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Old 09-28-2015, 04:30 AM
 
6,439 posts, read 6,868,863 times
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If Chicago were actually declining, as it was in the 1960s and 1970s, I might take some of this seriously… A people and its government are not the same. A people can get a new government. A people and its government's credit rating are *definitely* not the same…Iceland is one of the richest countries in the world and recently defaulted on its bonds. Shall I go on?
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Old 09-28-2015, 07:09 AM
 
28,455 posts, read 84,957,533 times
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Default Maybe you are forgetting...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry Siegel View Post
If Chicago were actually declining, as it was in the 1960s and 1970s, I might take some of this seriously… A people and its government are not the same. A people can get a new government. A people and its government's credit rating are *definitely* not the same…Iceland is one of the richest countries in the world and recently defaulted on its bonds. Shall I go on?
The technical description of our sort of democracy is still one that places no special separation between those who govern and those that are governed. Sadly the erosion of rights under the kleptrocracy that typifies Chicago and Illinois probably has made you forget that.

The egalitarian systems of places like Iceland, with fine free schools for all, politicians that truly place the safety, education and health of all citizens stands in sharp contrast to the isolation that Rahm perpetuates between haves live himself and his circles if pals and rest of us, that he fleeces...
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Old 09-28-2015, 09:33 AM
 
14,802 posts, read 17,560,693 times
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Wait, is this still seriously being discussed? I thought I posted on this but for some reason my post is gone. According the US Census ACS, LA Metro has a cost of living that is 136% the national average, while Chicago Metro has a cost of living that is 116% the national average.

Just looked at some Moody's economic reports on Metro Area economies. LA Metro has a COL that is 121% of the national average and Chicago's is listed as 101% (yes 1% more expensive than the national average).

On top of the Cost of Living, Chicago Metro has a higher median household income than LA Metro.

I have no idea what Union Bank Swiss used in it's basket of goods to determine that Chicago is more expensive than LA, but it is verifiably wrong. We all know certain people will continue to bring this silly UBS report up as another example of doom and gloom, but it's frankly nonsense.
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Old 09-28-2015, 10:12 AM
 
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Wow, just noticed that the stupid Union Bank Swiss report shows Miami cheaper than Chicago. It's COL is higher than Chicago's and it's median income is even lower than LA's.
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Old 09-28-2015, 10:39 AM
 
28,455 posts, read 84,957,533 times
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Excellent analysis / summation by the STUDENT JOURNALISTS at Columbia College --

Rising city rent prices hurt students, artists - The Columbia Chronicle: Opinion

Quote:
Rent has also been rising ... [Chicago's] average cost to rent an apartment of “typical size and location” is $2,210, according to the UBS rankings. Leasing a furnished, two-bedroom apartment in Chicago costs $2,520. The average rent for an unfurnished, three-bedroom apartment was reported to be $2,960, compared to $4,320 in New York City and $2,180 in Miami.
Notice, they demonstrate good journalistic practice by checking additional sources --

Quote:
...when a city’s median rent exceeds 30 percent of its median household income, it is no longer considered affordable for millennials. According to Bloomberg, Chicago’s median rent exceeds that at 30.3 percent of a renter’s median income.
They also summarize how this news is likely to impact the kinds of audience that makes up a large part of Columbia's students
Quote:
...if rent prices continue to rise, artists and students alike will no longer be able to afford to live in these neighborhoods and could be pushed farther from The Loop.
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Old 09-28-2015, 10:39 AM
 
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Although Chicago isn't very expensive in comparison to other big US cities, it is outrageous how much rent and cost of living in America is in general, particularly when you consider how much space there is.

It's cheaper to live in world class cities like Madrid, Prague and Berlin than it is to live in Detroit.
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Old 09-28-2015, 11:01 AM
 
8,276 posts, read 11,841,506 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jwuk45 View Post
Although Chicago isn't very expensive in comparison to other big US cities, it is outrageous how much rent and cost of living in America is in general, particularly when you consider how much space there is.

