little shorties as lookouts, runners, etc., as well as bribing jail guards, cops, politicians (direct bribes and campaign contributions and "street muscle" on election day), etc.

[ptug101]

1. legalize drugs
2. reform welfare cut foodstamps section 8 assitance by 50% and use that money to give a flat rate EITC(basic income)
that does not increase when you have children
3. Increase law enforcement by 300% use aerial drones for surveillance enforce anti lottering laws
4.suspend the minimum wage in the ghettos so they can compete with automation and foreign workers
back up their wages with EITC.
5. huge investment in infrastructure

7.make college education free, I can watch Harvard lectures on youtube for free why is college tuition an issue

[urza216]

Originally Posted by ptug101

1. legalize drugs
2. reform welfare cut foodstamps section 8 assitance by 50% and use that money to give a flat rate EITC(basic income)
that does not increase when you have children
3. Increase law enforcement by 300% use aerial drones for surveillance enforce anti lottering laws
4.suspend the minimum wage in the ghettos so they can compete with automation and foreign workers
back up their wages with EITC.
5. huge investment in infrastructure

7.make college education free, I can watch Harvard lectures on youtube for free why is college tuition an issue

Please explain how making life harder for poor people will cause a reduction in crime.

[williepotatoes]

Originally Posted by urza216

Please explain how making life harder for poor people will cause a reduction in crime.

Yeah, I don't get that one either. Not increasing a stipend for extra children, only hurts the child. What you save in benefits you'll pay out in DCFS costs later. Not to mention the fact that it's also cruel and inhumane.

[Chicagoist123]

Originally Posted by urza216

Please explain how making life harder for poor people will cause a reduction in crime.

I am sorry but I agree with ptug. I believe there should be a safety net for people, but the way it is now it's just being abused. People live off welfare for decades because they know they can.

Where I grew up, many neighbors were illegal aliens. Meaning most of them were making less than minimum wage and to make a living for their families, they lived together with extended families and worked like crazy. But they made it work and they didn't have to live off the government. They worked and supported each other through family. If it meant cleaning houses on the weekend then that is what it took. Easy life? No. So if an illigeal immigrant can make it just fine, then a fully fledged citizen can to. I am not saying it is easy, but damn, you have to start somewhere.

I don't care what anybody says, but the U.S. is the a place you can really make it on your own. You just have to have the determination and independce and work EXTREMELY hard. Too many people on welfare don't work hard because they know they don't have to.

I say a person can have welfare for up to 5 years and then that's it. No more. After that on your own. 5 years is plenty of time to get a job and become fully independent.

[Chicagoist123]

Originally Posted by Aleking

libertarians really are the worst

Says someone who is not libertarian. Just like a democrat may say a republican is the worst, or a republican say a democrat is the worst. All depends what group you in. But at the end of the day you can't prove your party's views are correct and better than vice versa. It's just people's personal perspectives and beliefs.

Politics is essentially like religion. Believe what you want to but at the end of the day you can't prove you are right.

[urza216]

Originally Posted by Chicagoist123

I am sorry but I agree with ptug. I believe there should be a safety net for people, but the way it is now it's just being abused. People live off welfare for decades because they know they can.

Where I grew up, many neighbors were illegal aliens. Meaning most of them were making less than minimum wage and to make a living for their families, they lived together with extended families and worked like crazy. But they made it work and they didn't have to live off the government. They worked and supported each other through family. If it meant cleaning houses on the weekend then that is what it took. Easy life? No. So if an illigeal immigrant can make it just fine, then a fully fledged citizen can to. I am not saying it is easy, but damn, you have to start somewhere.

I don't care what anybody says, but the U.S. is the a place you can really make it on your own. You just have to have the determination and independce and work EXTREMELY hard. Too many people on welfare don't work hard because they know they don't have to.

I say a person can have welfare for up to 5 years and then that's it. No more. After that on your own. 5 years is plenty of time to get a job and become fully independent.

Capitalism needs poverty to function. If everyone was "fully independent" than those low-paying jobs would no longer be done..