A Brit possibly moving to Chicago - Should I? (Paris: crime rates, neighborhoods)

[Maintainschaos]

Originally Posted by chet everett

Chicago named 7th most expensive city -- in the world - Chicago Tribune

I consider myself more realistic than most of the young folks that make it their job to serve as cheerleaders , papering over the well covered negatives of Chicago.

Would I choose an opportunity to work in NYC, San Francisco, Paris, Sydney, Singapore etc over Chicago? In a heartbeat.

Cleveland, Dallas, Miami, Johannesburg, Bejing? Not so much...

Of course that report, as it states in the article, does not include rent or housing; were it to, Chicago would be nowhere up there, and anyone who has lived in more expensive cities just in the U.S. knows so, let alone a place like Tokyo.

The article cited a main reason Chicago was ranked so high was high cost of clothing comparatively. Sure it falls under goods and services, but not sure many people would put much weight in that category.

[eureka1]

I seriously doubt that this is a legitimate post from the OP. If the OP were a British national with sufficient experience and education to be posted to several other countries, he /she would know the difference between faze/phase and advice/advise. Hope it IS legit because you folks have spent considerable time answering his/her inquiries.

[jwuk45]

Chicago isn't even in the top 10 for most expensive cities in the US, let alone the world.

Cost of clothing? I've never heard something so ridiculous.

[GYmariner]

Originally Posted by eureka1

I seriously doubt that this is a legitimate post from the OP. If the OP were a British national with sufficient experience and education to be posted to several other countries, he /she would know the difference between faze/phase and advice/advise. Hope it IS legit because you folks have spent considerable time answering his/her inquiries.

My apologies for my bad English and grammar, but yes I'm genuine and it is a genuine post.
Although in English 'Phase' can be applied in the sense in which I wrote.
That's in 'English' - not 'American' - which is not actually a language!
What you have done with the English language is you're fault :-)

But anyway the 'advice' and insights from everybody is much appreciated.
Many thanks.

[GYmariner]

Originally Posted by chet everett

Chicago was recently ranked as one of top ten mostly costly global cities, so that ought to be huge part of your decisions - how well will your compensation allow you, and your family, to live?

Chicago has what are arguably the most inequitable schools in any U.S. urban area - if your daughter is fortunate enough to test into the state supported schools with a dedicated group of parents and motivated classmates she could have a wonderful experience at nearly no cost. The admissions are based on a variable scale that attempts to incorporate location / race / socio-economic factors. If you don't win admissions to a school / program with good situation, the majority of Chicago's Public Schools are abysmal. The physical boundaries are other capricious and subject to modification only after overcrowding is unbearable. The alternative, parents financed private schools, can range from perhaps under $10:/yr to 3x that, a substantial hit on even the most generous wages.

Chicago is, in other ways a rather perplexing city. The relative pleasantness of well to do areas like Lincoln Park is jarringly contrasted against the violence, lack of opportunity, and mundaneness of areas just a short bus ride away. The costs imposed to cover years of financial mismanagement mean ridiculous traffic control via photo tickets, endless parking fines, reduced transit service and constant tax hikes.

The crime rate Is numerically abhorrent, yet the statistics paint a picture that shows enormous disparity between affluent areas and those plagued by decades of job losses / business abandonment.

The influence of drunken young college grads on the some neighborhoods makes for an interesting clash between families with kids and idiots that move here seemingly exclusively to get drunk and laid. Hardly the "city of light". Yet we do have some fantastic cultural features - truly unmatched Chicago Symphony Orchestra, gorgeous architecture, incredibly accessible collections of fine arts, a huge range of live theatre, top tier universities, cutting edge medicine, financial firms of global importance...

Before making any decisions I would recommend talking to colleagues that have spent extended time here. Ideally both those that have lived in the nicer areas (including suburbs) with kids and not just singles. Weigh the risks against the benefits, things like easy communication and generally speedy commuter rail vs everything from depressingly long winter to segregation / disparity. Spend at least some time here, even if only on a weekend vacation. Judge the opportunity for yourself and your family.

