Reflection of a Two Year Transplant (For Outsiders) (Chicago, Westchester: vs., stats)

[Heyooooo]

PA Born, youre madly obsessed with Upstate NY and Western NY being Midwestern.

Even when I have seen people from Michigan, Illinois and Ohio themselves on here tell you in the General US subforum, that Buffalo and Rochester are different culturally. They are transitional areas.

Its obvious your outsider POV is not valid because you drove through these cities once, or whatever you did.

Buffalo and Rochester are extremely Italian (even if they share Poles and Germans, guess what, Utica has a **** ton of Poles as well, West Utica), and identify much more so than anywhere else in the Midwest, save for maybe Chicago.

Where are all the Italian neighborhoods in Chicago? Dying off? There seems to be nothing within the city. Its all in the suburbs now, and any Italian influence is largely mitigated. Its nothing like it used to be.

Thats not the case in the Northeast where cities in Upstate NY, Boston, NYC, Providence, Philly and NJ are much better at maintaining their Italian neighborhoods, presence and history.

[PA Born]

Originally Posted by Heyooooo

Puerto Ricans?

Puerto Ricans in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Connecticut - 7.1%
New York - 5.5%
New Jersey - 4.9%
Florida - 4.5%
Massachusetts - 4.1%
Rhode Island - 3.3%
Hawaii - 3.2%
Pennsylvania - 2.9%
Delaware - 2.5
USA - 1.5
Illinois is 1.4%
..........
........
.... Ohio .8%


Theres a reason why I said Italians, Irish and Puerto Ricans. By percentage, Upstate NY (which is tied right along to the rest of the Northeast), has the highest percentage/amount in the country.


The most outside of the dominant region for these three ancestries is Chicago. Chicago has everything.

Heyooo, you're not paying attention to the posts.

No one said that NY State is Midwest. Hell, no one said that Upstate NY is Midwest.

So why are you posting statewide % of Puerto Ricans? What does that have to do with the conversation? You know full well that the bulk of NY State population is downstate. There are more Puerto Ricans in 2% of the state than the other 98%.

The fact is that there are more Puerto Ricans in Chicago than in Buffalo, or Rochester. There are more Puerto Ricans in Cleveland too. I have no idea why you think Buffalo isn't a Great Lakes city, or why referring to ethnic %, someone would reach a different conclusion.

[Heyooooo]

Originally Posted by PA Born

Heyooo, you're not paying attention to the posts.

No one said that NY State is Midwest. Hell, no one said that Upstate NY is Midwest.

So why are you posting statewide % of Puerto Ricans? What does that have to do with the conversation? You know full well that the bulk of NY State population is downstate.

The population split between Upstate and Downstate is 40/60.

7.5 million out of the 19 million are in Upstate. The remaining 11.5 are Downstate.


Why am I posting about PR? Because I was initially talking about them with Italians and Irish. All three ancestries are major parts of the identity of Upstate/Western NY cities, including Buffalo and Rochester.

[PA Born]

Originally Posted by Heyooooo

PA Born, youre madly obsessed with Upstate NY and Western NY being Midwestern.

Sorry, I lived Upstate. And no one is agreeing with you.

You're not even agreeing with yourself. No one said that Buffalo is exactly the same as Chicago. But, taken as a whole, it makes more sense to group Great Lakes cities with one another, rather than cities like NYC or Boston, which are 7-8 hours away.

And, yeah, obviously there are differences with everything. Buffalo isn't even that similar to Rochester. We are talking in broad generalities here. You think it makes sense to group Buffalo with Boston and NYC, we think it makes sense to group it with other Great Lakes cities.

Also, you seem to have some anti-Midwest bias, like it's "bad" to be associated with the Midwest. I actually prefer Upstate (by quite a bit) to most parts of the Midwest. It's generally much more beautiful and historic, IMO, But, culturally and economically the Western parts seem closer to other Great Lakes cities, and not Atlantic Ocean cities.

[Heyooooo]

I guess because Buffalo and Rochester say pop with nasally accents and are slightly more Polish than Italian and Irish, theyre more Midwestern.

Or something.

I dont know. Thats really the only leg youre standing on by saying theyre Midwestern.

Great Lakes =/= Midwestern.

Upstate NY is Great Lakes, and not Midwestern in any sense.

Its a transitional area, especially Buffalo.

[PA Born]

Originally Posted by Heyooooo

The population split between Upstate and Downstate is 40/60.

7.5 million out of the 19 million are in Upstate. The remaining 11.5 are Downstate.


Why am I posting about PR? Because I was initially talking about them with Italians and Irish. All three ancestries are major parts of the identity of Upstate/Western NY cities, including Buffalo and Rochester.

This isn't true, unless you count Upstate as "everything in NY State except for NYC and Long Island".

Upstate has roughly 30% of the state population. 70% of the state population lies within the NYC CSA, and adjacent areas (Hudson Valley, Catskills, and the like) are culturally more connected to downstate.

And, no Puerto Ricans aren't a major part of the Western NY population. There are 20,000 PR in Buffalo, and like 2 million in metropolitan NYC.

[PA Born]

Originally Posted by Heyooooo

I guess because Buffalo and Rochester say pop with nasally accents and are slightly more Polish than Italian and Irish, theyre more Midwestern.

Or something.

Or they're both on the Great Lakes.
Or they're both flat.
Or they both have the same weather.
Or they both have the same flora/fauna.
Or they both have the same heavy industry.
Or they both share the Canadian frontier.
Or they both were developed during the same era.
Or they both have similar architectural style.
Or they both have similar population trends.
Or they both have similar economic trends.

But, yeah, can't think of much else...

[Heyooooo]

Originally Posted by PA Born

This isn't true, unless you count Upstate as "everything in NY State except for NYC and Long Island".

Upstate has roughly 30% of the state population. 70% of the state population lies within the NYC CSA, and adjacent areas (Hudson Valley, Catskills, and the like) are culturally more connected to downstate.

And, no Puerto Ricans aren't a major part of the Western NY population. There are 20,000 PR in Buffalo, and like 2 million in metropolitan NYC.

I dont.




Its roughly 7-7.5 million vs. 11.5-12 million.

There are 8 million in NYC. LI and lower Hudson Valley counties account for the remaining 3.5-4 million.

[nap1313]

Ugh. I was reading a nice, courteous, even-tempered conversation on the pros and cons of Chicago for transplants. Now it's devolved into arguing about upstate New York and whether it's northeastern or not. And on the Chicago forum, nonetheless.

[ChiNaan]

Originally Posted by Heyooooo

Western NY is not Upstate NY.

No, but it's the part that everyone is telling you is culturally similar to the Midwest, and your map provided further evidence of that.

I haven't seen anyone here say that all of Upstate NY is like the Midwest, so I'm not sure who you're arguing with if you think that's the argument.