It's cheaper to live in world class cities like Madrid, Prague and Berlin than it is to live in Detroit.
One again, the emphasis is on the bold statement, to the unbelieving. Chicago has to get in line, and the line is already going down the block.
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Old 09-28-2015, 11:16 AM
 
14,802 posts, read 17,560,693 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chet everett View Post
Excellent analysis / summation by the STUDENT JOURNALISTS at Columbia College --

Rising city rent prices hurt students, artists - The Columbia Chronicle: Opinion



Notice, they demonstrate good journalistic practice by checking additional sources --



They also summarize how this news is likely to impact the kinds of audience that makes up a large part of Columbia's students

Funny, the "excellent" analysis is based on the UBS report, which is demonstrably bunk. This says it all:

"Rent has also been rising throughout the city. The average cost to rent an apartment of “typical size and location” is $2,210, according to the UBS rankings. Leasing a furnished, two-bedroom apartment in Chicago costs $2,520. The average rent for an unfurnished, three-bedroom apartment was reported to be $2,960, compared to $4,320 in New York City and $2,180 in Miami."

UBS has obviously chosen some bizarre criteria for rent and other goods that adversely affects Chicago in its analysis, but it is easily dismissed by basic US census driven data.

And then there is this looking at rent burden in certain US cities:

http://furmancenter.org/files/CapOne...pe_MAY2015.pdf

Last edited by Vlajos; 09-28-2015 at 11:36 AM..
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Old 09-28-2015, 11:18 AM
 
Location: Maryland
4,671 posts, read 7,345,471 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chet everett View Post
Excellent analysis / summation by the STUDENT JOURNALISTS at Columbia College --

Rising city rent prices hurt students, artists - The Columbia Chronicle: Opinion



Notice, they demonstrate good journalistic practice by checking additional sources --



They also summarize how this news is likely to impact the kinds of audience that makes up a large part of Columbia's students
What a non-sequitur.

The Bloomberg study the author alluded to also shows that Chicago came in 7th in median rent as a percentage of median income...in the United States and of a handful of cities that meet the 50% renters cutoff, several of which are more expensive cities for overall COL than Chicago and weren't even included in the original UBS study.

The Exact Moment*Big Cities Got*Too Expensive for Millennials - Bloomberg Business

Too many news outlets took the UBS study, ran with their own interpretation, and extrapolated the results to mean "Chicago is the 7th most expensive city to live in the world."

Did the study include all the cities in the world? No.
Did the study include all the largest cities in the world? No.
Did the study only include cities from developed countries? No.
Did the study include the largest cities in the U.S.? No.

And here's the rub:

Did the study even include the most expensive cities in the U.S.? Absolutely not.

People on this forum who have actually lived in those more expensive cities in the U.S. (myself included) have been trying to point out repeatedly that those cities weren't even included in the UBS study; therefore, the conclusion that Chicago is the 7th most expensive city in the world is completely false. I cannot fathom why this point is being met with such staunchly bull-headed and frankly naive counterarguments, but there you have it.

Last edited by Maintainschaos; 09-28-2015 at 11:27 AM..
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Old 09-28-2015, 05:08 PM
 
Location: Upper West Side, Manhattan, NYC
15,331 posts, read 23,762,089 times
Reputation: 7419
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vlajos View Post
"Rent has also been rising throughout the city. The average cost to rent an apartment of “typical size and location” is $2,210, according to the UBS rankings. Leasing a furnished, two-bedroom apartment in Chicago costs $2,520. The average rent for an unfurnished, three-bedroom apartment was reported to be $2,960, compared to $4,320 in New York City and $2,180 in Miami."
That's interesting - furnished apartment buildings aren't very common in most US cities. I can't even name a single, normal building in Chicago that offers furnished apartments. They are more common overseas, so it seems that they were trying to standardize, as they should. But I'd be very surprised if they found a sample size large enough for most US cities in that particular category to warrant even using it in a study.

Regardless of that, even the granularity of what they are testing doesn't seem fine enough, or maybe they just omitted the information for some reason (which they shouldn't). This reminds me of a link another forumer here posted a month ago showing that Wrigleyville was more expensive than Streeterville and River North. Well, the issue is that it was measuring the mean apartment price regardless of how many bedrooms. Wrigleyville has more 3 and 4 bedroom apartments than Streeterville, thus driving the mean up. If they would have broken the price down by number of bedrooms, it would have shown a different story. So in that same vein, comparing one city against another when there's a mismatch in each bedroom number category can be a little misleading. If a person who is single is reading the report, they are seeing that the price of rent is ____ and they're going to probably associate it to their situation, which is a need for a studio or 1 bedroom apartment. To them, that's very misleading. Anybody who doesn't have a family (i.e. kids) to pay for is probably going to associate the price given to them with a maximum of 2 bedrooms. This is why a lot of legitimately studies break down median and mean prices by number of bedrooms instead of an overall number. If they do provide one number, then the legitimate studies will have a weighted measure.
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