Chet, firstly thanks for your reply. Can I ask as you have given a very thorough and candid viewpoint, in rather simplistic terms, how does Chicago rate alongside London, New York for example? You may or may not have lived in these cities but I'm guessing you are fairy well traveled. - I know London and love it and everything about it, but meander in to the wrong area at the wrong time and it is easy to get sliced up! So I'm not totally naive. However America does have a fondness for guns and Chicago doesn't sound to me as integrated as London is. London is a truly multi-cultural, cosmopolitan city - certainly not without it's problems but I don't want to live in a white, middle-class enclave - unable to venture beyond my neighbourhood. Are you are suggesting Chicago is something like Cape Town - great city but only in the right areas?

[jwuk45]

London has more crime overall, but the worst neighborhoods of Chicago are a bit worse than the worst ones of London in terms of murders. It's not hard to figure out which areas to avoid in Chicago though, harder in London as areas are more jumbled together.

[marothisu]

Originally Posted by GYmariner

Is the crime rate high? Is it a cosmopolitan city? Best areas to live?

It's a tale of two cities. There's parts of town that are pretty unsafe, but then there's another large part of town which is pretty safe for an urban city in the US. You'll often hear of sides like the north side, south side, and west side. Typically the most crime occurs on the south and west side, but it's not like all areas of those are bad. The north side is relatively pretty damn safe, though there's a few areas that are kind of sketchy sometimes. I've heard many visitors come to Chicago and hearing the media talk about the crime in some areas and kind of shocked at how safe it seems. The crime is kind of separated - happens everywhere, but the rates in the desirable neighborhoods are relatively pretty low.

Is it cosmopolitan? Depends on where you are. Some parts like downtown definitely can be and and other parts (like a dangerous part of town or a town that's obsessed with sports) might not be. You'll find cosmopolitan things mixed into other neighborhoods. I can name a handful of good cocktail places in more hip and alternative neighborhoods for example. Less cosmopolitan than a Manhattan on average for sure or San Francisco on average, but there's still plenty of cosmopolitan things. It's not like you'll have trouble finding where to get a good cocktail. These types of options in Chicago, just like in a lot of cities in the US, are increasing still too.

Best parts of town to live from the perspective of things to do and safety would be downtown area (i.e. Loop, River North, Streeterville, Gold Coast, South Loop, West Loop), Old Town, Lincoln Park, Wicker Park, Ukrainian Village, Bucktown, Lakeview, Edgewater in parts, Lincoln Square/Ravenswood, North Center/Roscoe Village, parts of Logan Square, Hyde Park, University Village, etc. Then there are other good but quieter areas like Jefferson Park, Edison Park, Norwood Park, Beverly, Mount Greenwood, Bridgeport, etc.

Here's some images of the more desirable areas of town:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e5U7CpERtM8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vpaPYtM_RKw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zSUOFEJRSbs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pfjBp37qHSo

[marothisu]

Originally Posted by chet everett

Chicago named 7th most expensive city -- in the world - Chicago Tribune

The issue with this link is that it doesn't factor in housing, which is the majority of someone's costs in an expensive city. Chicago is relatively expensive, but if housing were factored into it, it wouldn't even be close to the top 10. The pure fact that Singapore for example is not listed above Chicago as more expensive is a mere joke. Yes, even the food is more expensive there. Chicago is not cheap, relatively, but it's not in the top 10 most expensive places in the world or even close. I can name at least 5 in the US that are more expensive.

The cost of clothing was factored into this. The US in pretty much every city doesn't really have cheap clothing unless you're shopping at Kohl's, Target, Wal Mart, etc.

[GYmariner]

Putting aside education, crime, social equality, transportation, health etc.
Is a deep pan 'Chicago' pizza better than a 'New York / Italian' thin and crispy?

[Londoncowboy30]

Originally Posted by GYmariner

Putting aside education, crime, social equality, transportation, health etc.
Is a deep pan 'Chicago' pizza better than a 'New York / Italian' thin and crispy?

As a fellow Brit I applaud you for the most important thing

Don't come to london what ever you do you have Arabs selling ' authentic ' Chicago deep pan and New York thin crust ( tut )