Chicago Gun Laws ? (Lincoln, Virginia, Wyoming: 2015, crime rate, how much)

[jfree79]

Just wondering everyone's opinion, who thinks the gun laws in Chicago help ? What I'm asking is do you think their would be more crime / violence if law abiding non-felons could easily get a carry permit like in other places ? Or would you say less or indifferent ? Just a question .

[flamadiddle]

More legal carry equal less crime, IMO.

We can get a CCW license in Illinois these days, which includes the ability to carry in Chicago.

[Slats Grobnick]

It's pretty simple to get a conceal carry in Chicago, the state does all the work of background checks, etc.. All you have to do is fill out the application, take a course (which are designed for novices), and pay the fees.

Not sure how simple you want the requirements to be. Getting a drivers license is much harder and a much bigger pain in the ass.

[knitgirl]

Originally Posted by flamadiddle

More legal carry equal less crime, IMO.

We can get a CCW license in Illinois these days, which includes the ability to carry in Chicago.

untrue. I read a more recent article, but can't find it now. But basically gun owners like to think they could prevent crime, but they are wrong: https://www.thetrace.org/2015/06/new...violent-crime/

Here's a quote:
"According to the “More Guns, Less Crime” hypothesis, states with higher levels of gun ownership would expect to see lower crime rates in those categories. By contrast, the study found that states with the lowest rates of firearm ownership (Connecticut, Hawaii, New Jersey, Massachusetts, Rhode Island, New York, California, Florida, Illinois, and Maryland) had significantly lower rates of firearm-related assault and robbery, firearm homicide, and overall homicide.
States with the highest gun-ownership levels (Wyoming, Montana, South Dakota, Arkansas, Arizona, West Virginia, North Dakota, Idaho, Mississippi, and Alabama), meanwhile, had 6.8 times the rate of firearm assaults, 2.8 times the rate of firearm homicides, and twice the rate of overall homicides than states with the lowest gun-ownership levels."


Here's another study: Right-to-carry gun laws linked to increase in violent crime, Stanford research shows


A few years ago, I saw an episode of 20/20 that was very interesting:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ezzskoEB0Gc.

[personone]

Originally Posted by flamadiddle

More legal carry equal less crime, IMO.

We can get a CCW license in Illinois these days, which includes the ability to carry in Chicago.

I agree to an extent, but would that really help the problem we have in Chicago? The vast majority of the violent crime is happening in the really bad neighborhoods, and it's usually gang-related or young, innocent bystanders who don't see it coming. I'm not against more legal carry at all. I just don't see how it would dramatically help what's happening in neighborhoods like Englewood, Austin, south/west sides.

Neighborhoods like that need aggressive, proactive policing. That's what NYC and LA did. They had huge, visible police presence in their bad neighborhoods, and they proactively went after criminals/gang members, instead of simply responding to crime after it occurred. That and tougher sentencing would help Chicago's problems more than more legal carry, imo (which again, I'm not opposed to). Unfortunately, in the current political environment, especially in a city like Chicago, more aggressive policing won't ever happen (the Laquan McDonald incident and other police corruption doesn't help).

Since, aggressive, proactive policing won't happen, I'm all for giving more legal gun carry a try, but I don't think it will help much.

*On a side note, I'm visiting family on the east coast and was wearing my Cubs shirt around the day after the July 4 "numbers" made national headlines; when I mentioned I was from Chicago, I got endless questions about what it is like living in a city so dangerous. The general public literally thinks it's a war zone out here, lol

[personone]

Originally Posted by Slats Grobnick

It's pretty simple to get a conceal carry in Chicago, the state does all the work of background checks, etc.. All you have to do is fill out the application, take a course (which are designed for novices), and pay the fees.

Not sure how simple you want the requirements to be. Getting a drivers license is much harder and a much bigger pain in the ass.

Good points. That's what I never understand in these gun debates. I could be wrong, but the things people oppose don't seem like they would really make it harder for the average law abiding citizen to get a gun.

If this is what it currently takes to get a CCW in Chicago, how much easier can they make it and how would making it easier really impact the crime we're seeing.

[prhill]

Luckily it is easy to get a gun here as I am even thinking of getting one with the way things are going in the city. Even the good areas are getting dangerous and I see people on the news now in places like Streeterville and Lincoln and lakeview saying they are leaving the city!

[flamadiddle]

Originally Posted by Slats Grobnick

Not sure how simple you want the requirements to be. Getting a drivers license is much harder and a much bigger pain in the ass.

I think OP may be under the impression that the old law where you could not own/carry a handgun in Chicago is still in effect.

personone, IMO - CCW really isn't relevant to the Chicago crime problem since most crime here is gang vs. gang. Since the vast majority of law abiding CCW holders are not roaming through gang infested areas, CCW is a non issue for most Chicago shootings. And gang members do not obey laws or buy guns legally so enacting stricter gun control/laws does nothing to stop the gang violence. The gang violence issue is a tough problem to solve.

knitgirl, we could cherry-pick articles and studies all day long with opposing views, but in the end, I'm always going to side with "some chance" vs. "no chance".

[lepoisson]

I'm a gun nut, but I really wish the pro-gun community would drop the "more guns = less crime" mantra. It would be better to just say "gun owners own guns for self-defense, hunting, and for hobby shooting".

There are plenty of small towns in New York where few people own guns, yet the crime rate is super low. On the other hand, there are plenty of smaller towns in Mississippi where only the thugs own guns, yet the crime rate is super high.

When law abiding citizens own guns, crime isn't a concern. When thugs own guns, crime is always a concern.

Originally Posted by knitgirl

untrue. I read a more recent article, but can't find it now. But basically gun owners like to think they could prevent crime, but they are wrong: https://www.thetrace.org/2015/06/new...violent-crime/

Here's a quote:
"According to the “More Guns, Less Crime” hypothesis, states with higher levels of gun ownership would expect to see lower crime rates in those categories. By contrast, the study found that states with the lowest rates of firearm ownership (Connecticut, Hawaii, New Jersey, Massachusetts, Rhode Island, New York, California, Florida, Illinois, and Maryland) had significantly lower rates of firearm-related assault and robbery, firearm homicide, and overall homicide.
States with the highest gun-ownership levels (Wyoming, Montana, South Dakota, Arkansas, Arizona, West Virginia, North Dakota, Idaho, Mississippi, and Alabama), meanwhile, had 6.8 times the rate of firearm assaults, 2.8 times the rate of firearm homicides, and twice the rate of overall homicides than states with the lowest gun-ownership levels."


Here's another study: Right-to-carry gun laws linked to increase in violent crime, Stanford research shows


A few years ago, I saw an episode of 20/20 that was very interesting.

Some gun owners think they can prevent crime, but I certainly don't. I don't believe I have the ability to prevent anything. However, I do have the ability to prevent being killed during a home invasion or robbery.

I really wish the anti-gunners would just drop their act. They acted like Chicago would turn into Beirut after the concealed carry law passed. Well guess what? Absolutely nothing changed except now citizens have the ability to defend themselves whereas before you were at the mercy of the guy robbing you.

[BOBNCHI]

I have hear/read maybe one or two reports about someone with a CCP stop a crime/offender. The risk reward just isn't there, imho.